Gen 2 A/T Fluid Advice

R

razor541

Observer
Fluid drain and fill went well. I'll have to see how summer goes, since it seems to have more problems shifting into OD when it's hot out.

The shifter kit looks interesting... Any thoughts on going that route?
 
JohnnyBfromPeoria

JohnnyBfromPeoria

I'm Getting Around To It
My 95 shifts firmly enough as is. Flipping the switch into power mode makes it aggressive on the downshifts as well firming up the upshifts a bit further. Mine pulls right to redline before upshifting, too, when you floor it. Not sure I could ask for anything more. But that's just me.

John B.
 
Swank Force One

Swank Force One

Adventurer
JohnnyBfromPeoria said:
My 95 shifts firmly enough as is. Flipping the switch into power mode makes it aggressive on the downshifts as well firming up the upshifts a bit further. Mine pulls right to redline before upshifting, too, when you floor it. Not sure I could ask for anything more. But that's just me.

John B.
Click to expand...

Is that a 95 SR thing? My 98 doesnt have that nor did the 95 LS that hit our junkyard recently.
 
JohnnyBfromPeoria

JohnnyBfromPeoria

I'm Getting Around To It
Swank Force One said:
Is that a 95 SR thing? My 98 doesnt have that nor did the 95 LS that hit our junkyard recently.
Click to expand...

Yes, apparently. Mine has a toggle switch that has a "normal" setting and a "power" setting (enables a light on the dash that shows up as "PWR") that makes shifting decisions more aggressively. I use it on the highway in hilly or mountainous areas to help minimize gear hunting (excessive downshifting and in and out of converter lock-up). The switch also has a "hold" setting that starts the vehicle out in second gear and is apparently useful in snow, which I haven't tested extensively due to the apparent lack of such mythical particles in the Phoenix area. Some later models have the "hold" feature but lost the "power" one. It's an overall pretty cool feature.

John B.
 
JohnnyBfromPeoria

JohnnyBfromPeoria

I'm Getting Around To It
SD_Montero said:
Is there a tutorial for doing this somewhere or should I just by the fsm, my montero has 208K miles and I have no record of the transmission fluid being changed.
Click to expand...

