I am a specialized fan, but seeing their prices now compared to when I bought mine, NOPE! I found bikes direct and I'm going to be ordering a yaffle of bikes from them. 2 fat bikes, 2 FS MTB, a triathalon bike, and hopfully a couple of bikes for my boy if they have 24"rs.
After sizing up specialized's prices.....MOTOBECANE it is!
- Thread starter kojackJKU
- Start date
Christophe Noel
Expedition Leader
Be cautious and don't just get lured in my promises of high level components for low MSRP. Motobecane bikes can be, and often are super sketchy. I've scene more than a few fail. One was a carbon fiber frame the broke in half at the top tube revealing the inner layers of the carbon layup, which were made not of carbon, but of....wait for it....rice paper. Good luck with that one.
Another local here ordered a titanium MB with the rear wheel so far off center the tire rubbed right out of the box. Another friend of mine has owned our local shop for 40 years and he showed me a MB tri bike which must have had a quarter pound of blasting media rattling around in the frame. Sealed in there for good, btw.
Then there are the $5 stems, $10 seats, mystery brand rims, hubs, and spokes. But, they know that people will see XTR and $XXXX price tags and think, "WHAT A VALUE."
Trust me, you get exactly what you pay for. Exactly what you pay for.
Another local here ordered a titanium MB with the rear wheel so far off center the tire rubbed right out of the box. Another friend of mine has owned our local shop for 40 years and he showed me a MB tri bike which must have had a quarter pound of blasting media rattling around in the frame. Sealed in there for good, btw.
Then there are the $5 stems, $10 seats, mystery brand rims, hubs, and spokes. But, they know that people will see XTR and $XXXX price tags and think, "WHAT A VALUE."
Trust me, you get exactly what you pay for. Exactly what you pay for.
Christophe Noel
Expedition Leader
One last thing. They have been routinely busted for putting fabricated magazine review quotes on their web pages, and I see they're at it again. I'm not saying Bikes Direct are complete charlatans, but they fool a lot of people. Again, don't think you're getting anything other than exactly what you're paying for. You can't take a $700 throw two XTR derailleurs on it, call it and "XTR bike," and then say, "Compare to Specialized, Trek, Cannondale at $6,000."
The better solution. Don't get sucked into MB. Wait for sales, sales always happen, I guarantee you. Then buy a proper bike, with proper support behind it, for 15-25% below MSRP.
Much smarter investiment.
The better solution. Don't get sucked into MB. Wait for sales, sales always happen, I guarantee you. Then buy a proper bike, with proper support behind it, for 15-25% below MSRP.
Much smarter investiment.
Oh, I have been talking to many owners of them and they really enjoy their MB's.....I have read some are crappy but there are some (the ones I am looking at), seem to have good "INDEPENDANT" reviews...people who own them. not magazine reviews or reviews on their site.
Christophe Noel
Expedition Leader
Sale bikes are pretty easy to find, but keep in mind it's july, the meat of the selling season. New models start arriving in a few months. I spent much of my life working in bike shops. Never, ever, did I work in a shop that didn't have bikes to blow out at end of season.
But my claim stands. Price these bikes out part by part, including all of the cheap crap they bolt to them, and they are not deals. And don't get hung on my XTR comment. The same pricing slight of hand they do at the XTR level extends all the way down the range. Bikes Direct was designed to get suckers to think their bikes are a bargain. You've been suckered, my friend.
well, no I haven't. I never bought one yet. but I know the "cheap parts" they are bolting on to them have WTB, Ritchey etc onto them. plus rockshock shocks and forks. I don't know if they changed...but there are no NON branded items on the bikes I have been looking at.
DaveInDenver
Middle Income Semi-Redneck
There is truth in seeing past the name on the downtube. You are paying for a name so you can get good deals by not buying from the major brands. One thing to know is the brand Motobecane is owned by bikesdirect.com (along with Mercier, another famous French cycling brand). So part of the saving comes from distribution (or lack there-of to local shops) and being a house brand they skip at least one level of markup.
Also, the fact is there aren't actually that many factories in Asia that make most bike frames and some components. A majority stake of Specialized is owned by Merida in Taiwan, which one of the larger OEM for other brands along with Kinesis, Giant, Ideal, etc. AFAIK Motobecane bikes are made by Kinesis in Taiwan.
