Next truck, 4 different options...

[blackdmax15]

Hi all i need some advice on my next truck build. I have 3xKids and a dog so i need something fairly large. I have somewhat ruled out the Diesel ZR2 and potentially any current or future wrangler as all three kids are in car seats currently. Those vehicles are just too small. I would prefer a smaller vehicle to navigate trails no matter where i'm stationed (currently in San Diego), but to comfortably accommodate all family members, we travel fairly heavy and i really just need a truck. I'm on my 5th wrangler, but it just won't work without an expensive trailer, and that would mean an engine swap as well so i didn't hate it... For long family travel with no camping involved, we just take our '14 Yukon XL Denali. I have used it for camping as well, but it still is fairly cramped when loaded down. Our current kit includes a massive Springbar tent, 4xREI camp cots (infant is in the pack-n-play), and a medium size camp kitchen with chairs and tables, 50qt ARB fridge freezer and we always have toys and tons of stuff we don't "need". For winter camping add the Big Buddy heater and i may be adding a propane campfire kit soon as well. I don't necessarily need a big diesel truck for the weight, but would like a full-size truck for the space.

Goals: Long range travel to national parks, desert exploration in the southwestern US and ability to camp and be self sufficient for a few days. Reliability is a must.

Desires/Requirements: 1) Diesel, 2) Seating for 5 comfortably, 3) Solid front axle, 4) Comfortable to travel for days on end. From the selection today that leaves me with the Ram 2500/3500 or the F-250/350. My MAX budget is 80k for the truck and modifications. I just love diesel trucks and the improved torque along with slightly better fuel economy/range and safety factor of diesel (low volatility) make this a priority when spending this much money. I like the ability to idle all day long of required and not burn a ton of fuel (yes i know DPFs get clogged after a while). I also have had 4xDuramax diesel trucks. They have all been awesome but i don't want another IFS rig.

Proposed options: 1) Prospector XL based on a stripped tradesman ram or 2) King Ranch 4dr long bed F-250.

-I just want the Prospector XL. I love AEV products but have never been able to justify an AEV JK. The truck would only be limited in destinations by trail width. In order to afford the XL package i would have to skimp on the truck creature comforts. Parking in San Diego would be an aggravation as would loading kids in and out when required, but both trucks share these negatives. Potentially not as comfortable on long trips?

-Practicality tells me to get the KR Super duty. It has creature comforts galore enabling comfortable travel, high resale value (not as much of a niche market), and can easily fit 37s with a small lift/level. A long bed isn't required but i just like the way the ford long beds look. Also 925lb/ft of torque even in the F-250 (the Ram requires Aisin trans and 3500 to get the 910lb/ft).

Both trucks would be outfitted with a cap/camper shell and a decked bed drawer system. On the long bed i could even have an aux fuel tank in the space available behind the decked system. I know both trucks are kind of opposites, but they represent a extreme capability vs. functionality/comfortability argument i'm having with myself. The Prospector XL is a beast but may be overkill for my needs. The KR features aren't required but massaging seats may help convince the wife to go on more trips and the dual sun roofs will be nice for the kids! I have already thought about other platforms that would fit my needs but be slightly cheaper, potentially downsizing my camp kit to fit into a smaller vehicle like a LC200, and selling the kids off to afford a G550, but these are the two routes i'm planning on pursuing. Any thoughts would be appreciated as i have been racking my brain which route to go. Open to other options i'm missing as well but the vehicle needs to be fairly new and have a descent support base.

 

[trd]

In a similar position, watching this thread.

Good luck

 

[gtbensley]

Lets see if we can keep this away from a gas vs diesel debate.

I dont think you could go wrong with either of those trucks as they are both very nice, can fit all your gear and kids.

While I have yet to confirm this I believe the Ram will not shut the vehicle down as far WHEN it has a DEF issue. I know the Ford will go into a reduced power mode and limp mode eventually when this happens. If this is infact true, I would go for the Ram only because its less likely to leave you stranded. Again, I cant confirm this but have read it in a few places.

I would go drive both and see what you like....and go drive a diesel ZR2 just because why not.....