The FSM doesn't outline this in the way a 4x4Wire member, AlexKogan does in his post from (maybe ten) years ago. They only suggest a drain and fill, but that's only going to get about half of your fluid out. There are a few principles to consider, and anyone is free to add to these or correct me if I'm wrong or leave something out.
Automatic transmissions are hydraulic systems. By-and-large, they are fairly clean inside as long as the internals have not started to come undone, meaning shredding themselves. The fluid may become contaminated and dirty, but should remain relatively "fluid-like." without solids, etc.
The system circulates fluid in a closed loop, and at a pretty high volume (though relatively low pressure) through the cooler lines and coolers before it returns to the transmission pan.
A lot of the fluid in an automatic transmission is inside the passages of the valve bodies and the torque converter, as well as the cooler lines and coolers themselves, making a static drain and refill only partially effective.
My 95's transmission, as well as the 90 we changed a few weeks prior to that, apparently only circulate the fluid through the cooler lines after the fluid has warmed to operating temperature, which makes sense. For this reason, I'd suggest trying this with a warmed up (but not boiling, thrashed hot) vehicle. Just driving it around for five minutes should do it.
All the following service procedures are best done with the transmission in neutral, not park. For whatever reason, the neutral position allows flow through all necessary (or most of the necessary) passages to get the most old fluid out, and therefore, new fluid in.
The order of flow (important) through the coolers is as such: Fluid leaves the transmission, travels to the front of the vehicle in a metal tube, transitions to a rubber hose and first enters the air-cooled cooler. It then loops out of that cooler and runs through another rubber hose into the cooler built into the bottom of the radiator where there is a fluid-cooled cooler. Lastly, it exits the bottom of the radiator, travels through another rubber hose, then rejoins a metal line and travels back to the transmission, where it re-enters the transmission at the transmission's oil pan, cooled and ready to be picked up and run through a screen into the transmission's pick-up before being pumped through the system of the transmission internals.
The transmission dipstick and the same place you add fluid, is a tube that runs into the transmission's oil pan.
Once you picture this layout, the flush-drain-refill procedure makes a little more sense.
I started by locating the rubber hose that comes off the bottom of my radiator and connects to a metal hard line. This is the last point of circulation before the fluid goes back to the transmission. Disconnect this hose from the metal line and direct it into a BIG catch bucket. We're talking about something that can hold gallons, not just a shallow pan. Pull your dipstick and put an appropriate funnel in the filler/dipstick tube and have your supply (I'd suggest buying a case of twelve quarts of SP-III from the dealer) nearby. Start your warmed-up truck and put the transmission in neutral and direct the flow of transmission fluid into the bucket. It's going to flow quickly, so it's helpful to have a helper watch the flow from underneath. I immediately started adding a supply into the filler funnel and asked my helper to tell me when the fluid started coming out red (mine was pretty dirty, so it was easy to tell). I think I added a couple of quarts, and some of this gets wasted doing this, but I feel it's worth it. When it runs clean, stop the engine. If it stops flowing, but still isn't clean, stop the engine and add more. You don't want to run the engine without a flow coming out, as I have read that foaming the fluid (bad) inside the system is not good to do. Once it comes out clean, stop the engine, but leave the connection undone for now. Move to the transmission pan and locate the drain plug. Use a second drain pan and remove the drain plug to drain any remaining fluid from the pan. Retain or replace any gasket on the plug and CLEAN THE PLUG off; it's magnetized. Side note here: you may be tempted to drop the drain pan and clean the filter screen or replace it. Fine. Go for it. I didn't. No shop, including the dealer, is going to do this unless you pay them extra. Remember all these words ago when I noted that hydraulic systems, by and large, are generally pretty clean, unless parts have started to disintegrate? Yeah, automatic transmissions DO shed metal particles in the normal course of operation, but that's whey you're changing ALL of the fluid and cleaning off the plug. Anyway, that optional step is up to you, but I'll say it's a lot of extra work that may or may not pay extra dividends for you. Side note #2: This might be a good time to inspect and replace those rubber lines that connect the cooler hard lines to the two coolers. If you do, use appropriate, quality hose. Consult the dealer or a trusted pro to select the correct type of hose, use good clamps and do not overtighten them for risk of pinching the metal lines they attach to. Side note #3: Inspect the two metal hard lines running to/from the transmission and make sure they aren't rubbing on anything, for if they are, they will lose and a nasty, high volume leak will happen at the worst possible time. Mitsubishi installed holders along those lines to keep them apart from each other and away from metal parts of the underside of the transmission, engine, frame, etc. CHECK THEM! Anyway, back to the action. Reinstall the drain plug with appropriate gasket (you cleaned off that plug, right?). Reconnect your rubber hose. Look at the amount of fluid you got out of the thing. It should be a couple of gallons, depending on your year of Montero. Consult your manual to get a rough guesstimate as to how much SP-III you'll be adding to get it near full again without overfilling it. Start by adding maybe three quarts before starting the engine, again in neutral, and adding a few more. Have your used fluid bucket and anything else in the general vicinity out of the way before holding the vehicle with the parking brake, wheel chocks, the brake pedal and the force of Zeus (as you see fit) to select each gear momentarily, with the engine running, and check the fluid level. You want to start adding a half quart at a time until you see fluid on the bottom of the dipstick. Take your time; you do not want to overfill! Note that the stick has upper and lower marks for both a "cold" (lower set of marks) and a "hot" (upper set of marks) transmission. Keep adding/checking fluid a half quart at a time until you get close to full (you'll probably want to use the "hot" marks, since the transmission warms up fairly quickly and all this idling, shifting, checking, etc. will warm it up pretty fast). Put away your funnel, reinsert dipstick and drive it around a bit, making sure to use all positions of the selector, including reverse, and recheck the level. Take the old fluid in for recycling. Enjoy. Again, all checking of level and draining is done in neutral, not park.
Looking forward to hearing additions to this as well as critiques of the technique to make it better.

John B.
 
