Arrgh! Axle seals AGAIN!

[Wanderlusty]

About 2 months ago, I noticed pass. rear was covered in fluid. Took it to the dealer and they diagnosed a blown axle seal, which confirmed a suspicion I had. They replaced it, under warranty.

2 weeks ago, I noticed it was leaking again. Took it back to dealer, and they replaced it. Now, LESS THAN A WEEK LATER and...you guessed it...leaking AGAIN!

ARRRGH!!!!

Only 4 days until I depart for the Trophy. And dealing with this again! I researched some on TTORA and it seems that if you have had one axle leak, you have had multiple axle leaks. Possible causes beside just a bad seal are

1) clogged diff breather
2) bent axle shaft

So, i just did the diff breather mod, and it seemed fine, so that leaves either poor workmanship at the dealership or a possible bent axle shaft...

Question is, would they have not checked this? And why does this seem to be such a recurring problem?

I have to admit....I am getting a bit disillusioned. I bought the Taco because it suited my needs, as far as cab config and offroad ability. It serves both purposes admirably, but I also bought it because of the legendary Toyota quality reputation.

Yet, in the 6 months I have owned it, counting taking it BACK in tomorrow, will be the 4th time it has been in the garage for a warranty fix. Once for wheel bearings, and now 3 times for the axle seal. And the truck only has 40K on it.

I have had this truck in the shop more than my last 3 trucks combined.

And now...like I said, 4 days before departing for a 3k+ trip, I am faced with ANOTHER issue.

And so what do I do now? I sure don't want to cancel the trip. In fact, I would rather keep adding fluid if it starts leaking again (assuming they even get it in tomorrow) than have to cancel the trip.

I am just getting frustrated with this issue.

I love the truck itself, other than these issues, but like I said, I am starting to feel a bit disillusioned...well more than a bit....


Anybody else had issues with their axle seals? Any words of advice, encouragement?

 

[DaveInDenver]

I would have first guessed a clogged breather, but sounds like you got that covered. If you eliminate poor workmanship by the dealer, then a bent axle seems plausible. But my axle seals last many, many years (going on 8 on this set without any signs of wearing out and I have an ARB in both ends). I wonder if the housing may be bent. Do you know that the first owner was gentle on the truck or was maybe he a kid, contractor, etc? Being in an accident, jumping or badly overloading is not good for them. But to have a set go in a week, that does not immediately strike me as an alignment issue, unless it's really, really bad. Are you always taking this to a Toyota dealer? I would at least have the axle checked for true and that the axle shaft isn't bent.

Stick with it, I've had a few Toyotas now and as long as you give them some care, they've always been stone cold reliable. There is something not right here, just gotta figure it out.

 

[Wanderlusty]

I just lifted it a few weeks ago and had it aligned last monday. I could probably check the breather more closely, but I did give it a quick blow and it didn't seem clogged.

I am worried about where this leaves me with the Trophy trip. Like I said, I may just nurse it if I have to, but I am showing up at the dealer bright and early tomorrow AM and going to have them look at it again.

I have taken it to the dealer every time because it has been covered by warranty.

Thing is, I didn't have any issues from the axle seal for the first 5ish months of ownership. Why it is rearing it's head so often now after all this time, I am puzzled.

I have no idea how it was treated before I got it. When I got it, it was a clean truck, but who knows.

This spring, I wheeled it pretty hard on a trip I took, but symptoms didn't appear for another 4 months. Counting in reverse...I guess I have owned the truck about 8 months...not 6.

I know I was loaded down with a bed full of supplies and a cab full of people, and I know I felt the bump stops hit a few times. If it is a bent axle shaft, I am probably the culprit...

The housing itself does not look bent, but I am only eyeballing it.

I am going to kick myself if it is a bent shaft, but shoot, I didn't push it any harder than I ever did my TJ with the 'lowly" Dana 35 in it, and all I have heard is how tough the Toy axle is. I hope that little bit of wheeling wasn't all it took to bend it. For the record...no jumps were performed. Several deep water crossings were, but again, the issue didn't show up until months after that trip.

I will have to deal with whatever the problem is, whether it is on Toyota's shoulders or mine.

My biggest concern at this moment, and this is being selfish, but I don't want to have to miss the Trophy THIS CLOSE to it.

Am I being stupid to think I can nurse it through this next week?

Dang, I am so upset about this...whoever's fault it is...

 

[flyingwil]

I ran an entire cross country trip with mine leaking (Big Bend Expedition), and had it repaired in Houston. You should be fine with a minimal leak. You might want to try a different dealer.

 

[CYi5]

I just replaced my 2nd set and am on my 3rd set. Three days later one side was leaking again....pisses me off too, since my brake drums get coated in oil and there goes my braking power.

I've done them all myself, it's not that hard and only costs $18 parts wise. I'm wondering if I nicked the interior with the seal puller or something...I've heard bad wheel bearings can also attribute to leaks, but i don't see much play.

It's a lame situation all around. Crappy toyotas

For your trip i'd just top off your diff and hit the inside of your drum and pads with brake cleaner.

