Eco-Roamer - F650 based Expedition Vehicle

Christian

Adventurer
Doug
That is without a doubt some of the best advise, and best given advise, I have had... Thanks!
- And I hope you don't mind that I saved it and took a backup on my own computer.
 

dhackney

Expedition Leader
Doug, can you post a picture of your "rub rails"?
I'm curious what they are made of, and what they look like...

They are made of high strength aluminum tubing.

You can see photos of the fabrication of the rub rails in the buildup here: http://www.hackneys.com/mitsu/index-buildup-photos.htm

Look in album 19.

There are a few detail shots of the installation in album 22.

Album 28 has the final beauty shots when we left.

There are more shots of the rig in NA and SA here: http://www.hackneys.com/gallery/v/travel/fuso

If you have any more questions about our rig, please post them in our buildup thread here: http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=2229

Or our underway expedition thread here: http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=10616

I don't want to hijack Jay's thread with stuff about our truck. Thanks. :)
 

EdoHart

Observer
I'm not in the same class as you by a long shot. This is a fun thread to read and I look forward to future updates.

Following are a few things I thought about:

Just because you're environmentally friendly, doesn't mean you have to be boring...

*snip*

Connected to this is a 1 Terrabyte (Yippee!) Western Digital USB Hard Drive mounted in foam in the centre console. I can't believe how cheap these are now. I got mine at Best Buy for about $230. We're in the process of ripping all our DVD's and MP3's to the drive. We'll never fill it

*snip*

Bold type face type in above quote added by me. *snip* notation indicated that I cut out portions of the quoted post which aren't relevant to my point.

I'll wager a dollar that you can fill that and then some. I think dhackney said it best with:
*snip*

* Think data. Modern life is digital life. Media such as RAW photography files and digital HD video files create tremendous amounts of data. You will consume terabytes per year in data storage. Ensure that you have created space for fault tolerant (RAID 5) disk drives, incremental backup drives and associated equipment. Develop a strategy to carve off incremental backups and send those drives back to the U.S. Never have only one copy of the data and never have the only copies of the data on the rig.

*snip*

Doug

I honestly don't even know how to reply to the whole HHO suggestion...

Personally, I quite like Mythbusters. I wouldn't call them 'great science' but they are at least good fun.

Just to present both sides of the argument (I can't believe I'm sticking up for blatant spammers) but, here's a YouTube video disproving the Mythbusters disproving the HHO...

----------------------

However, there is something we are looking at, that may be of more interest...

We have started conversations with the guys over at EV Power Systems. They have developed an interesting Electric Hybrid Drive system that can be retrofited onto a truck at the driveshaft, behind the engine/transmission.

They already have a working system for pick-up trucks, and are finishing development for a garbage-truck / courier-truck platform.

We have a substantial bank of batteries sitting in the camper, which are generally unused while the vehicle is in motion. This might be an interesting way to leverage the untapped potential energy in those batteries to run two electric helper motors to improve fuel efficiency. The batteries would be recharged by regenerative braking.

It's very early days, but something we're looking at...

clip_image002.jpg


They are an early stage tech start-up, and may appreciate being associated with the EcoRoamer project anyhow. We could serve as a great test bed, taking one of their systems around the world to show how it works in all conditions.

Stay tuned, I'll certainly post more details if we take it forward...

Cheers,
Jay.

Regarding hydrogen generation, with all your solar capacity, I wonder if this might be a viable addition. Why waste those photons striking the panels once your batteries are fully charged?

The electric motor/regenerative braking idea sounds very promising.
 

jayshapiro

Adventurer
Thanks & See You Soon!

I thought I would put these "overlanding design & build & utilize lessons learned" up here so others who read this build thread could learn from them, rather than continue to PM them only to Jay & Alice.

Doug,

Thank you SO much for taking the time and effort to share with all of us the lessons you've learned building / traveling with your own vehicle. There are a lot of good ideas in there and a lot to digest.

