Hemtt/ Define America Project

Doin_It

Adventurer
109 Pretender says:

Our interstates were designed for a max of around 40,000lbs. and this has become a problem when the NAFTA treaty was signed because Canada and Mexico run triple axle loads weighing as much as 70K+.

Actually, legal weight is 80,000 GVW within all of the 48. Permits can be had for more weight on a one off basisf or a non-reduceable load. (The permit process all starts when a project is in the design stage to be sure they can even move it down the road)

Any Canadian/Mexican trucker comming into the US must abide by 80,000 GVW, not only that, but they also must have the correct axle spread which can (and often is) different in Canada or Mexico.

Here's how we do it up here -

[ame="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-D47Ga9NVtY"]YouTube - Juggernaut...one more of the heavy hauling to Fort McMurray.[/ame]
 

asdean

New member
109 Pretender says:



Actually, legal weight is 80,000 GVW within all of the 48. Permits can be had for more weight on a one off basisf or a non-reduceable load. (The permit process all starts when a project is in the design stage to be sure they can even move it down the road)

Any Canadian/Mexican trucker comming into the US must abide by 80,000 GVW, not only that, but they also must have the correct axle spread which can (and often is) different in Canada or Mexico.

Here's how we do it up here -

YouTube - Juggernaut...one more of the heavy hauling to Fort McMurray.


Something tells me we don't need a truck that big :Wow1:
 

Doc Mach

New member
Hemmet

Adam,
I've seen some very good points on why a Hemmet would not be a good choice for an all terrain R.V., but as a contractor in Iraq I had the opportunity to be part of the PLS section. I am sure you have had the chance to see pictures of them, basically the Hemmet's Big Brother with a container handleing unit, a self unloader and 2 more tires.
*Based on the PLS;
Here are the Cons;
[*]Each tire weighs about 550 lbs w/rim and cost about $1,200.
[*]The average life of 1 tire was about 2000 miles due to speeds and terrain (Sidewall splits were common and led to many catostrophic blowouts, not deaths, just having the tire explode with such force it felt like it lifted the truck).
[*]Just the tractor had almost 70 grease zerts which needed constant attention.
[*]Best fuel was 1.6 miles per gallon of JP-8.
[*]If you blew a steering box (PLS had 2) the truck would be effectively dead in the water as all of your hydralic fluid would void on the spot requiring an EPA clean up.
The Pro's;
[*]They went anywhere.
[*]They hauled almost anything.
[*]You could build your R.V. in a steel container with all parts, fuel and equipment then off load and switch out with any variation you wanted in about 10 minutes flat.
[*]You could ford 4-5 feet of standing water without a snorkle.
[*]And you'd probably be the only kid on your block with one.
 

jesusgatos

Explorer
Asdean,
I certainly won't contradict your statement about there being several HEMTT "certified" for legal civilian usage on public roads - because I don't know. However, I do know that our roads are scheduled and built according to a max GVWR allowed by the DOT. Secondary roads are not built strong enough for this type vehicle. Our interstates were designed for a max of around 40,000lbs. and this has become a problem when the NAFTA treaty was signed because Canada and Mexico run triple axle loads weighing as much as 70K+. This is tearing up 1-35 which runs right through my state. Have you not ever seen a state trooper pull over a trucker and test the weight load with portable scales? I live in oil country and some rigs are massive and many times over the legal weight limit - although it certainly helps the state's money coffers...

Here's another reason I have my doubts that the HEMTT can't and never will be certified by DOT for civi use. All excess military vehicles like this have to be 'de-militarized' before being sold for presumably scrap metal or military collectibles to the public. Meaning they get cut up with a torch. As a matter of fact there are only around 80 street legal military HUMVEE's from the 1980's depot sale in I think Atlanta. After that sale, the DOT stated that a military HUMVEE was not capable of meeting existant safety laws. All HUMVEE's that are sold today in public govmt. auctions have to be cut in half before being allowed to leave the depot. (Not that several haven't been purchased and welded back together - because some have...) But, they aren't legal in the eyes of the DOT. My state is very lenient on the intreptation of the laws - like we don't have any safety or emissions inspections and our small trailers don't have to be registered and tagged - other states are extremely tight with the law (California) so you need to check this out before purchasing something like a HEMTT or MAN KAT. Additionally keep in mind that 'visitors' traveling in our country are given exemptions for their rigs because they aren't staying permanently. AND I presume that your high profile adventure would want to be legal in the eyes of the law - right?
I went to a MV rally in WA earlier this summer and there was a privately owned HEMTT there. The guy drove it to/from the event, and it had WA plates on it.
 

jesusgatos

Explorer
If you want to build a MV-based motorhome, why not a deuce and a half? Iconic and practical (compared to your 1st choice). I'm building one right now.
 

