2006 Suburban Build

[teddyrevenge]

First and foremost, hello to everyone. First post here, but been an avid reader of expedition portal ever since I moved to Colorado a year and a half ago.
My main purpose for starting this thread is to get peoples insight and expertise while I'm going through this build. After reading through several of the threads already, I noticed that alot of ya'll have incredible insight and suggestions. Yes there are the naysayers out there. But together I think we can pull this off.

Definitely not new to the offroading scene. I've been doing it since I was 16 and had an '85 K10. However, growing up in the south, it was all mud pits and biggest tire size wins. Now that I'm in Colorado, I've started trying out trail riding and it is amazing. When I first came here, I used a '97 K1500 that was bone stock and 34 inch mud terrains. For the most part it took me everywhere I wanted to go. Also it just wouldn't die. 270k miles and the only thing replaced has been the transmission, tie rods and one wheel bearing.

But lets get onto the suburban shall we

2006 GMT 800 Suburban 4x4. Not a Z71 but it sits as high as one. Also no locker. And even worse it has 3.42 gears. I was passed by a kid on roller blades when I tried out 34 inch tires on it. It does have a DVD player so I can play squirrel videos for the dogs though.

-So first and foremost, the gears have to go. Hoping to find something at the junkyard. I'm going with 4.10 due to the versatility of the gear with up to 35 inch tires. I won't be hauling a trailer, just the dogs and supplies for a few days out on the trail.
-Next is building a custom roof rack to attach to the side frames. Roof rack is planned to cover most of the roof front to back (haven't decided on 3/4 inch or 1 inch tube yet), with lights all the way around. Also will have quick disconnects for the lights and so I can easily remove the rack when its just being used as a daily driver. I recently had an FJ that had 360 lights and let me tell you, you dont think you need them until you do. And they're amazing.
-While the roof rack is in works, so will skid plates. Not really sure how much I want to cover though, so input would be nice by people who have been doing Colorado trails in full size vehicles.
-After that will be a 4 inch lift. Currently thinking BDS. Reason for this is I want slightly more articulation, but nothing crazy. I know several of ya'll are running stock with larger tires and doing great, but there have been several times where I wish I had slightly more articulation.
- With the lift kit, I will also be doing front coilover conversion as well as a front diff swap from a 2500 that way I can put a locker up front. I'm hoping it 'll be easier to do all this at once, rather than piece it together over time.
Im leaning towards Atomic for the coilover conversion, the only concern I have is he doesn't have a bolt on engine cross bar like JD Fab does. Hopefully those of you running the coilover conversion can give me some insight if yall have had any
problems with the frame buckling in due to the extra stress.
-After the lift 35 - 37 inch tires will be put on. If I have found a 6 lug 14 bolt that fits right up to a suburban, that will go in as well. But no rush on that.

During this time I will also be looking for bumpers, winches and air compressors. But that is not on the top of the list, as I will just avoid trails that need them until I find them for a good price.

There are 2 things that will be accomplished with this build. First I will do everything myself, as most of ya'll already due. Luckily, thanks to multiple uncles, I'm a pretty good mechanic, welder and hammer beater. Second, I want to build this with parts that may not be top of the line, but with some cheap home remedies, you can make them just as good or better. For instance, I took a pair of $20 Nilights off of amazon, took them apart, put a bead of high heat silicone around it, then mounted them on the K1500. That was 7 years ago and they still light up the night everytime I hit the swtich. And I have been rough on them. Take that Rigid... wanting $230 for the same thing.

Help and comments are much appreciated during this build. More so, cause I have a problem of spending money on things until I find something that works. And that gets expensive fast.

Also let me go ahead and answer a couple questions yall will probably throw my way.

-Why don't you just continue using the K1500 you ask.
Good question. I already had 2 dogs, the smallest being 75lbs, and then decided to get a third dog that wasn't supposed to be more than a 100lbs. As of right now, he's 8 months old and 120lbs. Slightly cramped in the truck.