Some of it, we're too far 'down the road' to fix at the moment, but a lot of the ideas will certainly be integrated. Rest assured that there are already a lot of 'Hackney Elements' in our camper, and when you walk around it I'm sure you will recognize some of them...

I owe you at least a beer, if not a very nice bottle of something with our stemware (which thanks to you, we'll be sure to pack). We'll share it with you at the Overland Expo in Arizona in April, where it looks like our two paths will cross.

We are currently pushing hard to have the truck 'ready enough' for it's shake down trip to the Overland Expo. I'm really looking forward to meeting everyone there and sharing what we've done with the EcoRoamer and how it fits in with our Overlanding Non-Profit Group called The Muskoka Foundation.

We'll see you there! Thanks again!

Jay.
 

jayshapiro

Adventurer
The race is on!

Kurt had no school last week, so he and I went out to Michigan again to work on the truck and help push things along. We made a lot of progress despite United Airlines doing everything in their power to try and stop us from getting there/home.

(PS - I used to fly a million miles a year, but I will never fly United Airlines again: 4 mechanical failures, 4 flights in a row, I guess the recession is really leading to cut-backs, scary!)

The EcoRoamer is looking very good, and it's really coming together. I've posted a bunch of pictures up on the www.EcoRoamer.com website, but here are some highlights:

The rear departure angle pieces have been attached, with the cargo bays within them. These will eventually hold the water filtration system from WWW.
3347569983_b883a5da06.jpg


Viewed from the rear:
3348410430_60c2f8a3b7.jpg


The rear 'ramp door' is due to be completed this week, so we should have it finished and mounted next week. I can't wait! I'll post pics as soon as I have them.

In the mean time... Work has started on the cargo bays for the generator and the batteries:

Generator side:
3348409066_97c62bcb0c.jpg

Under the truck you can see the new nose cone waiting to be put on the pop-top. It was supposed to be rolled, but came back stamped, so it doesn't look fantastic. We're going to try to fix it a little, but I suspect the first forest branches will take care of it.

Batteries side:
3347571029_37646708eb.jpg

Those are Lifeline 8D batteries. There will be two shelves of four batteries each. Each battery will be paired to create the 24v x 4 pairs. If you're interested you can read the specs here. (my back can testify to the fact that they really are 162lbs each!)

On the interior of the truck, I had some great meetings with Bill and Matt over at Michiana Laminated Products. It is almost therapeutic meeting with those guys. Shifting gears mentally from: designing big metal frameworks to support 1,000lbs of battery... to discussing tightening the 1/8" gap for hinges, or picking latch countersinks is incredible. These guys operate on such level of minutia, but as a result there stuff is amazingly rugged (i.e. - no jiggles going down the road) and just beautiful to look at.

This truck is going to be tough and capable, but it is also going to be stunning to live in. I'm so amazed and delighted at how nice you can make everything while using 100% recycled and sustainable materials. Everyone should do this in their homes.

The key materials that Michiana are going to be using are:
PlyBoo - Bamboo based boards for cabinetry
Richlite - Recycled Paper based countertops
Medex - 100% Recycled, Formaldehyde-free MDF boards for sub-floors

We also ordered the fabric for the cushions, which is being sewn at a nice Amish farm down the road from us in Indiana.

Lastly, I met with Bret Reinhardt who is the founder of Sun Power Technologies. They've developed a DC based air-conditioning system that will run on our 24v and has a MUCH lower power draw than what we were previously looking at. Best of all it has no start-up surge, which can kill your battery bank very quickly. We're having one installed in time for the Overland Expo event in Arizona, and we'll see how it does. If you see us panting and sweating, then you'll know that we need a second unit.

If all goes well, then we may get away with not having to run our generator which was the whole idea in the first place.

That's all the news for now. There is a ton of work going on in the next few weeks as we get ready for the trip to Arizona. Stay tuned for updates!