Doc Mach

New member
Hemmet

Asdean,
I certainly won't contradict your statement about there being several HEMTT "certified" for legal civilian usage on public roads - because I don't know. However, I do know that our roads are scheduled and built according to a max GVWR allowed by the DOT. Secondary roads are not built strong enough for this type vehicle. Our interstates were designed for a max of around 40,000lbs. and this has become a problem when the NAFTA treaty was signed because Canada and Mexico run triple axle loads weighing as much as 70K+. This is tearing up 1-35 which runs right through my state. Have you not ever seen a state trooper pull over a trucker and test the weight load with portable scales? I live in oil country and some rigs are massive and many times over the legal weight limit - although it certainly helps the state's money coffers...

Here's another reason I have my doubts that the HEMTT can't and never will be certified by DOT for civi use. All excess military vehicles like this have to be 'de-militarized' before being sold for presumably scrap metal or military collectibles to the public. Meaning they get cut up with a torch. As a matter of fact there are only around 80 street legal military HUMVEE's from the 1980's depot sale in I think Atlanta. After that sale, the DOT stated that a military HUMVEE was not capable of meeting existant safety laws. All HUMVEE's that are sold today in public govmt. auctions have to be cut in half before being allowed to leave the depot. (Not that several haven't been purchased and welded back together - because some have...) But, they aren't legal in the eyes of the DOT. My state is very lenient on the intreptation of the laws - like we don't have any safety or emissions inspections and our small trailers don't have to be registered and tagged - other states are extremely tight with the law (California) so you need to check this out before purchasing something like a HEMTT or MAN KAT. Additionally keep in mind that 'visitors' traveling in our country are given exemptions for their rigs because they aren't staying permanently. AND I presume that your high profile adventure would want to be legal in the eyes of the law - right?

Dear Pretender, The trick [when buying a Hemmet or PLS] is that you don't look "Green" when doing a search. The Mfg. is Oshkosh (I don't mean to overstate the obvious, this is just for those uninitiated) and since they build Airport Fire Truck, Forest Service and many Municiple Trucks on what is effectively the same frame, one needs to watch local Government Auctions for State Vehicles that are active and be aware as to what is actually a Hemmet. Read my post on the pro's and con's before buying though.
 

egn

Adventurer
Here is a nice KAT with platform.

BTW, I find the HEMTT is a great military vehicle. But as a motorhome it would be a nightmare for me. Alone the large dimensions and the high fuel consumption is a no go for me.

No way to make one of those military monsters like the HEMTT and the KAT green. :eek:
 
Last edited:

Doc Mach

New member
Mankat vs. Hemmt

Depending on your route of travel, I have been drawn to a Military Surplus Unimog. Easy to work on in the field, runs on diesel, and you get outstanding ground clearance out of the box. If you don't sleep walk you could build your "Possible's" box right to the bed and pitch tent on top to stay clear of the creepy crawlies.
 

skysix

Adventurer
Again I thank you all for all of your comments. If the HEMTT is not right for us does anyone have any suggestions for a vehicle that would retain that "wow" factor while being a practical platform.

a MAN KAT A1 8x8x4 which I believe is in the US inventory as the M1001, M1002, M1013, M1014
id_man_8x8_700_01.jpg

For Sale

Independant suspension, can easily be converted to part time 8x8x8 (rear steering) if 3-4 axel mounts spread a bit more apart which eliminates the wide turning circle problem - but not the weight problem. Swap from 16R20 XZL to 24R20.5XS (and widen the fenders/get wide load permit and banner if state requires) - saw one used as a tourist transport in Iceland. Should do what you need...
Man 8x8
 