AZPAJERO

AZPAJERO

Observer
JohnnyBfromPeoria said:
The FSM doesn't outline this in the way a 4x4Wire member, AlexKogan does in his post from (maybe ten) years ago. They only suggest a drain and fill, but that's only going to get about half of your fluid out. There are a few principles to consider, and anyone is free to add to these or correct me if I'm wrong or leave something out.
Automatic transmissions are hydraulic systems. By-and-large, they are fairly clean inside as long as the internals have not started to come undone, meaning shredding themselves. The fluid may become contaminated and dirty, but should remain relatively "fluid-like." without solids, etc.
The system circulates fluid in a closed loop, and at a pretty high volume (though relatively low pressure) through the cooler lines and coolers before it returns to the transmission pan.
A lot of the fluid in an automatic transmission is inside the passages of the valve bodies and the torque converter, as well as the cooler lines and coolers themselves, making a static drain and refill only partially effective.
My 95's transmission, as well as the 90 we changed a few weeks prior to that, apparently only circulate the fluid through the cooler lines after the fluid has warmed to operating temperature, which makes sense. For this reason, I'd suggest trying this with a warmed up (but not boiling, thrashed hot) vehicle. Just driving it around for five minutes should do it.
All the following service procedures are best done with the transmission in neutral, not park. For whatever reason, the neutral position allows flow through all necessary (or most of the necessary) passages to get the most old fluid out, and therefore, new fluid in.
The order of flow (important) through the coolers is as such: Fluid leaves the transmission, travels to the front of the vehicle in a metal tube, transitions to a rubber hose and first enters the air-cooled cooler. It then loops out of that cooler and runs through another rubber hose into the cooler built into the bottom of the radiator where there is a fluid-cooled cooler. Lastly, it exits the bottom of the radiator, travels through another rubber hose, then rejoins a metal line and travels back to the transmission, where it re-enters the transmission at the transmission's oil pan, cooled and ready to be picked up and run through a screen into the transmission's pick-up before being pumped through the system of the transmission internals.
The transmission dipstick and the same place you add fluid, is a tube that runs into the transmission's oil pan.
Once you picture this layout, the flush-drain-refill procedure makes a little more sense.
I started by locating the rubber hose that comes off the bottom of my radiator and connects to a metal hard line. This is the last point of circulation before the fluid goes back to the transmission. Disconnect this hose from the metal line and direct it into a BIG catch bucket. We're talking about something that can hold gallons, not just a shallow pan. Pull your dipstick and put an appropriate funnel in the filler/dipstick tube and have your supply (I'd suggest buying a case of twelve quarts of SP-III from the dealer) nearby. Start your warmed-up truck and put the transmission in neutral and direct the flow of transmission fluid into the bucket. It's going to flow quickly, so it's helpful to have a helper watch the flow from underneath. I immediately started adding a supply into the filler funnel and asked my helper to tell me when the fluid started coming out red (mine was pretty dirty, so it was easy to tell). I think I added a couple of quarts, and some of this gets wasted doing this, but I feel it's worth it. When it runs clean, stop the engine. If it stops flowing, but still isn't clean, stop the engine and add more. You don't want to run the engine without a flow coming out, as I have read that foaming the fluid (bad) inside the system is not good to do. Once it comes out clean, stop the engine, but leave the connection undone for now. Move to the transmission pan and locate the drain plug. Use a second drain pan and remove the drain plug to drain any remaining fluid from the pan. Retain or replace any gasket on the plug and CLEAN THE PLUG off; it's magnetized. Side note here: you may be tempted to drop the drain pan and clean the filter screen or replace it. Fine. Go for it. I didn't. No shop, including the dealer, is going to do this unless you pay them extra. Remember all these words ago when I noted that hydraulic systems, by and large, are generally pretty clean, unless parts have started to disintegrate? Yeah, automatic transmissions DO shed metal particles in the normal course of operation, but that's whey you're changing ALL of the fluid and cleaning off the plug. Anyway, that optional step is up to you, but I'll say it's a lot of extra work that may or may not pay extra dividends for you. Side note #2: This might be a good time to inspect and replace those rubber lines that connect the cooler hard lines to the two coolers. If you do, use appropriate, quality hose. Consult the dealer or a trusted pro to select the correct type of hose, use good clamps and do not overtighten them for risk of pinching the metal lines they attach to. Side note #3: Inspect the two metal hard lines running to/from the transmission and make sure they aren't rubbing on anything, for if they are, they will lose and a nasty, high volume leak will happen at the worst possible time. Mitsubishi installed holders along those lines to keep them apart from each other and away from metal parts of the underside of the transmission, engine, frame, etc. CHECK THEM! Anyway, back to the action. Reinstall the drain plug with appropriate gasket (you cleaned off that plug, right?). Reconnect your rubber hose. Look at the amount of fluid you got out of the thing. It should be a couple of gallons, depending on your year of Montero. Consult your manual to get a rough guesstimate as to how much SP-III you'll be adding to get it near full again without overfilling it. Start by adding maybe three quarts before starting the engine, again in neutral, and adding a few more. Have your used fluid bucket and anything else in the general vicinity out of the way before holding the vehicle with the parking brake, wheel chocks, the brake pedal and the force of Zeus (as you see fit) to select each gear momentarily, with the engine running, and check the fluid level. You want to start adding a half quart at a time until you see fluid on the bottom of the dipstick. Take your time; you do not want to overfill! Note that the stick has upper and lower marks for both a "cold" (lower set of marks) and a "hot" (upper set of marks) transmission. Keep adding/checking fluid a half quart at a time until you get close to full (you'll probably want to use the "hot" marks, since the transmission warms up fairly quickly and all this idling, shifting, checking, etc. will warm it up pretty fast). Put away your funnel, reinsert dipstick and drive it around a bit, making sure to use all positions of the selector, including reverse, and recheck the level. Take the old fluid in for recycling. Enjoy. Again, all checking of level and draining is done in neutral, not park.
Looking forward to hearing additions to this as well as critiques of the technique to make it better.

John B.
Click to expand...

This is great. Thank you for posting. I removed my radiator to have it re-rodded and lost significant amount of trans fluid. Debating whether to flush and refill or just add enough to get back to proper levels. Either way I got this bookmarked :)
 
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