Dexter torsion axle or Timbren Axle-less
- Thread starter cr500taco
- Start date
If your trailer has a Dexter TorFlex, it most likely was built around that axle. Meaning the axle is part of the frame strength. The span between the two main runners, would be open with the Timbren. Most likely would recommend you put a cross member there if you remove the Dexter Tor Flex. Also depends on the drop on the Dexter. If it does not have a downward angle, you can change it to one that does.
I have never seen any tests on the Timbren, most likely because they are relatively new. The Dexter axle has been built for many years, and currently used on all new military trailers. I have drug my trailer on everything in the southwest but the Rubicon. I have never hit the axle on any thing, or at least there are no marks on it!
I personally think you have the best axle available for off road use.
I have never seen any tests on the Timbren, most likely because they are relatively new. The Dexter axle has been built for many years, and currently used on all new military trailers. I have drug my trailer on everything in the southwest but the Rubicon. I have never hit the axle on any thing, or at least there are no marks on it!
I personally think you have the best axle available for off road use.
SamM
Adventurer
My 2011 Schutt Industries LTT-HC military trailer has a 4200# Dexter TorFlex axle and was designed to be pulled by a military M998 HMMWV. I think this axle is well made, reliable and very rugged. As skersfan says, it's the best axle for off-road use and I do not doubt that. With all that said, I still plan to replace my axle with a Timbren suspension. The TorFlex is just too heavy and much too wide for my trailer and Jeep. This trailer is over 80" wide and will not match the track width of the Jeep as is. If my tow rig was an H1 Hummer, I'd keep the Dexter axle. I've considered narrowing the TorFlex but that would require redesigning the trailer and axle mounts. Removing the TorFlex will drop a great deal of weight from my trailer, effectively making it work with my Jeep Sahara MOAB. The Timbren suspension is perfect for what I have planned. I'll be purchasing the Timbren 2000# heavy-duty units that use the 3500# parts. These parts are overkill for my 1000# trailer and should work great. If I kept the TorFlex it would still need new 5"x5" hubs and electric brakes, so the difference between keeping the TorFlex axle and buying the new Timbren suspension is only $500.
The bottom picture shows just how much wider the Schutt trailer is, compared to the MOAB.
SamM
The bottom picture shows just how much wider the Schutt trailer is, compared to the MOAB.
SamM
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Thanks guys for the feedback. Figured the Timbrens suspension are fairly new. Haven't found much online about them. My Dexter axle torsions are shot. I contacted Dexter about what it would take to fix it. They said the axle beam needs to be replaced. I figured, since it needs to be replaced and I want to swap out the surge brakes to electric brakes along with swapping out the 8" wheels to 13" or bigger wheels, I would just replace the whole thing. Looks like, I'll be sticking with the torsion axle, since it will be less work.
Just be sure you get the measurements right. The ones between the main frame and the hub face. Also look at the drop, if it is even or just slightly down, you can go another step that will give you plenty of clearance.
The most important thing for a serious off road trailer on a Tor Flex is getting the right weight axle. Do not over build the torsion axle. Meaning if the trailer is going to weigh 2000 pounds get a 2000 pound rated axle. Do not put a 3500 pound axle under it for any reason. You can order all the way down to 1800 with electric brakes, 3500 pound bearings and set up. To much and the trailer will bounce and destroy itself.
The most important thing for a serious off road trailer on a Tor Flex is getting the right weight axle. Do not over build the torsion axle. Meaning if the trailer is going to weigh 2000 pounds get a 2000 pound rated axle. Do not put a 3500 pound axle under it for any reason. You can order all the way down to 1800 with electric brakes, 3500 pound bearings and set up. To much and the trailer will bounce and destroy itself.
Thanks guys, I just crawled under the trailer today to look at the axle and saw that the axle is bolted right to the frame and came to the conclusion that the drop and bigger tires will give it more clearance. The axle looks to be only a couple of inches, so I wouldn't be gaining much to worry about with the Timbren suspension.
Also, Skersfan. You are right about the 3500Lb axle. I go to thinking about it and realized that a heavier rated axle will probably be too much for it. I'll look at the trailer weight and go from there.
Also, Skersfan. You are right about the 3500Lb axle. I go to thinking about it and realized that a heavier rated axle will probably be too much for it. I'll look at the trailer weight and go from there.
I have used the Dexter Tor Flex for over 25 years on all types of trailers. They really work well, help with the center of gravity and are very hard to hit. Normally the axle is bolted to a skid that is either welded or bolted to the main frame. I weld mine to the frame and then bolt to the bracket.
SamM
Adventurer
cr500taco,
Check the eTrailer website. They sell Timbren parts at a small discount over most places. You may also find some Dexter parts there as the sell just about everything.
Just to clarify on my build. The trailer will weigh around 1000# and will carry about 1000# of gear and equipment. Basically, my Jeep MOAB will be kept stock and the trailer will carry everything, plus luggage. I will be using Dexter electric brakes on the trailer.
SamM
Check the eTrailer website. They sell Timbren parts at a small discount over most places. You may also find some Dexter parts there as the sell just about everything.
Just to clarify on my build. The trailer will weigh around 1000# and will carry about 1000# of gear and equipment. Basically, my Jeep MOAB will be kept stock and the trailer will carry everything, plus luggage. I will be using Dexter electric brakes on the trailer.
SamM
Martyn
Supporting Sponsor, Overland Certified OC0018
We have used Timbren suspensions on some the Military Air Portable trailers we have built, as well as on our Sportsman line of trailers. It's a good well designed suspension, and provides a lot of clearance. Best suited for fire roads than extreme conditions, unless you can get some suspension out of the tires. This is what occurred with the Air Portables, they had large ATV tires fitted that were designed to be run at low pressure.