Cheers,
Jay.
 

dhackney

Expedition Leader
Jay and followers of this thread,

Here are some additional lessons learned. Jay & Alice, some will obviously be too late in the game for you, but others may profit from them.

  • Adaptation. You will adapt your lifestyle to your vehicle and its capabilities and limitations, along with your own capabilities and limitations in the context of your environment.
  • There will always be a faster gun. No matter what you do or where you go or what you accomplish along the way, there will always be somebody who did more, went farther and accomplished more. Do what you want to do for yourselves. Smile and nod along with those whose self-worth is tied to their travel checklist and hair shirt.
  • Design for cold. In the last few weeks of building our truck I had the blinding realization that it might be cold where we ended up going with it. I did a bunch of last minute additions (electronics compartment heaters, tank heaters, etc.) which have held up well in cold temps, but it's a kludge. Where you think for sure you will never go now may be the first place you want to go later. It gets cold in the mountains. Design for below freezing with all liquid systems (hoses, pumps, tanks, etc.)
  • Turning radius is probably the most important day-to-day dimension of the vehicle.
  • Build and carry a height/width stick. Get two 10' sections of 3/4" or 1" pvc pipe. Buy two unions and a T section. Cut one pipe to match your width, inclusive of the union. Cement the union on the first pipe. Put the 2nd pipe into the union and cut it to match your height. Keep that joint dry. Store the height stick in an easily accessible location from the ground. Option: use the 2nd union, the T section and the left over pipe to create a wire lift to aid lifting low hanging wires over the rig. ALWAYS wear rubber gloves for this operation, even though the pipe is plastic. NEVER touch a wire with your bare hands, especially if you are convinced it's just a phone line or cable TV.
  • Build a lock bar for your camper door. Use it when you store long term and for shipping. We used 1" stainless steel. You can see details of the construction on our buildup site.
  • LP Capacity and Refill. If you design and build a rig that uses LP/Propane, then you will want to have a dual source system. In some countries, you can fill a standard fixed tank with a normal U.S. fill valve with no worries. In others, you will need a special connector. In others, you can't fill a fixed tank at all. In some countries it is simple and easy to refill a standard U.S. portable tank with a POL valve. In other countries you need a special adapter. In other countries you cannot fill a portable tank at all. As you can see, LP/Propane can be a challenge. For more information on propane systems for expedition vehicles and how to refill them oversease, see this thread: http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=15406&highlight=propane The design lessons learned are: a) always have two ways to refill/store LP b) build in as many types of connections (overseas fill valve types) as possible and c) Capacity is king. Build in at least a 30 day supply of LP/Propane.

Doug
 

dhackney

Expedition Leader
More lessons learned. Same caveats apply.

