2019 Tundra

FJR Colorado

FJR Colorado

Explorer
You'd hardly ever find a bigger Toy fan than myself, but I'd be the first to acknowledge that the total commitment to QDR has sometimes been a barrier to innovation.

They actually made really good truck developments from the early 90s to 2006. However, the Gen 2 just seemed to be a steady $$-maker and they milked it. I don't know how much, if any, of that had to do with USA manufacturing?

I remain curious to see what the 2019 models and beyond bring.
 
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tacollie said:
Toyota never tried to compete with the big 3. Their first go at a full-size was the T100 which originally had a 3.0L V6 and suspension from a mini truck. They make a full-size for guys who want a full-size Toyota. There are plenty of those people. I think for a lot of people a tundra is the solid and safe choice.

People who are holding out for big change with he disappointed.
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I think is that they tried to compete with the Big 3, and then the economy crashed, so they backed off. Remember the talk of a diesel Tundra, and a HD version?

Still think the Tundra is a great truck, but since they don't want to invest much in further R&D in the platform, the others are out pacing it.
 
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Runt

Adventurer
Clutch said:
Maybe with their trucks, but weren't they one of the first to introduce hybrids to the public? And now a fuel cell.

Not that I need major advances, but it is odd to see them advance their car, CUV, and SUV lines. While their trucks are treated like the Ford E-Series van. IIRC Ford used the same basic design [3rd gen] for what nearly 40 years?
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My point exactly! I believe way back in the day it was a German company that put out the first hybrid. First to market I believe was Honda then Toyota improved off of Honda's engineering. Honda has an entirely different ethos to there business mantra. Honda wants to be leaders in engineering and focuses on innovation. I wish Toyota would lean towards Honda's business model.....the Honda Ridgeline just does not appeal to me lol.
 
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Runt said:
My point exactly! I believe way back in the day it was a German company that put out the first hybrid. First to market I believe was Honda then Toyota improved off of Honda's engineering. Honda has an entirely different ethos to there business mantra. Honda wants to be leaders in engineering and focuses on innovation. I wish Toyota would lean towards Honda's business model.....the Honda Ridgeline just does not appeal to me lol.
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:)

Porsche was the first hybrid, yeah?

I actually like the Ridgeline, (as I have been considering getting a Subaru Forester) would be fine for 98% of the stuff I do...like commuting 5-6 days a week, hauling the dirt bike on the weekends, and the occasional camping trip through-out the year. Has a much more subdued look over the 3rd Gen Tacoma, which is too machismo for me. I have nothing to prove, and prefer the under the radar look of the Honda. Ridgeline misses a couple marks though, "ok" fuel economy, if I were to move to a unibody platform, I want at the very least 30 mpg HWY. They aren't exactly cheap either...$32K for an AWD...where you can grab a midsize basic 4WD Nissan, GM, or Toyota for around the $25K mark...heck even some fullsizes are sub $25K if you look hard enough.

That bed trunk would be perfect for my MX gear bag, or maybe a jug of fuel so it wouldn't stink up the cab, if I wanted to stash it out of sight when I am out riding the dirt bike.
 
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rruff

rruff

Explorer
Clutch said:
I for one wished they keep the trucks small, but worked on making them more efficient. Which wouldn't of taken a bunch of new tech to do so either, bring over the diesel HiLux and call it good.
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I agree but it will never happen. That motor is too under powered for the US, plus I believe Toyota wanted to avoid the shenanigans going on with diesel emissions cheating.

In the US apparently there is little demand for small trucks or even simple trucks. The Tacoma/Colorado/Ranger are not small. Those "little" trucks "need" a 300hp engine, and the fullsize need 400hp, or they are just no good ;) It's marketing. US 1/2 ton trucks are designed to be used as cars, primarily, and are marketed to guys who need a big rugged burly tall overpowered codpiece wearing monstrosity, loaded with the latest and greatest in metrosexual luxury and tech, or they feel inadequate. With visions of scaling the rockies, hunting, fishing, camping etc.

That's what drives the market and we gotta deal with what's available. I also have an '86 Toyota truck, and IMO a modestly scaled up and modernized version of that would have been perfect for my needs. Basically a T100 with a long bed and extended cab.
 