Coming from the same factory does *not* mean it is automatically the same bike. An OEM will make as good or poor of a bike as they are paid to do. The contracting company has a target price, performance, quality specification. If that price doesn't allow higher end material or sufficient QC it's no sweat off the OEM's nose since it's not their name on the warranty. Santa Cruz bikes, which are high quality, are also made by Kinesis (at one time in Portland but Santa Cruz frames are made overseas now). No one seriously familiar with the bike industry will claim a Motobecane is the same final product as a Santa Cruz. The quality of the frames are different but the total package is on the shop floor is completely different leagues.
It's also true that a 2nd tier brand has different cost and profit requirements so you can get a bike that costs something less than a major brand while being just as good or better. But it's also just as true that a brand like Specialized has a heavy burden in the reputation of its name. That's all it really has since most companies don't own much physical production capacity so their value is in marketing. Motobecane is just a name and bikesdirect.com will find other well known cycling brands if Motobecane is ruined. It's the same case with Schwinn, GT, Diamondback, Bianchi, Fuji. Just names owned by investment groups.
Personally, I agree with Christophe about Motobecane. They have slipped significantly in quality. Doesn't mean I wouldn't buy one or recommend them to someone who had a budget because some models are in fact high value. OTOH Specialized makes both high and low end bikes and their low end bikes aren't the same quality either. So the "You get what you pay for" statement is about as universally true as anything. A $700 Motobecane is probably going to be about as bad/good any other $700 bike out there regardless of the name on it. The main reason I'd stick with Specialized (as an example, I wouldn't support Specialized for other reasons) is after sale and warranty support. That's what you're paying for, having someone to call if you have a problem.
Also, the fact is there aren't actually that many factories in Asia that make most bike frames and some components. A majority stake of Specialized is owned by Merida in Taiwan, which one of the larger OEM for other brands along with Kinesis, Giant, Ideal, etc. AFAIK Motobecane bikes are made by Kinesis in Taiwan.
Coming from the same factory does *not* mean it is automatically the same bike. An OEM will make as good or poor of a bike as they are paid to do. The contracting company has a target price, performance, quality specification. If that price doesn't allow higher end material or sufficient QC it's no sweat off the OEM's nose since it's not their name on the warranty. Santa Cruz bikes, which are high quality, are also made by Kinesis (at one time in Portland but Santa Cruz frames are made overseas now). No one seriously familiar with the bike industry will claim a Motobecane is the same final product as a Santa Cruz. The quality of the frames are different but the total package is on the shop floor is completely different leagues.
It's also true that a 2nd tier brand has different cost and profit requirements so you can get a bike that costs something less than a major brand while being just as good or better. But it's also just as true that a brand like Specialized has a heavy burden in the reputation of its name. That's all it really has since most companies don't own much physical production capacity so their value is in marketing. Motobecane is just a name and bikesdirect.com will find other well known cycling brands if Motobecane is ruined. It's the same case with Schwinn, GT, Diamondback, Bianchi, Fuji. Just names owned by investment groups.
Personally, I agree with Christophe about Motobecane. They have slipped significantly in quality. Doesn't mean I wouldn't buy one or recommend them to someone who had a budget because some models are in fact high value. OTOH Specialized makes both high and low end bikes and their low end bikes aren't the same quality either. So the "You get what you pay for" statement is about as universally true as anything. A $700 Motobecane is probably going to be about as bad/good any other $700 bike out there regardless of the name on it. The main reason I'd stick with Specialized (as an example, I wouldn't support Specialized for other reasons) is after sale and warranty support. That's what you're paying for, having someone to call if you have a problem.
Last edited:
Christophe Noel
Expedition Leader
We have several ExPo members with extensive experience in bicycle manufacturing in Asia and at home, but I doubt they will chime in, and I think they probably shouldn't. However, we've had these discussions in depth. If a brand wants to ask a manufacturer to produce a junk frame worth a few bucks right next to a fancy frame with high brand value, they'll gladly do it. Exactly as Dave said above.
It wasn't that long ago when I worked in a bike shop and Bikes Direct bikes were simply awful. For a while people would buy one of their upper end bikes for the parts kits, then lob the frame in a dumpster out back as that's about the value they carried.
As Dave also said, and I wholly agree, there's no reason for any of us to say you should or shouldn't buy a Bikes Direct bike, but it would be erroneous to think they are the exceptional value they work so hard to pretend to be. Their website is splashed with flashy discount numbers as it's the ONLY way they have to drive business. Break down the bikes by component, and you'll find they're not the deals they appear to be, particularly when you fold in the fact the frames are not just basic, they're sometimes super sketchy.
Bikes Direct has done well selling to a very targeted market. Those are the buyers just savvy enough to know how to shop for parts specs and think they know how to compare one XT bike to the next. To the spec hunter, they look like values. Trickery. That's all it is.
