1995 K2500 Suburban - Auto or Manual?

t0mills

t0mills

Adventurer
Which would you rather have in that vehicle?


I've got a '95 K2500 burb with a 7.4L V8, and it had a bad 4L80e tranny.

I pulled the tranny and transfer case out and rebuilt both of them. They are ready to go back in, but today, a friend called with an offer that's really making me think.


He's got a 1995 1ton 4x4 Chevy that he is robbing the motor out of (7.4L) to use in a crawler project. He wants an automatic transmission to run.
So, he proposed a trade. He's got a brand new clutch/pressure plate to go with the NV4500, and since his truck is also a 1995, he will give me everything I need to convert my burb to a manual gearbox (Pedals, Master Cyl, Lines..ect)


So, what do you guys think? I do have a lot of experience driving a manual transmission, so that's not an issue. I'm just curious to hear your opinions if you were in this situation.
 
C

chasespeed

Explorer
Well, I think that depends on YOU more than anything. Me personally, there are so many PROS to the manual, that the one or 2 things the auto beats it out.... are irrelevant....

the 4500 is a STOUT trans....keep oil in it... and it will last...
Manuals are more efficient(and with your 454, more tank range is gonna be a BONUS).....
Maintenance is pretty basic.... and cheaper, even when you toast the clutch... its cheaper than a torque converter....

Much better for working, and puttering at low speeds than a auto, simply due to temps, without the need for a cooler the size of your radiator....

Now, I drive that trans behind a worked over cummins... and the Cummins NV4500 has a different 1st gear(granny gear, which your 454 MAY HAVE if its listed as L123OD).......

The only advantages I see with the auto, are, QUICKER acceleration, and MUCH MUCH easier to drive at crawl speeds, and in traffic....

My 2 cents....

Chase
 
t0mills

t0mills

Adventurer
I'm really considering it.

I like the simplicity of the NV. Say the clutch master cyl, or slave cyl went out, I could still drive the thing anywhere I needed to go.

The clutch fork broke on my 350z a few months back, when I was 40mi from home. I was able to match revs and get the car back home safely. No big deal.
However, if something comparable were to happen to an auto, you probably wouldn't make it very far.


Anyone want to guess what the difference in fuel mileage would be?
 
t0mills

t0mills

Adventurer
chasespeed said:
Well, I think that depends on YOU more than anything. Me personally, there are so many PROS to the manual, that the one or 2 things the auto beats it out.... are irrelevant....

the 4500 is a STOUT trans....keep oil in it... and it will last...
Manuals are more efficient(and with your 454, more tank range is gonna be a BONUS).....
Maintenance is pretty basic.... and cheaper, even when you toast the clutch... its cheaper than a torque converter....

Much better for working, and puttering at low speeds than a auto, simply due to temps, without the need for a cooler the size of your radiator....

Now, I drive that trans behind a worked over cummins... and the Cummins NV4500 has a different 1st gear(granny gear, which your 454 MAY HAVE if its listed as L123OD).......

The only advantages I see with the auto, are, QUICKER acceleration, and MUCH MUCH easier to drive at crawl speeds, and in traffic....

My 2 cents....

Chase
Click to expand...



Didn't see your post when I replied! Must have quick fingers! :ylsmoke:


You hit the nail on the head with your comparison. The auto is much easier when putting around.
This particular NV4500 has the 5.61 first gear ratio, which I believe is the "granny gear".

That should make it pretty easy to take off on a steep incline!

A quick run of the crawl calculator puts me at:

62.5:1 with the NV and NP241 combo

27.6:1 with the 4L80 and NP241 combo

That's with the stock 4.10 axle gears.


The overdrive ratio seems to be the same on both transmissions (0.75), so my cruising RPM will remain the same.


Has anyone had any experience changing from an auto to a manual?

I figure that SHOULD be pretty easy, since I have a donor vehicle of the same year to rob parts off of. Both vehicles have the same motor and t-case, and both have the Hydraboost setup (in case that makes a difference for the clutch master cyl - space wise).
 
C

chasespeed

Explorer
NOt in your particular rig... but, mine started as a 24v/auto..

Anyway, pull the carpet, see if there is a plate to remove, or if you have to cut it out....if you have to cut, just take the measurements from the other truck...

Under the dash, remove the pedal hanger as an assy, and replace... There MIGHT already be a hole with a plug in it for the clutch pedal rod....

Basically, start with the removal of the trans, and parts from the donor, try to remove as much stuff as an assy, as possible......

Try to swap the ECMs as well, and you will need to work in a way to fool the P/N switch(depending on how its done on that truck), etc....

Chase
 
ntsqd

ntsqd

Heretic Car Camper
t0mills said:
A quick run of the crawl calculator puts me at:

62.5:1 with the NV and NP241 combo

27.6:1 with the 4L80 and NP241 combo

That's with the stock 4.10 axle gears.
Click to expand...
Something to keep in mind is that when the converter is not stalled or locked-up
that it offers a torque multiplication ranging up to about 2.6:1 depending on the individual converter. So best case that 27.6:1 could really be 71.8:1!

I own both, but the manuals are not in full sizes. When the V8 goes into the FJ60 it will be with a bowtieoverdrives.com 700R4 behind it.
 
Bella PSD

Bella PSD

Explorer
May not matter in your case but on a Superduty going from the auto to a 6 speed you also need the larger floor pan (hump). The manual is just bigger and the floor needs to be larger as well. Chevy may be the same?? Just my 2 cents. Good luck and good move up to a real tranny!:)

Louie
 
t0mills

t0mills

Adventurer
Good info guys!! Thanks for your help!


The simplicity of the NV is starting to win me over. I personally rebuilt that 4L80e, and know EXACTLY how many moving parts there are that could go wrong and leave you stranded.


My ultimate goals for the suburban are a Dana 60 front axle swap, and a Cummins 6BT. I know that adapting the 4L80e to the 6BT, requires a kit that runs up near a $1000.

How about adapting that NV4500 to the diesel? It's just a different bellhousing, right?
 
t0mills

t0mills

Adventurer
Rot Box said:
Simplicity rules in my book as does function over form :elkgrin:

Typically the best way to adapt the Cummins engine to an NV4500 is to just find the Dodge bellhousing and clutch. Oh and this would help you bolt the engine between your Suburban rails http://www.avalancheengineering.com/new_products.html
Click to expand...



Yeah, I figured that I could just swap the bellhousing and clutch setup. I think that would be cheaper than buying the adapter kit for the 4L80e.


Wow, Avalanche Eng. really makes that swap easy!! I see that they are currently working on a bolt-in crossmember for my burb! That's awesome.
 
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