Highlander

Highlander

The Strong, Silent Type
Toyota's Kaizen business model does not support innovation.
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This is true.
However, this only apply some of Toyota's vehicle.
For example Toyota LC 70 is the same model as it was 30 years ago. They only changed dashboard and some minor decorative things.
Rest is the same as it always was.
No doubt TLC70 is best and most reliable vehicle ever built...
We don't get those trucks here but people from NZ and Australia can confirm that truck needs no update.

They do innovate when it comes to TLC200. There is huge difference between TL100 and TL200. The latter one is way more improved.

BUT This philosophy does not apply to other models as the people pointed out here.


I like Toyota. I really do. I'll be soon buying a new truck, there is 85% it will a Toyota (taco or 4R)
I am not making fun of people who likes and owns Toyota, but I don't like Toyota-America's bull**** and overpriced engineering philosophy when it comes to Trucks.

I wish they improved the Tacoma's fuel consumption and the leaf rear suspensions. A modern small truck shouldn't be using a leaf rear suspensions. Even RAM has switched to the five link rear suspensions and the Australian cousin of Nissan Frontier.
The rest is fine for me. I am happy with new 3.5 V6 and how it drives (apart from the fuel consumption)
The same for Tundra.
 
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rruff said:
I agree but it will never happen. That motor is too under powered for the US, plus I believe Toyota wanted to avoid the shenanigans going on with diesel emissions cheating.

In the US apparently there is little demand for small trucks or even simple trucks. The Tacoma/Colorado/Ranger are not small. Those "little" trucks "need" a 300hp engine, and the fullsize need 400hp, or they are just no good ;) It's marketing. US 1/2 ton trucks are designed to be used as cars, primarily, and are marketed to guys who need a big rugged burly tall overpowered codpiece wearing monstrosity, loaded with the latest and greatest in metrosexual luxury and tech, or they feel inadequate. With visions of scaling the rockies, hunting, fishing, camping etc.

That's what drives the market and we gotta deal with what's available. I also have an '86 Toyota truck, and IMO a modestly scaled up and modernized version of that would have been perfect for my needs. Basically a T100 with a long bed and extended cab.
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In total agreement with you there!

There were plans to base a little truck under the Tacoma on the Scion platform, but they all abandoned the Scion brand...and highly doubt it will ever happen. A sub $20K uni-bodied little ute with a cheap interior would be great. As you said the American market demands the appearance of toughness machoism (which most will never used, but damn they look like they do!) I loose count of trucks with empty beds running around here.

Picture+028.jpg


Ford had a Falcon UTE with a locker available in OZ for awhile.

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phsycle

phsycle

Adventurer
Subaru already tried that (twice?) and failed. US is not the right market for those type of vehicles. But if they brought the El Camino back, I would seriously consider one. :D
 
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phsycle said:
Subaru already tried that (twice?) and failed. US is not the right market for those type of vehicles. But if they brought the El Camino back, I would seriously consider one. :D
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The Baja was all about useless for bed space, I can see why it failed. Speaking of an El Camino, that blue one is a Holden which is GM.

Ridgleline is on the right track, at least the bed space is useable. Unfortunately there aren't any massive improvements for efficiency nor price over a typical mid-size truck.

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Dalko43

Explorer
rruff said:
I agree but it will never happen. That motor is too under powered for the US, plus I believe Toyota wanted to avoid the shenanigans going on with diesel emissions cheating.
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Who knows? It may yet unfold that Toyota will put a diesel in one or both of their North American pickup's. The Colorado/Canyon sales show there is a demand for such vehicles. The emissions cheating has been mostly a European issue thus far. Toyota prioritizes reliability above all else. It would make sense that they would wait a bit for the modern emissions to get worked out before throwing an emissions-compliant diesel into one of their vehicles.

rruff said:
In the US apparently there is little demand for small trucks or even simple trucks. The Tacoma/Colorado/Ranger are not small. Those "little" trucks "need" a 300hp engine, and the fullsize need 400hp, or they are just no good ;)
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The Tacoma and Colorado really aren't all that much bigger than what the overseas markets get. The North American Ranger will have pretty much the same footprint as its overseas counterpart.

So if you think North American trucks have gotten too big, then that observation applies to all trucks being made nowadays. And no, you don't need 300 hp for mid-sized and 400hp for fullsized trucks. The high demand for GM 2.8l duramax and the FCA 3.0l v6 ecodiesel prove that. 400 hp is a peak hp number. I'm less concerned with peak hp numbers and I'm far more concerned with the hp and torque curves for a particular engine (at least when it comes to trucks and 4x4's).
 
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