Size of Camper Box on a FG LWB

[VerMonsterRV]

Hi all, hopefully by next week at this time I will be the new owner of an FG (based on my inspection). So, I am considering one of Kym's Discovery camper bodies for this but he might not be ready with a NA version for this spring. So, sort of my plab B (well before the Discovery idea this was my Plan A) was a Total Composites box with all TernOverland doors/windows. So, if this is the route I go down what do you think is the longest box I could safely build? I know about the Australian 60% rule which puts it at about 14' (which is likely a good idea) but since this would be a NA build could I get by with something at 14.5' or even 15'? If anyone has done something like this then an pics would be appreciated.

 

[SkiFreak]

My understanding is that you are not really constrained, legally, to the overall length in the US, but maybe I am wrong.
Bear in mind that the more weight you put behind the rear axles the more it will affect the handling of the truck. Also, the departure angle will be affected by the length of the box, unless you do something like the design of the ATW Global Warrior.

 

[VerMonsterRV]

Hey Owen, if you mean the 45 degree slant to the rear of the box then I would be ok with that, it would be a pretty small one for only 6" to a foot. One of my concerns is the size of the bed. I know it sounds a bit trivial but as you know we have lived on a sailboat for 20 years and with this switch we are hoping on a nice rectangular innerspring bed ;-) Although I have not drawn up any plans if I do go down this route I wanted to look into a lifting bed that would be over the top of a U shaped dinette in the rear of the camper. I would raise the dinette up about 10" (if I remember right a normal step) to increase the storage underneath the seats which would be accessible from the outside. Hopefully that would leave enough space for folding bikes, inflatable 2 person kayak and backpacking gear.

p.s. we had a good trip across the Atlantic and are now in Martinique. Pretty close to "home" now.

 

[SkiFreak]

The Happijac bed lift is built pretty well and would allow you to do what you have described.
I did import some of these myself, with the intention of using one myself, but it turned out that was not feasible for my current design.
Gait has one in his camper with a U shaped lounge beneath it and has used it extensively. If he wants to chime in I'm sure he will give it his stamp of approval.

 

[gait]

the bed lift made a big difference to layout options. Very solid. We have a east west standard double bed inner spring mattress - caravan mattress supplier (single sided lightweight) kept asking what shape I wanted it. The base is 19mm fibreglass foam sandwich inside the bed lift steel frame. Same as my walls, and seats, etc. U-shaped seats would have reduced space (IMO). There's a big window across the back, behind the curtains. Box is 4 x2.1x2.1m.

 

[mog]

I currently have a 14 foot 'moving truck box' on my Fuso FG. With the lip for the liftgate, it is a total of 15 feet long aft of the cab. That length seems perfectly fine, and even a 16 footer would be in the realm of OK, IMO.
My plans are for a 2'6" long 'toolbox/storage' unit over the FG's frame hump, and then a 12' TC panel cabin, so 14'6".

 

[VerMonsterRV]

Thanks guys, the HappiJac is the lift I was thinking about. Good to get a first hand report on one. If I decided to have the ability to convert the dinette seats to a bed, would I be able to lower the bed, say halfway down and still use it like that (to give the lower bunk more space)? Might be nice if we had the (very) occasional guest.

Owen, I would think the popup would pretty much make the lifting bed pretty hard. For simplicity I have decided to just go with a fixed roof box. A hard sided popup is pretty cool and would be great to have one, but it does add complexity.

The U shape and raised floor (single step up) would be for more storage space beneath and also the ability to sit north/south with a nice backrest (we have this on the boat and enjoy it). I would try and have a 2 large external access doors east/west that would allow access beneath the entire U. I still need to model it but I think it would give enough space for 20" wheel folding bikes, 2 person inflatable kayak and back country camping gear. The raised floor might give some internal water tankage space beneath the foot space.

What Mark (Mog) has for a drawing is pretty much what I am thinking, minus the toolbox. The 45 degree slant in the front top and lower rear. So, since you are doing a TC box the 45 degree angles are not an issue? How do you go about doing those with the corner channels? What software did you use to model this?

Anyone use the TC honeycomb core panels to build out the interior bulkheads/furniture? Wonder how much weight saving that might provide and if the cost would be worth it.

 

[SkiFreak]

I would think the popup would pretty much make the lifting bed pretty hard.

Yep... that's why I don't have one in my current design.

A hard sided popup is pretty cool and would be great to have one, but it does add complexity.

No arguments there.

What software did you use to model this?

A few people I know use Google SketchUp, but I tried it and did not like it myself. Bottom line... SketchUp is primarily an architectural 3D CAD package, so it creates meshes, not solids.
Using an engineering CAD package is a better option. Something like Solidworks, Inventor, Rhino or the like.

 

[Family Friendly 4x4]

This reply could be seen as how not to do it perhaps But any info is good info they say.

I do not know what rules you have to comply by in the US but in cowboy South Africa I put a 5m x 2.5m x 2.5m alluminum box on my FG. That is 16,4 feet in length in your money.

