NPR 4wd conversion and camper build thread.

[javajoe79]

So I got the steering box from the donor npr mounted today. I am trying to figure out how to convert the front to back steering motion to side to side motion to steer the dana 60. I am currently leaning towards a fabricated bell crank utilizing a cartridge bearing type wheel hub from a corvette. Basically plate steel bolted to the hub with two pivot points at 90* from each other. Any ideas or possibly an off the shelf component I could use?

 

[DzlToy]

I asked this question in the Rebel thread and from the images posted, it appears there was a bellcrank used, but there were no details provided.

Matt has his figured out for the Chevy 60 he is using according to a conversation we had back in the late summer, but I have not been to his shop in quite some time, so I have not seen it completed.

I had an 85 Toyota 4Runner for years and it used what is commonly called, "push-pull steering" -- maybe that will help you out. The OEM Fuso design, i.e. using a weird curved cast iron arm, seems quite silly to me, but it does the job.

Trophy truck full hydro from Howe Performance?

 

[javajoe79]

I will have to scour some pics of the rebel truck. I did find some components offered by super steer that are meant for Chevy P30 chassis that I may consider. Also there is a freightliner bellcrank that could work if I fabbed an arm for it. Either way they are $ and I like the challenge of making something also. I need to call them and get some specs to figure out if it will have enough travel though. I need 8" from lock to lock on this axle.

Also there are aftermarket knuckles for the dana 60 that have a bolt on steering arm that bolts to the top of the knuckle. I could maybe use that on the DS and keep the stock drag link to steer the PS.

Hydro steering would be cool but I wonder how well that would do on road. I know they are pretty vague feeling but maybe the howe setup you mention is better? I use their stuff from time to time on builds so I am sure it's nice.

 

[DzlToy]

It is about $3,900 worth of nice

I "presume" if Trophy Trucks use it to zoom zoom through the desert at 120 MPH, there is a certain amount of feeling and feedback there. However, I have never driven a Trophy Truck so.....

They are supposed to have great customer service. Call and talk to Jeff Howe or an Application Engineer about what you are doing. I think you would want the kit that has four turns lock to lock. My Fuso has five and it is kind of a PITA for slow travel, IMO. On the road it is great though.

What size steering wheel are you going with? As you know, that will make a big difference in feel, effort and sensitivity.

 

[javajoe79]

Yeah I won't be spending $3900 Pretty sure of my route at this point. Going to build a beefy bell crank out of a corvette wheel hub. Simple, cheap and robust. Plus parts availability everywhere. I just have to fab a bracket for it and a bell crank plate to bolt to it. It's right next to the radiator too so I have to make the bracket double as the DS radiator mount. My wheel is the stock 16" wheel. Do people change them out? Bigger or smaller? I hadn't noticed that.

I have to decide on the geometry of the bellcrank as well. The NPR steering arms travels 10" total while my axle needs 8" of travel total from lock to lock. I think at first I will do a 1:1 ratio on the bellcrank and see how it works. The piece of plate that will be the actual bell crank will be a pretty simple piece to remake with different geometry if need be or possibly put multiple holes in it for different ratio options.

 

[javajoe79]

I found this video of the rebelzilla. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gVBroKP4_aM

Right at the beginning you can see a shot of the steering bellcrank. It appears to be the supersteer component I was talking about.

 

[matt t]

It is the supersteer component, I checked it out at Sema. That is what I was going to use on my NPR for the Ford 60, however I went with a Chevrolet 60 and made a custom arm to use the push pull steering.

 

[javajoe79]

I thought about that route but don't like how push pull gets wonky when you flex out the suspension. Maybe with the long arm from the npr steering box to the arm on the knuckle it won't be too bad. What do you think? Have you flexed yours out and checked how it effected steering?

 

[javajoe79]

I'm also considering moving my leaf springs inboard to mount directly under the frame. I'm already planning on redoing the spring mounts that they built before so the only extra work would be welding on some spring pads further inboard on the axle

 

[DzlToy]

I thought about that route but don't like how push pull gets wonky when you flex out the suspension.

this is a common issue on the older 4Runners and Hilux's with push pull steering. They are quite popular for off roading and if you want large tires or long suspension travel, you are looking at a high steer or cross over steering conversion.

Matt and I discussed his use of the truck as a shop truck and camping rig, feeling that it would not see any hard core off roading, there was no need to fabricate custom steering components that would likely never be needed.

Cheers

 

[javajoe79]

this is a common issue on the older 4Runners and Hilux's with push pull steering. They are quite popular for off roading and if you want large tires or long suspension travel, you are looking at a high steer or cross over steering conversion.

Matt and I discussed his use of the truck as a shop truck and camping rig, feeling that it would not see any hard core off roading, there was no need to fabricate custom steering components that would likely never be needed.

Cheers

Yeah I thought that too but I also like the idea of being able to wheel pretty hard if I had the chance, especially before the camper box is mounted. That way I could put it through the paces and find it's limits without endangering the camper box.

 

[javajoe79]

Almost done with the wheels. I have one more front wheel to build but here are some shots of the wheels.

 

[javajoe79]

I got the drivetrain all back together and hung in the chassis again. Next I have to remake all the engine and transmission mounts. The previous design left alot to be desired.

 

[DzlToy]

Joe, can you elaborate on the Allison adapter and TCM? Five speed or six and whose adapter was used to mate it to the 12 valve?

Thanks

 

[javajoe79]

Joe, can you elaborate on the Allison adapter and TCM? Five speed or six and whose adapter was used to mate it to the 12 valve?

Thanks

Yeah it's all from destroked. 5 speed Allison. Billet adapter, billet sfi flex plate and vengeance torque converter. It uses a 6.0 powerstroke starter. The controller is just a gm computer but was part of a kit that destroked used to sell. I believe they now sell one that uses an aftermarket computer.