The engineers have been busy at FWC
- Thread starter craig333
- Start date
Pacific Northwest yetti
Expedition Medic
FWC is pretty late to make those changes....
ITTOG
Well-known member
Do others have similar actuators? I am not talking the long used four at the corners. I am talking about being a little more innovative like in the video.
tacollie
Glamper
Truama heating and under bed storage in a slide are big improvements. Looks like they are still using aluminum framing and crappy insulation. If they don't increase their price to much it may be worth it. If they start to get in the OEV/Supertramp range it's a hard pass imo.
I still prefer a manual opening camper.
I still prefer a manual opening camper.
Pacific Northwest yetti
Expedition Medic
I meant in general. And much needed changes. The Lithium, wire size matched to loads. Victron, Trauma, DC/DC that works with smart alternators, etc.
They had not made any innovative changes in almost 30 years. FWC is probably the only ones to use the electric actuators in that specific pattern. As far as “middle out”.
They had not made any innovative changes in almost 30 years. FWC is probably the only ones to use the electric actuators in that specific pattern. As far as “middle out”.
Pacific Northwest yetti
Expedition Medic
Probably not enough: But they did not specify where it was upgraded.
One of their known issues, was the gauge coming from the starting battery, and the ACR. The voltage drop through it combined with the smart alternators caused the ACR’s to constantly cycle and not charge. If that is what they meant, I am pretty sure 6awg minimum is needed. And 4awg is better. They usually had 10awg in the roof for solar, but it was smaller when crimped to the SAE port on the roof as that pigtail was not 10awg.
Edit* Its good to see some changes. As other mfgrs have stepped up the game. There is no denying FWC place in history, and building and growing the market.
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ITTOG
Well-known member
Cool, I have never heard of the speaker stand mod.
Sparse Gray Hackle
Geezer
They look nice, but no thanks.
Late but they had to do it. They've been dragging on and using 30 year old technology forever now. The lithium upgrades and underbed storage is a nice upgrade. The lifting roof actuators is nice as well but looks kinda janky to me. At least the internal one isn't too expensive. Truma and the roof top AC are good upgrades. I do find it interesting that they went with the most expensive AC options out there for a camper that still seeks the value proposition. Redarc is good is a nice system but I've varying limitations in its ability to charge from solar limited to 30A. Victron would have been the better system here.
All-in-all, these are much needed upgrades. It still doesn't make up for their subpar aluminum frame, wood and laminate construction. Their mounting system with the turnbuckles is as ghetto as I've seen. Seems like they went with robust heat and AC upgrades so they can potentially mask their inherent design and construction flaws but who knows if that is enough for true 4 season camping.
I do think this is where FWC has a bit of an advantage. The camper can be as minimal or built up as you want. Their prices are still cheaper than an OEV but you really have to be consciousness about how much you throw on there. Because you're right, with enough upgrades you're a stones throw away from an OEV or ST camper.
Transit720
Member
Agreed. Nice to see 4WC modernize, but their electric roof lift systems don't impress me much.
The *exterior* actuators are not vertically-mounted so they "push" inefficiently, causing wear and tear and consuming more power than necessary. The design appears to still require the assistance of the non-electric struts (in the rear) to lift the roof. And the "scissors" track/guide which gets added to the camper interior only adds more complexity to the system, not to mention the space it consumes, while looking like a garage door system. I'm guessing the "scissors" hardware is necessary as a safety "lock out" because the exterior actuators cannot be trusted to hold the weight of the lifted roof.
The *internal* actuator is, in some ways, superior to the exterior, esp if inexpensive. At least the internal actuator pushes (mostly) vertically. However, according to the video, you've got to separately lift the back and the front of the camper, which requires a repositioning of the single internal actuator. I suppose repositioning is not not that big of a deal, if the price is right. But, does the interior actuator need to be left in "support" position while camping, or can it be tucked away???
Overall, not even close to the OEV or Supertramp solutions, IMO. But, at the right price, these solutions could be viable, esp the interior option.
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robgendreau
Explorer
Funny, I like them BECAUSE of the thirty year tech.
But even I finally caved and went lithium.
I think the "upgrades" add like say 200 lbs to the Hawk slide in build vs 1000 before. Maybe beefier roof, etc, even without the AC or under bed storage (which may add height). Both things I wouldn't want. But obviously others do. Add flush mount stoves, etc to things I'm glad I could avoid. The new heater might prove to be better; we'll see.
In reading some other boards as many are beefing about the new stuff and cost and weight increases as people here beefing they've been late to the table. But ExPo skews gear-forward, other places more retro-budget. I can see why that must drive manufacturers nuts. I saw the same phenomenon with Sportsmobile. But maybe the change at FWC is because the minimalists are now going with Project Ms, and the leisure elderlies with the more plush setups.
The internal lift looks fiddly compared to some more simple solutions, like air drive speaker poles or drill driven ones. One can find similar sized linear actuators on ebay for about $250; FWC charges $850, probably because it's a small batch thing that's not worth their time since so many would DIY instead. It doesn't need to be place once the lid is lifted, and stows in the ceiling.
But even I finally caved and went lithium.
I think the "upgrades" add like say 200 lbs to the Hawk slide in build vs 1000 before. Maybe beefier roof, etc, even without the AC or under bed storage (which may add height). Both things I wouldn't want. But obviously others do. Add flush mount stoves, etc to things I'm glad I could avoid. The new heater might prove to be better; we'll see.
In reading some other boards as many are beefing about the new stuff and cost and weight increases as people here beefing they've been late to the table. But ExPo skews gear-forward, other places more retro-budget. I can see why that must drive manufacturers nuts. I saw the same phenomenon with Sportsmobile. But maybe the change at FWC is because the minimalists are now going with Project Ms, and the leisure elderlies with the more plush setups.
The internal lift looks fiddly compared to some more simple solutions, like air drive speaker poles or drill driven ones. One can find similar sized linear actuators on ebay for about $250; FWC charges $850, probably because it's a small batch thing that's not worth their time since so many would DIY instead. It doesn't need to be place once the lid is lifted, and stows in the ceiling.
DirtWhiskey
Western Dirt Rat
$60k for a well outfitted FWC is just obscene.