Timbren units can be repaired in the field if you have the spare parts, torsion axles can not be repaired.
AT is not a big fan of torsion axles. We have have seen numerous failures, none of which are repairable in the field. The pictures below are from a trailer we recently rescued from I17. All the failures have been identical
Attached are some pictures of a Dexter Torsion axle that completely failed on one side.
You can see the arm is angled upward instead of being angled down.
The picture above shows the "good" side of the axle with the arm pointing downward
As you can see from the above pictures the rubber inserts have failed and are starting to come out of the axle tube.
The above picture shows the axle tube/drop arm on the "good" side of the axle, no gap, no rubber
Timbren units can be repaired in the field if you have the spare parts, torsion axles can not be repaired.
AT is not a big fan of torsion axles. We have have seen numerous failures, none of which are repairable in the field. The pictures below are from a trailer we recently rescued from I17. All the failures have been identical
Attached are some pictures of a Dexter Torsion axle that completely failed on one side.
You can see the arm is angled upward instead of being angled down.
The picture above shows the "good" side of the axle with the arm pointing downward
As you can see from the above pictures the rubber inserts have failed and are starting to come out of the axle tube.
The above picture shows the axle tube/drop arm on the "good" side of the axle, no gap, no rubber
Yep, I have tried to tow my trailer at the sand dunes with my 4WD Tacoma and it was like pulling a sled. Had to have my friend with a 4WD Chevy diesel pull the trailer in the dunes.
That's pretty much how my arms are now. The reason why I am replacing the axle. Dexter said it mainly is caused by overloading the suspension. Which is what I haven't done, but could have been done before I bought it (bought the trailer used).
It seems according to the specs that the Dexter torflex has 3" of travel, if I understood their diagram, correctly and the Timbren has 4" of travel.
Thanks for the info.
Martyn
Supporting Sponsor, Overland Certified OC0018
I don't think you are going to get 4" of travel out of the Timbren suspension. The rubber pucks are not going to compress that much. It's a stiff suspension even if the axle is derated.
I was wondering if it would take a lot to compress them.
XVENTURE TRAILERS
Supporting Sponsor - XVENTURE Trailers
Torsion Axles are hands down the most reliable and durable independent suspension trailer axil available. That's why we use them for the vast majority of light tactical military trailers. There's a couple different flavors of Torsion Axil, most with rubber and for heavier applications with steel internal torsion cords. The trick to get this design to perform optimally for civilian use is to ensure you are at least at 75% of the axils capacity.
What we see more times than not in the civilian market is that users rarely load more than 1200lbs of cargo into their trailer. Tents, Awning, Fridges, ATV's (if you have an XVENTURE), Photographic Equipment, Food, Cooking Gear, etc., are all fairly light. 1000lbs of cargo is quite a lot of stuff.
The trailer itself is usually around 800-1200lbs empty, which brings the total GVW to 1800-2200 LBS fully packed. So even with a 3200lb axil the total payload is barely over 50% of the axil rating.
Most of the Schutt Industries trailers acquired from liquidators are using the tried and true 4200LB axil with monster heavy duty shocks. Do the math and you will see that in a stock configuration that's just way too much axil for most consumer applications. So of course the trailer ends up handling like a train on rails with very stiff dampening.
While it's rare you'd ever bottom out, the ride is less than desirable and can actually be hard on the payload. It's also important to note that our LTT chassis' are engineered to handle upwards of 7000lbs of payload. Way way way over the limits of even the 4200 LB axils. The published trailer GVW ratings are only in alignment with the axils we install to meet the conservative published ratings established through Aberdeen Proving Grounds.
That said, installing a Torsion axil rated at 2700 lbs-ish is a much better choice for non-commercial use as you want a smoother ride. Again, you are shooting for a trailer GVW of 2300-2500 LBS for most Overland Applications. If I am after a performance combination of, the most reliable, maintenance free, cost effective, best performing independent suspension for a trailer Torsion Axils are where its at.
Thanks,
Mark
What we see more times than not in the civilian market is that users rarely load more than 1200lbs of cargo into their trailer. Tents, Awning, Fridges, ATV's (if you have an XVENTURE), Photographic Equipment, Food, Cooking Gear, etc., are all fairly light. 1000lbs of cargo is quite a lot of stuff.
The trailer itself is usually around 800-1200lbs empty, which brings the total GVW to 1800-2200 LBS fully packed. So even with a 3200lb axil the total payload is barely over 50% of the axil rating.
Most of the Schutt Industries trailers acquired from liquidators are using the tried and true 4200LB axil with monster heavy duty shocks. Do the math and you will see that in a stock configuration that's just way too much axil for most consumer applications. So of course the trailer ends up handling like a train on rails with very stiff dampening.
While it's rare you'd ever bottom out, the ride is less than desirable and can actually be hard on the payload. It's also important to note that our LTT chassis' are engineered to handle upwards of 7000lbs of payload. Way way way over the limits of even the 4200 LB axils. The published trailer GVW ratings are only in alignment with the axils we install to meet the conservative published ratings established through Aberdeen Proving Grounds.
That said, installing a Torsion axil rated at 2700 lbs-ish is a much better choice for non-commercial use as you want a smoother ride. Again, you are shooting for a trailer GVW of 2300-2500 LBS for most Overland Applications. If I am after a performance combination of, the most reliable, maintenance free, cost effective, best performing independent suspension for a trailer Torsion Axils are where its at.
Thanks,
Mark
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