BestofBoth

New member
Hemtt 8x8

Thought you might enjoy what we have done to our Hemtt. We are new members and I'm struggling a little with posting photos etc but we hope to be more involved with the expedition community. I really enjoy looking at everone's rides and projects. Our rig is for remote access for adventure sports. I have always wanted a capable rig to base for snow, water and dirt. The rig is part pleasure part business for our Best of Both Adventures company and is set up with 14 ft of living in front and 11 ft garage in the back for the toys/gear. We coulden't quite afford the full out professionally built expedition vehicle so we converted this toyhauler onto the Hemtt. Thanks for lots of great ideas from members posts, Mike and Rene from GXV, and Marty and the crew from Advanced manufacturing that helped with the conversion!
Cheers, garret








Hi Everyone,
So I am new to the forums but I have a project that I am working. Basically we are working on a project to instill national pride called define America. We plan on traveling to every corner of the United States seeking out people, places, and things that define our country. From little towns to major cities we are planning to document and speak at events regarding what makes our country truly great.

To do this we are looking at getting a HEMTT that we can convert into a expedition camper. Several reason we like the HEMTT is that its military, unique, and its extremely capable. I realize that they are extremely rare in the civilian market so if there is any opportunity to get one you should take it. Recently we came upon this thread:

http://www.govliquidation.com/auction/view?id=3555093&tid=GLSPPS5428&cm_re=1-_-hotlots-_-row3col1

Do any of you think this would be a good deal to look into?

Thank you,
Adam
 

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BestofBoth

New member
Hemtt project

Ok everyone. I thought i would join the site to answer some questions. Thanks for both positive and negative comments. First of all, above the cab and motor is just a aluminum rack for my second spare and other gear. The diamond plate on the sides is only temporary and is being replaced with more aluminum tubing. The rack is fully removable for access to the motor and trans in case we ever need to pull them. The tread plate in the front above the windshield will stay however because it deflects wind up over the body.
Second, let me give you some insight into the build. I admit it is plan b as we were hoping to have a body custom built by GXV, but $ restraints made me think of plan b. The build is only 3/4 done and sorry that the final paint etc has not come together yet- again these things take some $!The truck it self is a 1983 with 10k miles on it that i got from a collector in Kentucky. I chose that as a platform because of it's load capacity and offroad capability because it is goiing to be used as a base for adventure sports. Don't worry it won't be a "waste of the hemtt's talents" because it will either be in deep snow accessing lower snowfields where we can base for skiing/ climbing excursions, remote beach access for surf in areas like Baja, or in the western deserts for river approaches, dirtbike riding etc. The trailer was a roadmaster predator which are known to be based on cargo and stronger then regular rv type toyhaulers. It has a full steel cage and a rear ramp that holds 4000lbs. The back 11 feet is garage and the front 14 is living area/kitchen/bath. The conversion required the removal of the grey and black water which i now have in a steel heated and insulated box on the passenger side. When complete the garage will hold a mountain snowmobile, a motocross bike and a street legal grocery getter enduro. Also it will have a inflateable river boat with motor also for lake crossings, accessing waves fro surf and of course fish. Interior racks will also hold all the skis, snowboards, kite boards, windsurf gear etc.

Ok so why a Hemtt? After having a few lesser vehicles, i wanted something that could handle the payload comfortably and was long enough so i could have the garage. I did not want a trailer behind the rig for obvious offroad reasons and wanted all the gear to be out of sight. Also Detroit diesel and allison trans are easily worked on and parts readily available and US made. Sure it only gets 3-4 miles per gallon and tops out at 60, but look at where i can go and what i am bringing with me. The vehicle fully loaded with all the gear, fluids etc will weigh close to 50,000 lbs, but that is well below the gvwr of 68 k. Right now it is at about 44,000 lbs, but eventually we will add another fuel tank and all the other mentioned above to approach the 50. And yes, i did check the fuel consumption on my 1000 mile trip to colorado and it ended up at 3.8 miles to the gallon. Specs say 2-3 miles to the gallon but that is averaged over all sorts of terrain mostly off road. It still hurts at the pump, but you have to remember where it can go and what you are hauling.
The rig is restricted to where it can go with it's turning radius, height13'3", and length(38 ft) so no real tight switchbacks and low canopies, but normally accessing alpine environments are on logging roads which were built for fairly large trucks, most of our surf will be in remote areas of baja, and the hemtt is at home in the western desert areas.
So all in all it will be a base to live out of for my wife and I in areas that most people only dream of. We will also use it for support for Best of Both Adventures which is our adventure company. If we are not at our home in the Andes of Patagonia, we hope to be in the rig. Sure we wanted the full blown expedition vehicle, but compromises had to be made to be able to pull it off. The chasis is the most important which gets you there and back and the living quarters/garage has proven to be pretty comfortable.
Cheers and keep rolling.



