Alignment and stance woes following front end refresh

[SlimPickins]

Yep, me again back with an issue. I'm starting to feel like a forum problem child. This front end refresh is my first and has been a bit taxing but I have enjoyed learning my way through it, thanks to many of you. So. To back up some, 1998 Monty with 155k miles that I purchased a year and a half ago. I got through the timing belt, pulleys, tensioner, water pump/thermostat, hoses, front and rear cam seals, new crank bolt, plugs/wires, fluids. Needs valve guide seals. Been running great, loving the truck and inspired by all of the incredible builds here. Most of the front end looked original and she creaked, squeaked, popped and dove plenty so I did a refresh on the front end. All AC Delco parts from Rock Auto except for bushings which I went with OEM.

-Upper and lower control arms
The right side lower arm came with a torn ball joint boot so I replaced it with a unit from Moog. Fit right in.
Made sure upper arm shafts were correctly positioned as there is an 'in' and 'out' side.
Left side had one shim on the upper, right side had two shims on upper upon disassembly so I put 'em back in as I found them.
Torqued all to spec with wheels on the ground, unladen per manual.

-New tie rods
Again, AC Delco from RockAuto. One was made in Taiwan, the other in Eastern Europe if I recall correctly. They look different but seem to have same measurements. I got them pretty close to the measurements of the old tie rods before installing.

-New wheel bearings and seals
I somehow managed to mangle the outer bearing on the right after a quick 4 mile drive. Had to get a new hub and knuckle on the right (OEM hub and knuckle, Timken bearings).
All went together well, per preload specs in manual.

-New shocks
KYB MonoMax front and rear

-New rotors and pads (aftermarket)

-New swaybar connects and bushings, front and rear.

-New idler and pitman arm, AC Delco
Scoring on pitman arm aligned to scoring on gearbox shaft.
When doing the left upper control arm, I did turn the steering shaft manually to get to the bolts holding the control arm to frame if I recall correctly.

-Greased torsion bars and cranked them up a bit to get the front end raised to about level. This left the adjusting bolt sitting proud of spec per manual. Manual says that the bolt length above the nut should be 3.15 inches or less if I recall correctly.

Finished up, all bolts/nuts cleaned, torqued to spec, hopped in for a drive. Smoooth and quiet! My steering wheel was a full 90 degrees off... Removed and rechecked pitman arm and shaft alignment marks which were fine. Steering wheel was still off by 90 degrees.

Took it to a reputable alignment shop in Santa Monica. They told me that the camber on the right side was off by 2 degrees and that they would have to remove the shims at a minimum but that removing them would not likely be enough to solve the issue. They also said the torsion bars would need to be in spec to get a good alignment. I took the truck home and loosened my torsion bars so that the adjustment bolt was sitting above the nut by 2.8 inches which is below the "3.15 inches or less" stated in the manual. This really lowered the front end compared to the rear and gives the truck a decent amount of rake which doesn't look quite right (torsion re-index?). I measured both sides from the fender well to the center of the hub, both even at 25.5 inches if I remember correctly, took it back to the shop and they did the alignment. They had to remove the pitman arm and misalign it to the shaft by one or two teeth to get the steering wheel straight. I lost a bit of turning radius on right hand turns. They said the alignment wasn't perfectly to spec and that the only way to really get it there would be to lower the front end even more by further loosening torsion bars.. Even they agreed that this would make the truck look really funky and raked far too forward. He said if I were to tighten the torsion bars to level the truck, this would throw the alignment too far off and that they wouldn't be able to correct it. The shop owner wasn't really sure why things were off. He said the install looked fine but went on to say that a couple of times over the years he'd seen even OEM parts made incorrectly causing strange fits/numbers. My money is on noob error somewhere but neither of us could sort out where. He didn't see anything that cued him off to a wreck in the truck's history but the CarFax mentions an accident in California in 2004, no further details. I'm thinking that if it were a bad accident, it'd have a salvage title..

So I'm sitting on a brand new, mostly aligned front end, a misaligned pitman arm, a mostly aligned steering wheel with a slight but noticeable decrease in right handed turning radius and a stance that has the front end noticeably lower than the front.

I realize this is damn winded but I know that a diagnosis requires detail... Any ideas?

 

['round n' back again]

i believe i'm the problem child around here.

what ever became of your bearing issue. did you ever get any clear idea?


i fear the same when i go into the alignment shop as im tearing out the entire front end and replacing with. all new parts. i have no reference points; i dont even have specs to give them

the idea that comes to mind is this: gen 2 monteros that i see on the road all have a bit of rake to them. likely from tired springs, but perhaps that is a factory rake?
second
consider a second opinion at a different shop.
Where does the mitsu dealer send their customer cars?
not that its any better than what you got-just different.

 

[Toasty]

A few things, before you align you need to set your ride height where YOU want it and evenly on both sides. This might take you some time but get it where you want it visually height wise and adjust it little by little measuring from a control arm to the frame (gap between bumpstops for example).
Then the camber, think of the "OUT" cast into the UCA shaft as your coarse adjustment. One side is clearly thicker than the other, keep this in mind if you end up needing more than 2 thick shims on a side. You shouldn't use more than 2 shims per side because you will run into issues with them working loose.

Most Monteros have 1 thick and one thin shim on one side and 1 thin shim on the other stock, these things are pretty consistent.

 

[PacS14]

This is also something I need to keep in mind when I refresh my front suspension, please man keep us updated as this will be something I might have to deal with, and I'm sure it'll help others in the future. Good luck hopefully is something relatively easy to correct, that was just overlooked.