-Why not just buy a truck topper? It would have been cheaper than building a suburban.
Because I want my dogs to have AC on long road trips. Thats right. I didn't buy a suburban because I have a family, I bought it so all 3 of my dogs could be comfortable while trail riding in the summer.

-Why not just start out with a 2500. Everything is already stronger.
Very true. But A) gas mileage. This thing is still gonna be a daily driver.
B) I eventually will move back down to the south, and have you ever tried to pull a 2500 out of the mud? Better bring a tractor.
C) I'm not pulling anything that requires the power or strength of a 2500.
D) GM decided not to put a Duramax in their GMT800 2500 suburbans and I'm not spending $25k on one thats had the swap done. (Yes that's how much a used one was going for)
-Why didn't you buy a Suburban with better gears in it already.
This one was very clean AND had a DVD player for the dogs.

Thanks for coming to my TED talk.

 

[rayra]

Sounds like good plans for the lift components, @CrazyDrei @Burb One can give you a lot of real-use info and experience with such.

You're gonna want some cordura seat covers and liners for the back doors and cargo, big dog nails will tear up the interior in a hurry.
While you are hunting parts in the auto wrecking yard, try to find some new / replacement 2nd row door thresholds, you're going to need them.

I've got a lot of useful GMT800 maintenance and project pics in the two links in my sig

 

[1stDeuce]

Man, you've got big plans, and high hopes for your new dog hauler...

It came later in your manifesto, but the first thing I'd do is to look for a 14 bolt SF out of an older 1500 or LD 2500 truck, which can already have 4:10's. Carefully cut your brackets off and weld them to the new axle. Put a lunchbox locker in it and go. That keeps the 6 bolt pattern and gets you a rear axle that isn't already at the limit of it's possibilities. (There was a version of the 14SF that came in trucks like yours, but it didn't come with 4:10's, so that's why I suggest the other way. Gears are expensive...)

I don't think the lift and 2500 front diff swap is going to be the hot ticket to anything but a lot of wasted $$. The IFS burb isn't going to have more articulation because you lifted it, nor because you switched to coilovers.

If you do manage a gear swap, you're also going to want a programmer of some sort to let the powertrain know that it's running through 4:10s and not 3:42's anymore, and to correct the speedo.

The front suspension on IFS just doesn't flex like a solid axle does. If you really think you want it to flex, go right to a SFA conversion and don't even look back.

For a bit better ride quality, you can pull the front sway bar, but then keep it off the highway, because it'll wind up and kill you if you ever have to do an evasive maneuver. I run one of my 3/4 ton trucks this way, but it doesn't see highway... Big improvement in ride quality, but a double lane change above about 50mph requires driving skill that most people don't possess!

Honestly, with a locker in the rear and a 4" lift with 33's, your IFS burb is going to be virtually unstoppable on most Colorado pass roads, and it'll ride pretty well too. IMO, it would probably do 90% of those roads with 285's and just a little bit of lift.

Skid plates.... IMO, if you're banging on skid plates much at all, it's time to reconsider either your trail choices, your rig choice, or your driving style... I found a heavy aluminum skid for the front of my 2500, but I've hardly ever touched it down. I didn't even put the back half on. Nobody makes decent skids for GM Trucks that I'm aware of.

On the GMT800 HD platform, the trans crossmember hangs down below the frame. It is usually the first thing I scrape, and the reason I can't go any farther when the going gets rough. The GMT400's had a better trans crossmember design that was tucked up into the framerail. Might be worth looking into swapping that if your 1500 is the same. I think my fat drivetrain would probably destroy the GMT400 unit, but yours is a lot lighter, and you'd gain quite a bit of mobility without the center ground anchor hanging down.