  • Awnings are Good. Having zero overlanding experience, once I read Stephen Stewart's overland expedition vehicle requirements document http://www.xor.org.uk/silkroute/equipment/choosevan.htm , I was certain we would be chiseling off our two awnings within months of departure. I thought no European we encountered would speak to us as long as we had an awning. Wrong. Nearly every European rig we saw or spent time with had an awning and they used them as much as we used ours. There are areas of the world, such as Patagonia, where you physically cannot use them, but everywhere else, they are a godsend. At a minimum, make certain you have one over your entry stairs.
  • Rear Fog Lights. Order and install a set of Euro style rear fog lights, which function like very bright tail lights, and switch them with your front fog lights. Your biggest danger in fog is getting rear ended.
  • Ride your own ride. There will be an endless number of people who will judge you by what you do, how you do it, where you go and how you get there. They are not living your life, you are. Do what you want how you want to do it and enjoy it.
  • Savor. This chapter of your life may seem as if it will never begin, but like the early years of a child's life, it will pass very quickly. None of us know how long our overlanding chapter will last. It can be truncated by many factors that we do not and can not control. Savor every moment of your time out there.
  • Tires. Tires you buy in the states are not the same ones that are available worldwide. An odd size, model or capacity tire can be very expensive or impossible to source overseas. Design and build to world-common sizes and capacities, such as 16” or 22.5,” whenever possible. If you are making a choice, go for a size and tire that includes the maximum number of tread and sidewall plies. Consider putting a steering axle tire or one that has a less aggressive tread on the front (but matches the rolling diameter of the rear). The reduced cab noise will be a lot more important over time than having butch tread on the front.
  • Spare parts. Carry common, get-us-to-the-next-town spare parts that are unique to your vehicle, such as belts. Carry unusual it-will-take-a-month-to-ship-here spare parts that are specific to your vehicle, such as electronic modules. Do not carry any liquids such as oil. Aside from windshield washer fluid, which you can create on your own, they are available everywhere. Because you will be coming out of the design and build phase, you will be tempted to carry a lot of spare build parts and supplies. If you have designed and built well, you won't need these, so either leave them behind or cut them by 80%.
  • Tools. Practice every repair job that you would attempt on your own. Ensure you have the necessary tools, e.g., tire removal and repair, drive shaft removal, etc. Our truck requires two box end 17mm wrenches for the drive shaft. You do not want to discover that on a muddy road in Borneo.
  • Wet locker. Make sure you have a place to hang wet clothes. I installed a stainless steel cable clothesline in our shower, and it has been a very valuable addition. If you only make one modification in your camper box, make this one.
  • Label everything. Get a Brother P-touch handheld label maker such as a PT-80 and a lot of spare label tape. Label every single power supply, interconnect cable, storage bag, pack cube, storage container, etc. on your vehicle. For cables, label them with the technical name and the common name, e.g., IEEE 1394 and Firewire. Add any terms you use to identify devices or cables, e.g., “Buzz Lightyear Charger.” Label the grab handle or exterior of any bag or storage container used to store power supplies, chargers, cables, etc., e.g., “video edit.” Bring your label maker and a bunch of label tape along. You will continue to use this device for your entire trip.
  • Place Religion. Develop and practice religious level fervor about putting things back in their place. This is especially important if you travel by motorcycle. Whenever you take anything out of its place, put it back in its place. Every time.
  • Locked compartments. Never, ever walk away from an unlocked exterior storage compartment. Ever.
  • Tarps. Carry at least two simple plastic tarps. You can buy these anywhere on the planet, so don't worry about trashing them. They are handy for all kinds of things, especially getting under the truck when you need to.
 
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jayshapiro

Adventurer
Sage Advice

Doug,

Thank you, again for your amazing advice. Unfortunately, we are starting to approach the EcoRoamer's GVWR with all of the beers that I think we are going to owe you!

Of course, I won't put everyone through a detailed response to all of your great points, but here's a couple of interesting updates that are relevant to your suggestions:

1 - PROPANE

One of our very early design decisions was to not carry propane at all. Largely for the hassle of the reasons you stated. We are purely diesel throughout. We were going to use a diesel stove, but it also had too many drawbacks (not controllable in separate burners, altitude issues, lack of responsiveness, after-sales support) and so we initially decided to go with an induction stove.

Then we realized the power on those was going to just kill our batteries, so we took the advice of EGN (owner of a very cool MAN KAT) and have gone with a 2 burner resistive stove. Time will tell how well it works, stay tuned...

2 - AWNINGS

Yes, we have two Fiamma awnings, which were finally installed about 10 days ago. Here they are:
3348413232_dd8abb46d0.jpg


3347575071_d76c5c4963.jpg


What is really cool, is that when the rear deck is down, and the rear awning is out, we can attach the hanging side walls to it, and create a separate weather protected 'family room' for the kids to play in. It adds about an extra 100 sq ft to an otherwise small living quarters.

The rear deck was hung on the truck TODAY! :wings: So, stay tuned for pictures this week.