 

[Tex68w]

Most trails in this country can be run with 35's, so the 40's on the Prospector XL aren't necessary. That said, I understand the desire for the AEV trucks, I send an email usually every other month to AEV nagging them about getting into the Superduty market lol. I am currently on my third F-250 King Ranch since 2012, my current truck is a 2017 F-250 King Ranch "Alumiduty". I absolutely love these trucks, loaded to the hilt with options and creature comforts, and they can tow pretty much anything you throw at them. In regards to the 6.7L Powerstroke, they have all been flawless in regards to reliability and they have never let me down in the capability department. I truly believe that Ford makes the best all-around heavy duty truck on the market. That said, I would certainly consider a Ram if I wanted a manual transmission and a Cummins diesel, but the rear coils on the 3/4 ton is a turn off.
My truck stickered for $75K, I paid $63,980, so the deep discounts on these trucks are certainly there, don't overpay.
My plans for my truck are either a 2-2.5" level or 4" lift with 37's, probably a camper with a RTT and some bumpers/winch. These trucks fit 37's with a leveling kit and honestly that's more tire than anyone will ever need off-road in an overlanding environment. Sure the cool factor of the 40's on the Prospector is appealing, but the added weight just leads to more wear and tear on the front of the truck and the tranny, two areas that Ram's are notorious for having issues. I would think that you'd want a tune running that big of a tire as well to make up for the lost power and torque, a risk if you are still under warranty.

In regards to resale, I sold my 2016 with 33K miles on it in May, I got $51K for it, I only paid $60K for it 17 months earlier, that's pretty good resale and low depreciation. These loaded out models like the KR and Platinum have excellent resale on the used market. The massaging seats sure are nice on a long road trip too, my other half hated the idea of them when we first got the truck, but now she's constantly using them lol. I would think that you'd have a much easier time selling the Ford as well, the Prospector XL definitely has an appeal on the used market, but it's only appealing to a very small, niche portion of the market and that would lead me to believe that it could take longer to sell. You certainly wouldn't want to take the hit on trading it in as I'm certain most dealers would value it as a normal/standard Ram truck.

At the end of the day, I don't think that you can go wrong either way, but personal bias aside, I think you would be better off with the KR and a small lift/level. Don't rule out the Lariat Ultimate package either, you can get all of the same options as the KR and Platinums for a few thousand less, possibly putting you sub $60K on the purchase. That would leave you quite a bit of scratch left over for mods and accessories. Keep us updated on which way you go, I would love to have another full size build thread to follow.

 

[wanderer-rrorc]

As a FANATIC FORD guy...I have to say I LOVE MY RAM ECODIESEL!!

Im in the same boat..except we have 5 kiddos (second marriage for both of us) and pets..and Im a contractor....


The fit and finish inside the ram is SURPRISINGLY good!! I bought the basic tradesman package for the tow package and the vinyl flooring..some good floor mats are easier to hose out than carpet..cus well lets face it..contracting and kids create a LOT of mess...

I have put 86000 miles in just over 2 years...we built the FLIP-BACK (it was built and used about 6 months before the habitat came out..go figure) and its been all over for work and play..the ride is FANTASTIC even with load rate E tires I put on this year to help with towing a larger trailer and I got a killer deal on them...I just ordered the bilstine 2.5 leveling kit to make up for the 86K shocks that are just now feeling a little worn..and to make up for the huge front bumper I put on it...


I did do the GDE tuner at 60K and wish I haddnt waited...takes the pedal lag out..gives 1.5-4mpg increase and helps better control the emissions system..and it makes it FAST!!...and tows like the 14ft enclosed isnt behind it...


I average 25-28mpg highway/city at 70-75...best tank was 32mpg at 55-60mph...
towing I get 14-19 depending on speed and load...but its a great platform..

it also has lived its entire life with a 300lb toolbox and 300lb truck cap on it..



I WOULD HAVE BOUGHT A FORD...but they refuse to put a diesel in a half ton...and I didnt need a 3/4 ton (nor did I want the ride)...

I looked for about 2 years before I decided on the Ram...havent regreted it...

maintnance issues.
EGR cooler was leaking coolant slowly and replaced under warranty 34K
Shifter went bad..no reason...just wouldnt let me put it in park...again warranty...65K

check my signature for pictures and build thread..its been a FANTASTIC truck and we really enjoy it...MANY times we will take the Ram rather than my wifes VW Rabbit for comfort and it gets similar fuel mileage so why not take the Cadillac not the tin can??

 

[Tex68w]

While I have yet to confirm this I believe the Ram will not shut the vehicle down as far WHEN it has a DEF issue. I know the Ford will go into a reduced power mode and limp mode eventually when this happens. If this is infact true, I would go for the Ram only because its less likely to leave you stranded. Again, I cant confirm this but have read it in a few places.

One thing to consider in regards to the Ram is that the Cummins ISB is designed to shut down by the PCM if it loses an injector, IMHO that sucks. In no way should I be left stranded on the side of the road because of a bad injector. I understand that it's a fail-safe from a design POV, but I think it's a poor execution.