If you really want to push things, I'd suggest your premise that a 2500 was not for you is simply wrong. The issue with a half ton burb, IMO, is that it was really designed for on-road use. At GVW, most of the suspension and axles are fairly stressed, but with the intended on-road use, not really an issue. Head offroad with things at or near the limits, and you've got breakage or bendage at least... In clay or mud you're just going to spin, but on rocks, you're going to twist an axle shaft. You'll need to drive carefully, especially as the tires get bigger. Simply put, your half ton burb is heavy enough to hurt itself if you use it hard offroad. In contrast, the 3/4 ton burb has the heavier axles and suspension, but the overall weight doesn't go up by that much. It will handle being loaded and used a bit rougher, and the driveline will do OK with larger tires and the stress that comes with them.

If you want to nosedive headlight deep in mud and get pulled out by your buddies when you get back home, a 'burb of any kind is going to get you left for dead sooner or later. Even with the half ton, you'll probably want to consider that you're now the tugger, not the tugee, and you need to be careful not to flop into the biggest hole you can find, assuming that your buddies little pickups can pull you out.

Don't know what trails you've run so far in CO, but most of the "trails" in this state are just high mountain pass roads that can be run in about anything with decent clearance and low range. Bumpers don't really come into play, nor do winches. Most of the time, when the trail gets really tough, there's nothing to winch to anyway. They're are virtually NO muddy trails in Colorado. (I knew of one, but that section got re-routed and closed...) A little mud over rocks here and there, sure, but what you're used to in the southern states (or the midwest, where I'm from) does not exist here unless you're off the trail in some field where you shouldn't be in the first place.

Roof rack, interior mods, etc all sound appropriate. Get out and get camping, and other opportunities will reveal themselves. Start with the easy stuff and enjoy it, and it'll tell you what needs to be done first.

Keep updating this thread, it's always good to see what others do...

 

[Burb One]

Hey! Sounds like you've got a good plan. I think rarya posted a thread somewhere that collated all the gmt-800 rigs somewhere. I'd start there- almost all of the point you made have been plus and minusesd out here (sounds like maybe you've read those too)

A few things

4.10s are worth it for 35's. It's cheaper to find a 14 bolt and a front diff if you search around over even rebuilding the 1500 diffs yourself. That's if you get lucky with the 14 bolt... 2500 4.10 front diffs go for $150 on craigslist. 14 bolt sf's seem to go between 500-1500 depending on luck. Check local and then if time is essence copart always has them listed.

If the 10 bolt you have now is a g80 and you do some real wheelin- it will fail. Theres not much on the gmt800 that will strand you, but that's one of them. 14 bolt sf is bolt in, no welding etc.- needed only thing you need is a different u joint. The 14 bolt g80 has been reliable for us. One of the trucks we have has an arb in the 14 bolt- which is also awesome if in the budget. Front 2500 diff with a lift kit is just figuring out and welding one mounting point depending on your lift kit and shortening the driveshaft. 100% worth it. We have no problems with 2500 cv's anymore at stock power levels on three identical "2500'd 1500's"). I'd recommend reading my build thread for all these details.

Coilovers kit makes a HUGE difference. 100% worth the money when the time comes. I have the first ever lifted atomic kit and it's been awesome. I will say we have had one or two problems with the qa1 coilivers. They seem to start having problems after 10-15k mikes. If doing it from scratch, king or fox might be worth the money off the bat. Also, with my welding skills now what they are and just that itch for always more- I've been thinking of going bigger with the front coils and making hoops- you seem to like to do things yourself so I would say that might be worth looking into. My 5.3 has 250k miles on it and when it goes I'll probably do a 6.0 swap and front coilovers hoops and cross bar all in one go. However the atomic kit with some nice coilovers in them will do everything you want the truck to do except for jumping.

