I need an entry level AR 15 education

[4runnerteq]

Been shopping ARs for a couple months. My budget is an entry level gun. Looked at DPMS, Del-ton, Ruger all in person, and reviews on Smith & Wesson H&P Sport. Best I can tell, these rifles in this range seem to be pretty much the same. The forums I have looked at are so full of flamers on why this gun is a piece of crap or that gun is. And I have found that each one has its own favorite to whatever particular brand and EVERYTHING else is a POS. Looking for real world experience with the guns listed. Yes, I know everyone says for a little more money you can get this or that other brand or widget. Anything you buy fits that description, whether a Toyota, a Jeep, or a Rover. The guns above are in my price range, especially as I may purchase 3. One for self and each of my boys. They will be used for spending shooting time together with them and or friends. And or SHTF protection. All I want going in is iron sights. Any add ons will be way down the road. What I feel and think I have seen is that in this entry level range, one is about the same as the other. Please keep comments to your experience with these. Im leaning toward the Del-ton $495 with front sight, Ruger is $548 with front & rear sight. Not wild about the DPMS $489 with no sights. The SW in my area seems to be $625 to $699. Thanks all

 

[ssc45]

I have no experience with the Ruger. Regarding the Del-ton, I have run an upper and it has been good to go.I have friends who have run DT's with positive results. I have built my share of AR's and source parts for some builds. Keep in mind that many of the AR manufacturers source their parts from mostly the same people. There are upper tier that make their own parts in house.( Or have parts made to a different standard and test protocol.) In my opinion, Del-ton makes a decent AR for the price. For just plinking or getting familiar with the platform I think it is a good choice. For hard core use/life on the line, I have others that I would trust in those circumstances and I would not include Del-ton. I have seen a few more issues with DPMS then I am comfortable with. This includes some out of spec parts and quality control issues in the build. Maybe I have just been around more DPMS rifles, but between DT and DPMS, I would go DT. My experience with S&W is a bit limited, but I consider them good to go and would be comfortable in saying they will serve you well pursuant to your intended use. As an aside, though I have no personal experience myself, I hear that DT has great customer service. Wish I could have given you better information.

Cheers, Steve

 

[4runnerteq]

Good info. Thanks

 

[robert]

I'd pretty much echo the above but of the three you mentioned I'd go with the Ruger or the S&W. You can also get Palmetto State Armory guns for decent prices, especially when they have sales. It's easy to buy the halves or even parts and put them together yourself. Look for the cold hammer forged barrels (FN made) and avoid the PTAC and Freedom series of parts.

Example of one of the PSA uppers with an FN barrel and 7075 uppers: http://palmettostatearmory.com/index.php/catalog/product/view/id/8555/category/4220/ They're also having a good sale on D&H mags right now: http://palmettostatearmory.com/index.php/catalog/product/view/id/1239/

Disclaimer, I have no interest in PSA other than they are a SC owned company and FN is also in SC. I also just ordered more mags from them after seeing that price. :sombrero:

 

[Ray_G]

I think Steve and Robert's perspectives are pretty much on. What I've seen as I build AR's is that the difference between companies/parts is very relative indeed across a wide spectrum of the flooded AR market. As Steve alluded to most companies are actually buying the same parts perhaps with different roll marks on large components but by and large they are the same. Of your choices I'd lean toward DT or Ruger, but that's just some modicum of brand loyalty, anecdotal observation, and gut instinct.

It's also worth pointing out that if you're going to shoot irons for awhile (and I applaud this but the USMC bias in me seeps out there) I'd suggest looking for either stand alone A2 sights or a carrying handle to attach to your flattops. One of the things that grates me personally is seeing folks use magpul and other BUIS as primary sights. By definition they are 'back up' iron sights and by and large lack the durability and precision you can get from fixed rear sights.

Robert's points about using components may also save you some $$$, Labor day would have been a good time to buy but if you're not in a hurry the sales come back around again. I've had good experiences with PSA, MAS Defense, and SAA. Less so with Model 1.

r-
Ray

 

[fike]

I once owned an M1 Carbine made by Underwood....a typewriter company. It shot great. The M16/AR15 receiver is very evolved, and differences in the core rifle between manufacturers will be minimal.

 

[seanpistol]

One of my AR-obsessed friends pointed me towards Palmetto State Armory years ago. They constantly have something on sale for a massive discount and I and assembled a high quality AR-15 for around $600. Granted, my buddy and I took our M-16s apart a thousand times while at basic training together, but there isn't much to it.

 

[P2W]

My first AR was built from a DPMS stripped lower & assembled upper.
Are you specifically looking for a new gun?
There were a crapton of ARs purchased in the last "run on the gun shops" that are now coming up for sale as used guns with less than 500rd through them. (some folks thought they were black gold)
Most all new AR uppers are flattop A3's however there are fixed carry handle uppers out there, stick with a flattop because that will give you the best flexibility when mounting optics.
DPMS sells a Nat Match rear sight for the A3.

http://www.midwayusa.com/product/87...ght-ar-15-flat-top-matte?cm_vc=ProductFinding

 

[Longrange308]

S&W, Ruger and Del-ton would be good to go, in that order in my opinion. I have had too many issues with out of spec DPMS parts (mostly lower fire control group pins) that caused way too many issues for me to ever be comfortable buying one of their in house built guns.

I also echo the comments about Palmetto, they have very decent stuff at huge discounts. I have used many of their lower parts kits with great success as well as some of the assembled uppers they have sold in the past.

 

[screwball48]

One thing to keep in mind with the AR platform is that if it does not work or breaks there are more parts available for them than they are for a jeep. One recommendation is to buy a rifle with a flat top upper. This will allow you to use either folding iron sights, a removable carry handle, or electronic/magnified optics.


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[robert]

One thing to keep in mind with the AR platform is that if it does not work or breaks there are more parts available for them than they are for a jeep. One recommendation is to buy a rifle with a flat top upper. This will allow you to use either folding iron sights, a removable carry handle, or electronic/magnified optics.

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One of the funnier quotes I've heard was someone described the AR as "Barbie for men". With a few exceptions they're basically plug and play and with the huge amount of folks selling them and parts you can customize to your hearts content.

I'm a fan of fixed sights also; I like the A2 front sight even on guns that have a BUIS for the rear. In a modular set of sights I really like the Daniel Defense A1.5- you can buy them as a fr/rr set and save a bit over buying them individually).

Be sure you budget for things like cleaning accessories and a few tools, slings, and lots of magazines. A flashlight is also a good idea on a defensive weapon.

 

[P2W]

Be sure you budget for things like cleaning accessories and a few tools, slings, and lots of magazines. A flashlight is also a good idea on a defensive weapon.

Magazines,.. definitely buy magazines!
Minimum 6 per rifle, Lancer AWF or Magpul PMags, I prefer Lancer, the cheap GI mags are just that, cheap, don't waste your time.
Get a UpLULA speed loader, one of the simplest, easiest to use, wish you had invented it tools in my ruck.

http://www.maglula.com/product/m-16-ar-15-lula-5-56-223/

 

[4runnerteq]

This is so much better that the threads I saw on the gun forums.

 

[screwball48]

Start with the gun and one to two mags. Then make a trip back to the store once or twice a month and buy a mag and one/two boxes of ammo each trip. The guys behind the counter will get to know you better this way and may be more willing to point you towards a deal in the future. Even small purchases will help to make you a "regular".


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[4runnerteq]

Bout made up my mind to go with the Ruger. Now to save and wait on a sale.