 

[calicamper]

I have two kids in car seats some times 3. I agree the ZR2 is too tight for three kids seats. Even 2 seats its kinda snug but workable.
So your for sure in full sized territory. My neighbor has three kids all out of seats. He had the same issue you have. Their road trip rig is a Sienna and his dirt bike rig all three kids ride every Sunday is a long bed 2016 F150 3.5L. The rear seat in that thing is huge. He puts 4 bikes in the back! Eventually he'll end up with a small toyhauler / bunk house rig.

 

[gtbensley]

One thing to consider in regards to the Ram is that the Cummins ISB is designed to shut down by the PCM if it loses an injector, IMHO that sucks. In no way should I be left stranded on the side of the road because of a bad injector. I understand that it's a fail-safe from a design POV, but I think it's a poor execution.

Probably saves them a ton of money from warranty work if an injector goes out and doesnt get caught quick enough. Would absolutly suck to happen in the middle of no where though.

 

[plainjaneFJC]

I would buy a gas motor in your position. A diesel is a necessary evil for towing heaving trailers and that's the only thing that makes it worthwhile.

 

[calicamper]

As a side note my old roomate had a buy back diesel jetta. He has three boys all are out of car seats which is a huge deal regarding seat space. His new ride is the Diesel Canyon LB. keep in mind his Jetta rear seat was smaller than the Canyon. He says its workable with the three boys. They dont do long road trips! They do very close local stuff given they live in a great place for MTB and skiing etc. On the flip side I do road trips, our preferred rig is the 2010 Outback the rear seat is bigger than the Colorado/Canyon but only slightly and I have two kids. So I have seriously considered the Canyon as a viable option for us. My heavy hauler is a 05 Sequoia err minivan etc sorta like your Suburban its not exactly my go to for trips but we use it for butts in seats capacity.

Im in CA but our area full size SUCKS!!! Parking is basically Zero because of width. My neighbor with the F150 Sunday moto rig, drives a WRX STI daily his wife drives the Sienna Daily. The F150 might see 4000 miles a yr at most. Mainly because you cant park the damn thing anywere.

 

[chet6.7]

Proposed options: 1) Prospector XL based on a stripped tradesman ram or 2) King Ranch 4dr long bed F-250.I suggest getting a 1 ton,the payload on the Ram 2500 is around 2300 lbs.A 1 ton will give you room to grow if you decide to get a heavy camper some day.



A long bed isn't required but i just like the way the ford long beds look. Also 925lb/ft of torque even in the F-250 (the Ram requires Aisin trans and 3500 to get the 910lb/ft).
I suggest the long bed,obviously, for bed space, and there will be more options on aux fuel tanks.On my SB bed Ram my aux fuel tank options are more limited than if I had a LB.I either have to give up bed space,use a tank that goes where the spare tire was,or try the AEV Jeep tank on a rear bumper tire carrier.With a long bed you could probably replace the stock tank with a bigger tank.I don't know where Ford locates their DEF tank,but the way Ram does it,it seems to limit the number of aux tanks available.For example,the location of GM's DEF tank allows more fuel tank options.

Both trucks would be outfitted with a cap/camper shell and a decked bed drawer system. On the long bed i could even have an aux fuel tank in the space available behind the decked system. .
Does Transfer Tank make a stock tank replacement with more capacity?
Are you going have a house battery or two? A water tank?

I am getting a warning that my repose too short....see above.

 

[stevenmd]

Watching this thread with great interest! I'm a Land Rover guy through and through and was super close to pulling the trigger on an LR4 but now that I am doing flips in addition to my regular Realtor® work, I need a truck. But it has to pull double duty. It has to seat 2 adults and 4 kids on short trips, 2 adults and 2 kids on longer trips, plus have room in the back for a few doggies and gear. Oh, and has to be 4wd. Seriously looking at the RAM 2500 and dropping in the Allison transmission.

 

[Copperhead14]

I have the Ram 2500 Cummins Mega Cab SLT. I love the truck plenty of room for our 10 month old twins. Lots of room behind the seats, lots of leg room. Could easily fit another car seat in the middle. I work this truck pretty hard on my property and doing construction jobs when I'm not at the fire station. The public safety pricing was awesome.

 

[plainjaneFJC]

Seriously looking at the RAM 2500 and dropping in the Allison transmission.

Other than spending money, what would this accomplish? Any of the big 3 trucks will work with the trannies they came with from the factory, and you'd never be money ahead on a swap like that.

 

[stevenmd]

Other than spending money, what would this accomplish? Any of the big 3 trucks will work with the trannies they came with from the factory, and you'd never be money ahead on a swap like that.

I guess I've seen too many RAM trannies (hehehehe) go kaput from towing but never an Allison. Not a fan of Chevy or Ford diesels, hence the RAM diesel.