Everyone keeps saying 2500's are better than 1500's for this type of stuff. I disagree. Yes the 2500 is dead simple reliable from the get go. However if you put a few k into a 1500 it's just a different animal. The 1500 multilink rear is just a game changer compared to the 2500 leafs off road. Especially with spoohn or equivalent rear arms, you can get some crazy flex in the rear with bolt ons. The coilovers kit (and 2500 front diff) makes it a pretty capable ifs front end. This type of ifs front/multilink rear is just ideal for most of the off roading we all do. I've been through some hairy ********. It will "rock crawl" as well as any 18 ft heavy truck, but in reality I'm not out looking for obstacles. I want the thing to get through any obstacle, or avoid any obstacle in the trail and get me to my destination, in any weather. A well setup 1500 gmt800 can do that with 5, even 8, people quickly and comfortably. Plus it can cost <15k all said and done. Not sure what else is out there that can do that. If I was taking this thing to the Rubicon every weekend- then yes I'd sfa this thing 4 years ago, but the washboards, forest roads and fields I find myself on most often, the setup is more ideal than a sfa setup. Also for a lifted, softly sprung 9000lb truck, the ifs has amazing road manners.

Also get a transmission cooler-, a big one. The stock 4L60e, while it lets you know a few k before it does, will die at some point. When it goes there's some upgrades your rebuilder can do that will.make it last forever, that or just go to a 6.0 and 4L80e at the same time. It's not a hard swap, all electronics are exactly the same. Just one harness adapter and cross member modification.

 

[Burb One]

Also for skid plates- any of the lift kits have decent protection.

You will need real rock sliders and either buy or make a slide plate for the transfer case.

Ive had on my list for so long to make something for the gas tank but never came up with anything. My #1 thought for my line is always to protect it, and never been in a position where that failed (even on the Rubicon). It might just be a matter of time though, it's not in a great place and is plastic.

Also I fabbed up some cages for the rear sway bar mounts you end up squishing them on trail all the time.

 

[CrazyDrei]

Welcome!

I like how you think and your experience with past trucks will help you make your Sub the perfect puppy hauler. Too bad you won't be able to hook them into a harness and mush you out if you get stuck.

I think you are absolutely on the right track, or at least pretty much exactly the same track as I am.

Definitely do the rack with 360 lighting first. It's cheap, relatively quick and easy, especially if you have the tools and have done it before.

Gears, gears, gears. Well I was brought up with a saying: don't fear the gear. However I had 3.73 gears and 35" tires which ran closer to 34" and never crawled or actually needed anything lower. In your case I would do 4.10. Main reason is that a rear master install kit with gears will run you about $200 on eBay and it's not that difficult to change out gears yourself. Front diffs that have 4.10 factory pop up online and at junk yards for around $100, takes 30 mins to change it out, finding one takes a little longer. If you are sure you want a 9.25" front diff, then just look for one in 4.10, so much more common than 8.25" 4.10 fronts. I actually have an extra 9.25" 4.10 diff sitting in my garage. Since you will also be installing an air locker up front, get yourself a detroit locker for the rear. G80 locker is great low budget alternative which pop up on eBay for $100 or less regularly. I kaboomed my G80 doing something stupid, and still drove it almost 200 miles back home at highway speeds. Played with an elocker and fried it on the first trip, detroit locker has been bulletproof and amazing.

I would try F150 torsion keys and 3" rear spacers before any lift kits. Not sure your thoughts on body lifts, but 3" lift and some generous trimming gets you high enough to clear 37" tires, might be somehting to conciser before you drop the money of a BDS lift, which is fantastic especially with Atomic fab coilover kit.

Good luck and can't wait to see your build and adventures!

 

[rayra]

eta I'm finally aligned after a lot of suspension refreshing / replacement and a torsion key 'leveling' with about 1.75" added in front and 2" coil spacer in the rear. And 2" wheel spacers. I'm sitting at a little over 14" clearance at the frame rails on stock 265/70-17 tires. It's enough for my forestry road and dry wash farting around.


