2003 Chevy Suburban 2500 LT build

rayra

Expedition Leader
That's about where I'm at. In the normal range of motion, only change was a torsion key 'leveling' lift. Z71 Sub. The boots / bellows on the CV boots are a bit overlarge. It looks pinched but isn't.
15yrs, 126k+ miles into its vehicle life, who can say? Far as I can tell this vehicle is still on its original ball joints and bushings, too. I've replaced everything but those key components, at this point. And the CV half shafts. All the fluids have been changes, everything well lubed. Time will tell. And 99% of the time it's in 2WD anyway.
The Missus' '05 Tahoe just went past the 180k mi mark, also a Z71, no sign of any CV trouble yet. Hers is only cranked up a little, no key change. All the boots look good as new, no sign of degradation or splitting. That's SoCal vehicles for you, benefit of only having three seasons, Summer, Fire, Mud.


eta - I have seen an aftermarket suspension lift that included some spacers to lower the axle a bit and reclaim some of that CV angle. And having dropped the front axles in both our vehicles as part of changing their oil pan gaskets and oil pickup tube o-rings, it does appear to be easy to add some spacers to lower the axle in the otherwise stock config to recover a few degrees of angle. I'd have to look at bolt lengths and clearance between the front axle pumpkin and the factory skid plate. But my recollection is it could be spaced about 1/2" lower. Didn't seem to be enough to matter much.
 
Last edited:

Ramblejam

Observer
I wasn't talking about ball-joint life or suspension travel before hitting the stops; just the CV angle itself. Here's a picture of a lifted Burb for comparision:
DSC_0130.jpg


Regardless, as fl0w3n said, if it works for you then motor on! :wings:
 

rayra

Expedition Leader
Yah I get what you're talking about, that last pic is a lift that lowers both the lower arms and the axle. what I was responding too, trying to recalibrate, was your "Ramblejam

What's going on with your CV angle, Rayra? Ouch!"

inferring that something was seriously wrong / broken. There's nothing wrong with it. It's within the factory / normal range of movement / angle and not on the stops. Is flatter better, sure. Is my setup about to grenade? Not even close. In fact I'd venture that angle is scarcely different from that of a stock 2500. Especially given that my vehicle now sits at an almost identical stance to such. Don't let all the lore / marketing skew your perspective.

Z71-stance-comp-170109-2_zpskb58thfu.gif
 

Burb One

Adventurer
Rayra-

Hate to say it but those angles looks pretty bad (I think you may be closer to 3" over stock than 2")

On a bunch of the other fullsize forums, there loads of people with failures with that much angle... Now, with the smaller tires and driving style you may never have any trouble- but just that this is a known issue, especially if you ever get stuck in mud, start spinning the tires, and then one of the front catches, the jolt rips the axle out of the inner tripod joint when there's a high angle...

However, if you haven't had problems at this point, maybe you won't.... I think a lot of this type of stuff is down to driving styles and what people try to do with their trucks.
 

rayra

Expedition Leader
of course it is. Just like all the crapola about G80, 10-bolt vs 14, Jeep front CVs (when being jumped) and all the rest. It's ALL about driving hard and jamming a vehicle across difficult terrain obstacles. Worst I'm doing is slow-crawling across a stone-filled dry creek bed and driving down decrepit dirt tracks.

Too, it is all of it about folks that can pick a track and drive with some finesse, conservation of energy, momentum etc, and those that just put the hammer down - and keep their foot in it when they should be letting off. The differences in style / method make all the difference. Much more than the gear itself, for the most part.


/who was the guy here that recounted that his wife and daughter repeatedly blew his G80 rear?

/I dunno, my perspective is skewed too, I quit bashing stuff across the landscape a long time ago, when the injuries (and expenses) stacked up too high. I'm just a slow-moving tourist now.
 

snowblind

Adventurer
That's about where I'm at. In the normal range of motion, only change was a torsion key 'leveling' lift. Z71 Sub. The boots / bellows on the CV boots are a bit overlarge. It looks pinched but isn't.
15yrs, 126k+ miles into its vehicle life, who can say? Far as I can tell this vehicle is still on its original ball joints and bushings, too. I've replaced everything but those key components, at this point. And the CV half shafts. All the fluids have been changes, everything well lubed. Time will tell. And 99% of the time it's in 2WD anyway.
The Missus' '05 Tahoe just went past the 180k mi mark, also a Z71, no sign of any CV trouble yet. Hers is only cranked up a little, no key change. All the boots look good as new, no sign of degradation or splitting. That's SoCal vehicles for you, benefit of only having three seasons, Summer, Fire, Mud.