As soon as I saw this pic over in Pirate, I immediately thought of this thread:

HEMTT Camper
 

BestofBoth

New member
hemtt project

Ok everyone. I thought i would join the site to answer some questions. Thanks for both positive and negative comments. First of all, above the cab and motor is just a aluminum rack for my second spare and other gear. The diamond plate on the sides is only temporary and is being replaced with more aluminum tubing. The rack is fully removable for access to the motor and trans in case we ever need to pull them. The tread plate in the front above the windshield will stay however because it deflects wind up over the body.
Second, let me give you some insight into the build. I admit it is plan b as we were hoping to have a body custom built by GXV, but $ restraints made me think of plan b. The build is only 3/4 done and sorry that the final paint etc has not come together yet- again these things take some $!The truck it self is a 1983 with 10k miles on it that i got from a collector in Kentucky. I chose that as a platform because of it's load capacity and offroad capability because it is goiing to be used as a base for adventure sports. Don't worry it won't be a "waste of the hemtt's talents" because it will either be in deep snow accessing lower snowfields where we can base for skiing/ climbing excursions, remote beach access for surf in areas like Baja, or in the western deserts for river approaches, dirtbike riding etc. The trailer was a roadmaster predator which are known to be based on cargo and stronger then regular rv type toyhaulers. It has a full steel cage and a rear ramp that holds 4000lbs. The back 11 feet is garage and the front 14 is living area/kitchen/bath. The conversion required the removal of the grey and black water which i now have in a steel heated and insulated box on the passenger side. When complete the garage will hold a mountain snowmobile, a motocross bike and a street legal grocery getter enduro. Also it will have a inflateable river boat with motor also for lake crossings, accessing waves fro surf and of course fish. Interior racks will also hold all the skis, snowboards, kite boards, windsurf gear etc.

Ok so why a Hemtt? After having a few lesser vehicles, i wanted something that could handle the payload comfortably and was long enough so i could have the garage. I did not want a trailer behind the rig for obvious offroad reasons and wanted all the gear to be out of sight. Also Detroit diesel and allison trans are easily worked on and parts readily available and US made. Sure it only gets 3-4 miles per gallon and tops out at 60, but look at where i can go and what i am bringing with me. The vehicle fully loaded with all the gear, fluids etc will weigh close to 50,000 lbs, but that is well below the gvwr of 68 k. Right now it is at about 44,000 lbs, but eventually we will add another fuel tank and all the other mentioned above to approach the 50. And yes, i did check the fuel consumption on my 1000 mile trip to colorado and it ended up at 3.8 miles to the gallon. Specs say 2-3 miles to the gallon but that is averaged over all sorts of terrain mostly off road. It still hurts at the pump, but you have to remember where it can go and what you are hauling.
The rig is restricted to where it can go with it's turning radius, height13'3", and length(38 ft) so no real tight switchbacks and low canopies, but normally accessing alpine environments are on logging roads which were built for fairly large trucks, most of our surf will be in remote areas of baja, and the hemtt is at home in the western desert areas.
So all in all it will be a base to live out of for my wife and I in areas that most people only dream of. We will also use it for support for Best of Both Adventures which is our adventure company. If we are not at our home in the Andes of Patagonia, we hope to be in the rig. Sure we wanted the full blown expedition vehicle, but compromises had to be made to be able to pull it off. The chasis is the most important which gets you there and back and the living quarters/garage has proven to be pretty comfortable.
Cheers and keep rolling.
 

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