@Burb One I made large strides towards a tank plate design a couple weeks ago when I did my fuel pump swap and had the tank completely off the vehicle. I'm still fiddling with attachment methods, trying to figure somethign that won't damage the tank if the plate gets hung up. But mostly it's just a plan to put a 3/16" alum. plate on the bottom of the tank, as a second skin / double hull. Either attached by the factory tank straps or possibly by a second set of straps installed over the tank straps, sandwichign the plate onto the tank. I have the full template in 1/8" pressboard with a few more mods to it to come. I intend to do that in June.

I'm running out of time fast, finishing a two-year degree right now and more classes in the summer school session and we are very likely putting the house up for sale midsummer and getting out of CA. So the plate projects are all in the 'get it done asap or not for another year+' phase. That includes a sheet of UHDPE ('Starboard') for my MkIII/IV roof deck

Just did a lot more undercarriage work, pulled that four link and track bar all apart and lubed absolutely everything to get rid of leaks and inspect. Need some new track bar bushings. And sometime in the next few weeks it's new rear bearings and seals and some powerstop Z23 rotors and pads for the back (to go along with the fronts, already long in place). Might wind up doing a lot of camper-trailer towing in the late fall and into the winter so I'm focusing hard on the last of the undercarriage and drivetrain stuff.

Anyway, more in my build topic as work proceeds. Goingto be a very busy couple of months.

 

[teddyrevenge]

So decided to put the 33.5's back on and take a cruise on Phantom Canyon Road as a test run with the dogs/ see how the suburban did. Overall I was very pleased with how it handled. I am going to have to do some trimming on the plastic guards at the wheel wells. The 3.42 gears didn't do as bad as I thought they would, so since most of ya'll are recommending the 14 bolt swap, I'm just going to look for that and keep the 3.42 gears for the time being. Next weekend, the plans are to actually take it out for a camping trip up near 11 Mile. There are some decent trails and hills over there where I can see how it will climb.

 

[teddyrevenge]

Sounds like good plans for the lift components, @CrazyDrei @Burb One can give you a lot of real-use info and experience with such.

You're gonna want some cordura seat covers and liners for the back doors and cargo, big dog nails will tear up the interior in a hurry.
While you are hunting parts in the auto wrecking yard, try to find some new / replacement 2nd row door thresholds, you're going to need them.

I've got a lot of useful GMT800 maintenance and project pics in the two links in my sig

Thanks for the advice. Seat covers never even crossed my mind, but now that you mention it, I will probably go with Marathon seat covers. I've had a set in the K1500 for 7 years now, and those things are built like tanks. No rips or tears and best of all they're camo, so it does an amazing job of hiding the dirt.

One thing I am toying with the idea of is going a slightly different route than most, and taking the middle seats out, then creating a storage compartment under there. Possibly using some thick plexiglass to make a top and have space for tools and whatnot underneath it.

 

[teddyrevenge]

Man, you've got big plans, and high hopes for your new dog hauler...

The front suspension on IFS just doesn't flex like a solid axle does. If you really think you want it to flex, go right to a SFA conversion and don't even look back.

For a bit better ride quality, you can pull the front sway bar, but then keep it off the highway, because it'll wind up and kill you if you ever have to do an evasive maneuver. I run one of my 3/4 ton trucks this way, but it doesn't see highway... Big improvement in ride quality, but a double lane change above about 50mph requires driving skill that most people don't possess!

Keep updating this thread, it's always good to see what others do...

Unfortunately I can't pull the front sway bar, because the only road to work and back is highway for 30 miles each way. Do you know of anyone that makes a quick disconnect for the sway bars? If I can find something like that, then I would be in business.

The SFA conversion will come later in life. Once I'm in retirement and finally decide to put 40 inch tires on the thing. Until then, the IFS will stay due to a limited budget.

 

[teddyrevenge]

Welcome!

I like how you think and your experience with past trucks will help you make your Sub the perfect puppy hauler. Too bad you won't be able to hook them into a harness and mush you out if you get stuck.

I think you are absolutely on the right track, or at least pretty much exactly the same track as I am.