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['round n' back again]

Toast.

Nice info from a man thets been there.

Turn the spindle so the word "out" is facing toward the wheel.
begin there and shim as necessary.

but of course we don't know what is necessary shim without spec from mitsu.

Is there a spec that is/can be published for alignment?
rough numbers we can get to with an angle finder?

there was perhaps an FSM published online. was that for the montero? or one of my other rigs i just cannot remember.

 

[ssatellite]

I'll be following this as my steering wheel is off ~45° with a noticeably reduced turning radius to the right. Saw somewhere to detach the steering shaft from the box fix and reattach, but maybe it'll be more complicated.

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[SlimPickins]

Thank you guys for the input. Keep it coming! So today I double checked that the upper control arm shafts are facing the correct direction. Unfortunately the AC Delco arms don't have the word 'out' stamped into them like the original units so I did it by shape comparison as the outside and inside of the shaft have different lines. They appear to be correct. I also ended up re-indexing and cranking the torsion bars back to factory spec per manual today as the lower control arm bumper was contacting the bump stop where the shop had it. There is now a space just under an inch between the rubber bumper and the stop, again, per manual. I'm sure the alignment is now off. The shop had removed the shims on the right and loosened torsion bars/lowered front as they said the camber needed to be more negative. I believe cranking the torsion bars as I did today makes the camber more positive..? Now that they've removed the shims, there is no way to counteract the positive camber caused by me resetting the height to factory spec through torsion bar tightening, correct? That is the issue they said they would run into but they lowered it/loosened the torsion bars so much that the rubber bumper was mashed against the stop plate. It seems to drive ok but the tires look off when observing from the front. I just have no idea why new parts would cause both the steering wheel to be off and the alignment to get so wacky. I'd think if the frame were bent then it'd be tough to get the control arms installed and to have the CV shaft, knuckle and hub all go together correctly which they did. I'm baffled and not entirely sure what my next step should be. I think if I go back to the shop they'll just tell me, 'we told ya so' and won't be able to take out any of the positive camber now. Why the hell would new parts (and yeah, noob installer..) lead to this? I'll keep checking in for guidance and to update any progress. Thank you all.

 

[Toasty]

Cut your losses and fire that shop. Kind of sounds like you just need to start over, this stuff isn't hard. Another thing you need to stop is trying to get your ride height to spec by measuring the bolt, I'm guessing your springs have some 180k miles on them so they will never hit the new spec again. The passenger side gets heated from the exhaust so both sides won't adjust the same.

You can do this, you just need to rethink your strategy and probably be a good idea to get a new shop.

 

[tlr]

I think it might be your aftermarket control arms. I ran into the same issues but I used Moog upper control arms to replace the worn out oem uppers. Went to a few different shops for alignments and had issues Everytime. Multiple shims both sides. One side actually came loose cause of all the shims. I went and found oem upper control arms in the salvage yard installed new ball joints and ADD bushings. Set ride height I'm an inch higher in the front and I have 1.5" springs in the back btw. Went and got an alignment one thin shim on passenger side and I was good to go. Truck drives great now. Hope this helps.

 

[mudraider]

Hmmmm. More issues after installing another, Moog part. A different part than others have had issues with, but a Moot part just the same. Sounds like stock arms rebushed with ADD parts is going to be the best bet. Hoping you kept them. And fire that shop like Toasty said.

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[jlocster]

Slim, try Byron Woodley in Santa Monica for alignment. I had problems at another shop with talk of the front end not being able to be set to spec after a torsion bar crank. Byron Woodley figured it out no problem. I think it ran me $100 bucks a few years back...money well spent.

 

[SlimPickins]

Thanks, will check them out! Much appreciated. I'm still waiting to free up some time to head back to the alignment shop. Truck is now relatively level and at a height I like per Toasty's advice. I did re-index the torsion bars by one tooth and the arms are still up into the frame when torqued. IF I end up needing to get new bushings and reinstall the old OEM control arm, is it just the upper that I need to redo if camber is the issue? I don't think Mitsu sells the upper shaft bushings separately so sounds like I'd have to go with ADD per thread. I ordered some new OEM rear spring pads as I plan on installing the Old Man Emu rear coil springs that are sitting patiently in the garage so perhaps its better to do the alignment once this is complete.
Toasty, I saw an old thread that you posted on with The Mole regarding aligning the steering wheel by removing the 12mm bolt at steering linkage near the left side upper control arm and then 'pulling back' and re-aligning the link to steering box. When you say pull back, do you mean on the steering wheel itself while sitting in the truck or from under the wheel well? Is this difficult to pull back on? Things look slightly rusted in there so I'm wondering if I need some (special) tools to disconnect the linkage after removing the bolt... Again, thank you all for your help. What a terrific community. I'll post up some pics on whatever I end up doing to help contribute some.

 

['round n' back again]

he means to pull back on the joint attached to the splined shaft at the steering gear.

this looks like a u joint if you pull the rubber back.
remove the bolt completely, grasp firmly and dont let go till she slides back. wiggle the ujoint pry with device if necessary it'll come along.

the steering wheel is designed to collapse in an accident . the shaft under the hood slides one insider the other. so you can manually disconnect and use that sliding feature to reset your wheel orientation.

of course its quite important that you reattach everything properly after alignment duh.

you may have to do this 2 or three times until you are comfortable with the result.

 

[NickSchmaus]

Edited

 

[NickSchmaus]

Hey just did a front end refresh too . Same problem with steering. It's set all wrong now, can't even steer left lol. Any trick to centering the wheel up?