Hey Rayra.

CVs break when they are at an extreme angle and then you put power to them. EG: Full-droop on one front wheel trying to climb out of a ditch and back onto the road. If you never get in that type of situation you will probably never break a CV regardless of angles. High angles will lead to increased wear but these trucks seem to trash wheel bearings and pitman arms more than CVs.

From my personal experience I would say that you have lifted the front of your truck a little too much. The CV angles are one indicator but the other is the ride. On my truck a full 2" of front lift put the lower control arms at an angle that resulted in a harsh ride with poor small bump compliance. Dropping the truck back to a 1.5"-1.75" lift dramatically improved the small bump compliance.

Be careful comparing your rig to a 2500. I'm pretty sure the Z71 comes from the factory with higher ride height than the normal 1500. From my experience they are roughly the same height as a 2500.

eta - I have seen an aftermarket suspension lift that included some spacers to lower the axle a bit and reclaim some of that CV angle. And having dropped the front axles in both our vehicles as part of changing their oil pan gaskets and oil pickup tube o-rings, it does appear to be easy to add some spacers to lower the axle in the otherwise stock config to recover a few degrees of angle. I'd have to look at bolt lengths and clearance between the front axle pumpkin and the factory skid plate. But my recollection is it could be spaced about 1/2" lower. Didn't seem to be enough to matter much.

Most lifts drop the FRONT DIFFERENTIAL and also the LOWER CONTROL ARMS. This keeps CV angles mellow AND eliminates the small bump harshness caused by the lift. I think the CV spacers are to work with lifts that have a wider front track than stock.

In other news - It looks like ZONE now has a 3.5" lift with UCAs and a diff dropper. Interesting indeed! http://zoneoffroad.com/zone-offroad-products-3.5in-suspension-lift-kit-chevy-gmc-2wd/c31-c32


Matt
 

snowblind

Adventurer
Ooh, that is an appealing kit. I assume my 5100's won't jive with that. Any idea why they specify the need for 17" wheels? I like my current 285's on 16's but would appreciate the additional clearance.

Good question. I have the same shocks. As I recall my 5100s are a "little" longer than stock but not long enough for a full 3" lift. Maybe 1.5-2". Not sure if they recommend longer for this kit.

I don't think this kit requires a 17" wheel. They just listed that as the recommended wheel/backspacing to run 33x12.5. I have a similar lift with aftermarket UCAs and there is no specific need for 17s.

I'm going to reach out to Zone and see if they will sell me just the dif relocating brackets. I have all the other parts already on the truck so thats all I would need. And maybe shocks... :mad::mad::mad:


Matt
 

01BURB

New member
You can get just the Diff drop brackets from them. I read on another forum where guys were getting just that piece. If you do that though, look at your tie rod angles everything will not stay parallel with each other at that point in your fron end
 

snowblind

Adventurer
You can get just the Diff drop brackets from them. I read on another forum where guys were getting just that piece.

If you do that though, look at your tie rod angles everything will not stay parallel with each other at that point in your fron end


Wait. What?

What do you mean by "tie rod angles will not stay parallel with each other"?


Matt
 

01BURB

New member
They will be with each other but using the diff drop bracket helps with your CV angles to keep them straight. Your tie rods will be angled now from what I recall
 

snowblind

Adventurer
They will be with each other but using the diff drop bracket helps with your CV angles to keep them straight. Your tie rods will be angled now from what I recall

Hmmmm. The hubs aren't moving down any so the tie rods angle shouldn't change. I think it's just a visual thing. The CVs are straighter with the diff drop so the tie rods look more angled. Perhaps if you're trying for a full 3" lift the angles might get nasty.

I'm assuming that 4-6" lifts that include knuckels move the tie rod mount up.


Matt
 

01BURB

New member
Thats the way I took it. If using the knuckles it would move the tie rod mount up It might be a mute point and not that big of a deal just some stuff I saw on another forum I thought I would pass along
 

snowblind

Adventurer
Thats the way I took it. If using the knuckles it would move the tie rod mount up It might be a mute point and not that big of a deal just some stuff I saw on another forum I thought I would pass along

I think it's really good info and something to consider. With a full 3" lift the tierods are going to be angled a lot.

I'm liking the idea of going slightly higher without increasing ride harshness.



Matt
 

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