Definitely do the rack with 360 lighting first. It's cheap, relatively quick and easy, especially if you have the tools and have done it before.

Gears, gears, gears. Well I was brought up with a saying: don't fear the gear. However I had 3.73 gears and 35" tires which ran closer to 34" and never crawled or actually needed anything lower. In your case I would do 4.10. Main reason is that a rear master install kit with gears will run you about $200 on eBay and it's not that difficult to change out gears yourself. Front diffs that have 4.10 factory pop up online and at junk yards for around $100, takes 30 mins to change it out, finding one takes a little longer. If you are sure you want a 9.25" front diff, then just look for one in 4.10, so much more common than 8.25" 4.10 fronts. I actually have an extra 9.25" 4.10 diff sitting in my garage. Since you will also be installing an air locker up front, get yourself a detroit locker for the rear. G80 locker is great low budget alternative which pop up on eBay for $100 or less regularly. I kaboomed my G80 doing something stupid, and still drove it almost 200 miles back home at highway speeds. Played with an elocker and fried it on the first trip, detroit locker has been bulletproof and amazing.

I would try F150 torsion keys and 3" rear spacers before any lift kits. Not sure your thoughts on body lifts, but 3" lift and some generous trimming gets you high enough to clear 37" tires, might be somehting to conciser before you drop the money of a BDS lift, which is fantastic especially with Atomic fab coilover kit.

Good luck and can't wait to see your build and adventures!

Im planning on doing Detroit Lockers for the front and rear diff. I'd rather have something reliable and bulletproof, than having to worry about if I'm going to blow out a locker on the trail.

I'm definitely not opposed to the Ford Keys and body lift, but I'm trying to do this without spending extra money. If I can find some for a fantastic deal, then they will go in while I'm waiting for the lift.

 

[CrazyDrei]

Unfortunately I can't pull the front sway bar, because the only road to work and back is highway for 30 miles each way.

Just a thought on disconnecting the sway bars. I ran no front sway bar with my Atomic Fab coilover kit and adjusted the front compression and rebound dampening correctly. No issues at all after 2 months of driving without front sway bar. It actually drove better than with torsion bars and sway bar. I put the sway bar back on because I needed it to keep the front articulation down and prolong the life of CVs, ball joints and tie rods when running hard off road.

 

[CrazyDrei]

Im planning on doing Detroit Lockers for the front and rear diff. I'd rather have something reliable and bulletproof, than having to worry about if I'm going to blow out a locker on the trail.

I'm definitely not opposed to the Ford Keys and body lift, but I'm trying to do this without spending extra money. If I can find some for a fantastic deal, then they will go in while I'm waiting for the lift.

Keys and coils spacers are around $80 on eBay for both of them. As far as the body lift goes, I got lucky and got it for free when I helped a friend take his out so he could sell his truck. Spacers are cheap, bolts are cheap, bumper brackets and steering shaft extender are the tricky parts. Can be circumvented with a custom bumper.

Also if you do want more front wheel travel I would just go with the BDS lift and Atomic Fab coilover kit. BurbOne pretty much did what you want to do three times now and has been an inspiration to myself and so many others.

 

[teddyrevenge]

@Burb One How has the Rough Country lift worked out for you?
Although I would really like the BDS lift, the rough country is about a $1000 cheaper and seeing as how I will be installing the atomic, Im debating if its worth it for the BDS components. Not worried about the shocks, just how the components have stood up over time.

 

[teddyrevenge]

Just a thought on disconnecting the sway bars. I ran no front sway bar with my Atomic Fab coilover kit and adjusted the front compression and rebound dampening correctly. No issues at all after 2 months of driving without front sway bar. It actually drove better than with torsion bars and sway bar. I put the sway bar back on because I needed it to keep the front articulation down and prolong the life of CVs, ball joints and tie rods when running hard off road.

Did you ever run it without a sway bar in the rear?