3 - INTERIOR

Much of the work at the moment is all about the interior. I mentioned in a previous post that the guys at Michiana Laminate are working on the furniture pieces. Well, TODAY they finished the first one - the stairs unit.

Here it is:
3374559284_6a399699cd.jpg


3374559152_d3ec8dd855.jpg


This is the first piece made out of the Bamboo based Plyboo material, and I love how it looks. The drawer interiors are made out of fermaldahyde-free recycled wood fiber white masonite - to reduce weight & cost and make it easier to clean.

There are more pictures of the stairs in the Build Photos Section over at www.EcoRoamer.com if you'd like to see more.

To Doug's point, there are going to be lot's of small storage places to try and keep our somewhat chaotic 2-kids household in a religiously organized fashion. (and yes - I love my Brother label maker, too!)


PS - Before you ask, that weird pull-out board on the back of the stairs unit is a step to get back into the truck from the pop-out bed tent on the side of the truck. (it will make more sense once I have it installed in place)

--------------------------------------

The Happijac Bed Lift was installed today too, as well as a few other internal goodies.

Stay tuned & thanks to Doug and everyone else who has given us all their great advice to make this the best Expedition Vehicle it can be. (...well, maybe second best to Soenke's! :bowdown:

Cheers guys!
A very Happy Jay. :)
 
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jayshapiro

Adventurer
Progress...

Some good progress this week. I'll let the pictures do the talking:

The ramp door showed up, and is now mounted:

3376194818_31d49483dc.jpg


This is what it will look like in the 'down' position. We still need to beef it up with the internal frame, add railings and the springs to help lift it up...
3376179846_248f11744f.jpg


Someone asked in a previous post about lowering it all the way down to help with loading things into the camper. Here it is: (pretty steep!)
3376179832_ed1493f875.jpg


Remember that the rear wall (the one with the window & door) is just bolted in, and will be coming out so we can put all the furniture & floor boards in. We'll replace the wall and tack it down before we head to Arizona...

-----------------

Also, for those following the long wheels saga, we finally have the (semi-)final chapter.

Here are the used 22.5" Alcoas, now powder coated black, and with the Michelin XDE M/S 11R22.5's on them:

3376179854_75d4d5d0a1.jpg


3383528963_fb4e95acd4.jpg


We've decided to donate our set of five BRAND NEW Continental MPT81's (365/80R20's) to the silent auction for Disabled Explorers. -- So, if you've been following this thread and have an EarthRoamer, (uses these same ones) or some other project that you think the Conti's might be a good fit for - come out to the Overland Expo in Arizona and place your bids! 100% of the funds raised will go to the charity. (Note: Wheels & Shipping not included)

I don't want to overload everyone with the gory details of our running boards, cargo bay doors, etc, so if you're interested in more of the pics, check out the photo section at: www.EcoRoamer.com

Just 1 month to go now...

Cheers!
Jay.
 

The Adam Blaster

Expedition Leader
Someone asked in a previous post about lowering it all the way down to help with loading things into the camper. Here it is: (pretty steep!)
3376179832_ed1493f875.jpg

That was me. :)
And although it might be a bit steep for bringing cargo/goods into the living quarters, if you smoothes out the lower lip, it would make a pretty cool ramp for skateboarding!
Get your son started early. ;)
 

jayshapiro

Adventurer
Earthroamer uses 335/80R20, 40.7", not 365/80R20, which is 43.1".

I stand corrected... again.

Thanks Charlie!

Nonetheless, they would make a great addition to many different vehicles, and the money goes to a good cause. We have one strong bid already, and we haven't even shown up yet!

Oh... and just because I can't make a post without ANY pictures, here's the very first completed cargo bay door. Looks great!

3383531343_0f6869f9ae.jpg

"excuse me sir, please don't touch my truck, you'll get finger prints on it!"

At least now it matches my other car...
1338374683.jpg

:Wow1:


Cheers,
Jay.
 

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