Notes to you about this is that I find it a little top heavy (sways a bit on the road and leans off-level in a cross wind) and when loaded it squats at the rear. So I've had to space the leafsprings and introduce big airbags at the back in order to run level.

I am happy with my rig and it works but I would definately not build a body longer than 14 feet again.

Incidentally for your interest I have viewed one of Kym's Discoverer bodies at the manufacturer here in Cape Town and it is very nice, you cannot go wrong. Everything is already there for you and well thought of.

My 10 cents for you

 

[gait]

the bed lift stays stopped where the motor is turned off (up/down switch released). It has a relay operated brake built in. It can also lift bunk beds (which I didn't need). Supplied with second set of sliders. We've had a third person sleeping on the seat cushions on the floor between the bench seats. We have two suspension seats and middle seat in the cab - useful for China.

there's a manual lever to release brake if no power. I added a main power switch in series with the supplied up/down momentary switch. I turn the main off before we go to sleep. I've developed an interest in arduinos and intend to do what I should have done when first purchased ..... add a safety cutout if there's some resistance to movement. The motor is powerful enough to kill someone. I lost concentration during the build and bent one of the bits of angle iron round the base by driving it down on to a bit of fibreglass panel on its edge. Needed the weight of the truck and a jack to straighten.

I used sketchup. Different paradigm to engineering drawing.

The hardest bit of the design was steps. My floor is flat, all the steps are outside. Useful if people have to pass to swap ends. I finally had some steel laser cut with a complex slot to anchor the top but allow the concertina steps to slide under the floor. Another year to use over centre latches to hold them in place instead of bits of pink ribbon tied in a bow.

 

[mog]

What Mark (Mog) has for a drawing is pretty much what I am thinking, minus the toolbox. The 45 degree slant in the front top and lower rear. So, since you are doing a TC box the 45 degree angles are not an issue? How do you go about doing those with the corner channels? What software did you use to model this?

Family Friendly 4x4 has a very good point. The length would certainly affect your weight & balance and CG. So that is definitely a consideration besides overhang and looks.

I just use a photo editing program to draw with, nothing hi-tech. And that is actually a combination, as a friend is helping with ideas, so he has cut-pasted onto that 'drawing'.

I will have to make my own 45-degree 'extrusions'. Total Composite has no intended of making those according to Andreas. But perhaps if enough of us ask as more and more Expo cabins are being built with their panels, and that is certainly a desirable angle.

 

[VerMonsterRV]

Thanks for all the input, general rule is to keep the weight low and out of the ends (like boats and sports cars). I am hoping to build the box and interior using composites. I am also considering a lithium battery bank (if I have any money left over). If I can do these it will help keep some of the weight down. I am also thinking a single spare wheel/tire (though I wonder if this is wise). On the topic of weight, does an aluminum subframe make any sense? I have not noticed anyone using one so I am guessing probably not.

I will have to look into some of the CAD programs. Hopefully there is a simple easy to use one out there. Sketchup seems a bit odd to me but I have not really used CAD software either.

I really do like Kym's campers, just a bit concerned as to when they will be available.

I thought I saw a Youtube video at one point from TC about how to do the 45 degree end. Our internet access has been a bit challenging so have not had the will power to keep searching for it. Maybe this coming week in the US I can catch up on some delayed interneting.

 

[mog]

I thought I saw a Youtube video at one point from TC about how to do the 45 degree end. Our internet access has been a bit challenging so have not had the will power to keep searching for it. Maybe this coming week in the US I can catch up on some delayed interneting.

Andreas made 'rounded' corners on his build.
http://forum.expeditionportal.com/t...inter-4x4-CrewCab-Expedition-Build-in-Canada?









And here is Total Composites 'instructions' for 45-degree angles

 

[Victorian]

Here you go: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=u20tN89z274

Although this idea worked very well for us. There are a couple of things to consider:
1: having those kerf cuts on the floor/departure angle/rear wall makes the handling of the panel a bit tricky. As only one FRP side of the panel is supporting everything. Considering the weight of everything I would only do this with bodies less than 12' long.
2: the overall length of the floor/departure angle/rear wall may get you into a catagory where you need a 40' container instead of a cheaper 20'.
3: this method is not recommended if you are planing of carrying a lot of weight (motorcycle rack, huge tires)

In any case, visually the "folded" rear looks way better than a "pieced together" rear.

Cheers,

 

[mog]

I am also thinking a single spare wheel/tire (though I wonder if this is wise)

The main reason for the 'toolbox' in front of my cabin is so the cabin can be mounted 8 inches lower on the frame as it will not have to deal with the frame 'hump'. Also, the 'surplus' TC panels I got are only 12 feet long (I was planning on a 14 foot cabin). But the toolbox gives me a great place to mount the two spares and besides moving the weight forward, I can mount them lower as they will sit somewhat to the side of the frame. Not only does this help the CG, but it will make them much easier to load and unload. They will be enclosed behind one of the toolbox doors.