It wasn't that long ago when I worked in a bike shop and Bikes Direct bikes were simply awful. For a while people would buy one of their upper end bikes for the parts kits, then lob the frame in a dumpster out back as that's about the value they carried.
As Dave also said, and I wholly agree, there's no reason for any of us to say you should or shouldn't buy a Bikes Direct bike, but it would be erroneous to think they are the exceptional value they work so hard to pretend to be. Their website is splashed with flashy discount numbers as it's the ONLY way they have to drive business. Break down the bikes by component, and you'll find they're not the deals they appear to be, particularly when you fold in the fact the frames are not just basic, they're sometimes super sketchy.
Bikes Direct has done well selling to a very targeted market. Those are the buyers just savvy enough to know how to shop for parts specs and think they know how to compare one XT bike to the next. To the spec hunter, they look like values. Trickery. That's all it is.
Christophe Noel
Expedition Leader
On a side note - in 1988 I worked in a bike shop and spent the whole summer saving for a Dura Ace built Kestrel 4000. Man, was that thing a beauty and about as high tech as anything ever to roll on two wheels. To see Kestrel now sold by Bikes Direct just breaks my heart. Same for the Motobecane name, actually. So sad.
Yep. Just as heartbreaking as it is to see the price of 12000 dollars for a bicycle from the "good" manufacturers. And that's not even an E-bike from specialized...just the epic 29r. my rockhopper a1fs comp was 2599 in 94. I worked all winter pumping gas to buy it. It had STX components on it....guess what...within 2 months, the frame failed on that bike too. The LBS I bought it off of was none to helpful either, so I don't see the "value" in buying brand name bikes, that the frames will fail too. At least with a motobecane, if the frame magically fails, my money went into higher group parts to hang on a new frame. I had to fight Specialized, the LBS for 3 months to get my frame replaced. split the headtube in half. I blame it on the ****ty rockshocks q5s that came on it. They locked up causing stress through the headtube. Plus on my new frame, there is another guesset welded into where the top tube and the head tube join. So, ANY frame can fail, ANY bike can be a DUD, I refuse to pay MENTAL prices for something essentially the same. I will take my chances and see what happens. and I will totally let you know Either way how they are! Keep up to date on this issue. if they snap in half after one ride, I will say buddy! you were right. buy a new frame and go on.....BUUUUUTTTTT if they are really good....I will voice that opinion as well!
FYI my rockhopper was a 95 model blue frame with gold lettering, and now I have the 96 model with silver frame and black/red lettering.
FYI my rockhopper was a 95 model blue frame with gold lettering, and now I have the 96 model with silver frame and black/red lettering.
Last edited:
I compare this to the snow peak addiction. I could pay 150 dollars for a titanium flask, or buy one for 9.99 at Walmart....does the same job, just as durable, the Walmart one does not have pretty snow peak lettering on it, and is probably an oz. heavier. But, as you know here....some people NEED their snow peak. love those 70 dollar chopsticks. a real bargain!
Christophe Noel
Expedition Leader
Keep in mind, those bikes are built in tiny numbers and only as a means of establishing the direction of a brand's innovation and place within the competitive ranks of innovation. One of my friends is in production for a major brand and said they made fewer than 100 units of their top tier bike last season. I think we all know the point of diminishing returns is waaaaaay lower. Also keep in mind, some people like to own the top model just because it's the top model. That's fine as most of those people know they're not really buying performance, just cachet.
And just because one brand offers a $12,000 bike, that should not imply their $500 bike is a crap value.
NO....that's not what I am getting at either. If I could get a speicalized camber for 1500 bucks....DONE! all I have seen are 3000 and above around here. same with their fat bike....if I can get one for 1000.....DONE. I just don't see it happening anywhere I can see! Same with Rocky mountain or Norco. All of which their full suspension trail bikes are 3000 bucks or better. all of their fat bikes are well over 2k.
What I am getting at, is that when I bought my specialized...the price of the top model fully suspended bike was around 4500 bucks Canadian....INFLATION never went crazy that bad....where that 4500 dollar bike, now costs 12k.....I do believe that there is a "BRAND inflation" in effect now. Hell a fully tricked Yeti ARC was only 5k with the best of EVERYTHING!
What I am getting at, is that when I bought my specialized...the price of the top model fully suspended bike was around 4500 bucks Canadian....INFLATION never went crazy that bad....where that 4500 dollar bike, now costs 12k.....I do believe that there is a "BRAND inflation" in effect now. Hell a fully tricked Yeti ARC was only 5k with the best of EVERYTHING!