 

[Wanderlusty]

Well, I am taking it on in again to the same dealer tomorrow and giving them 'one last chance' to either properly fix (if it was workmanship) or properly diagnose (if it is another part) the problem.

I am figuring that as a worst case scenario for the trip, I would carry along some gear oil and brake cleaner in case it starts leaking badly.

I am just curious what the true root cause is because this is just frustrating as heck.

I am glad to know that this isn't neccessarily a deal breaker as far as the trip goes, but here's hoping it gets fixed or diagnosed correctly this time....

 

[nvprospector]

Did you park next to a Land Rover. If so, the taco may of picked up a bad habbit of marking its territory. :xxrotflma

If you find out what the issue let us know. I am interested in the solution


good luck

 

[p1michaud]

Axle seals

Well, I am taking it on in again to the same dealer tomorrow and giving them 'one last chance' to either properly fix (if it was workmanship) or properly diagnose (if it is another part) the problem.

I've replaced both my rear axle seals as a preventive measure when I re-geared but they have over 162K miles on them without and issue. Here are a few tips that may help.

1-For your diff breather mod go up one size in your rubber line to allow proper ventillation (i.e. one size over 1/4" fuel line). And make sure to use a cheap fuel filter at the end don't re-use the OEM vent.

2-When they pull the axle, make sure that the bearing is in good shape. Bad bearings will lead to leaking axle seals.

3-Have them check the seal surface on your axle to make sure it was not damaged during a previous install. Are they using the correct axle seal?

4-In my opinion a bent axle or housing would be the very last thing to check. They are well designed and to bend one would take quite a bit.

Don't give up, you'll figure it out.
Cheers,
P

 

[DaveInDenver]

Dana 35 in it, and all I have heard is how tough the Toy axle is. I hope that little bit of wheeling wasn't all it took to bend it.

Nah, that's not it. I'm guessing nicked seal, it doesn't take much and it's easy to do. OTOH, parking next to a Rover will teach them bad habits. Never do that.

Pierre is right about the breathers. Here's a couple I've tried. One is a sintered brass air muffler and the other a fuel filter from a VW.

 

[Grim Reaper]

It is stupid mechanics that don't understand the design and what the catalyst is for the failed seals. <----Plural



The oil seal is in the tube. The dust seal on the flange side outside the bearing and it was never meant to retain oil just keep brake dust out of the bearing.


Your bearing is shot and its causing wobble and burning out the seals. The Bearing is a sealed unit and if gear oil is leaking out it has washed the grease out and while you can run wheel beings in gear oil the fact that the Toyota design is to keep the gear oil OUT of the bearing means if you do get it to seal the gear oil will sling out and let the bearing run dry so even if it is good right now it won't be for long after they actually get the leak fixed.

You invoice should show two seals, O-Ring and a bearing if it isn’t they are not doing the job correctly.

 

[Wanderlusty]

I just got back from the dealer. They seemed to grasp the gravity of this being the 3rd time in a month, 2nd time in a week. I hope they can find the root cause this time.

As for checking what they replaced last time...too bad I just saw this now, because the reciept from last time is in the truck, at the dealership....

I will check it when I pick it up, though.

Other than this repeated issue, and beginning to wonder their competance (either in repair or troubleshooting) they have been great. They have covered every fix under warranty, despite the fact that I bought the vehicle at another dealer, 1000 miles away.

I have bought vehicles from this dealer before though (used, not a Toyota) but they have been great to deal with every time.

On the diff breather....wish I woulda thought of going up one size. I may go back and do that, but I may also just start with a cheap fuel filter, as at this point, I did re-use the stocker....because it was free and it was there.

Shame on me for being a cheapskate....

We will see what the dealer comes up with this time. I hope they figure out SOMETHING....

 

[Wanderlusty]

OTOH, parking next to a Rover will teach them bad habits. Never do that.

Well, haven't parked beside any Rovers, unless one snuck up on me while I was in a store or something.

Have parked next to my wife's Maxima....but that thing has been spot-on reliable. That car is awesome.

But after this, I can definitely relate to the Rover guys. I have a vehicle that so far has been kinda high maintenance, but I still love the thing....

 

[p1michaud]

Replace the bearings!

I will check it when I pick it up, though.

Grim Reaper is 100% right about the bearings as well. Why don't you call the dealership and tell them you want a new bearing right now before they tear it down.

Cheers,
P

 

[Wanderlusty]

I called the dealer just now and they said that they check the bearings and related hardware when they disassemble.

The latest is that they have called Toyota tech support, and they are hearing that they may be inserting the seal in too far, or something of that nature.

I asked if it was the inner or outer seal, and the guy I was talking to was the desk guy, so he didn't know but said he thought it was the inner.

Anyway, it sounds like they may be making progress, hopefully....

He said he would call back after they got in there and looked at it. The technician is test driving it and then it sounds like they are going to check it again, to see if it leaked again.

If they are putting it in too far...thinking they must not be coming across too many of these. Not sure where that leaves my confidence in the dealership from the mechanical side. Their customer service is great, but if they don't know what they are doing when they are :Mechanic: then the rest doesn't mean much.

More updates as I get them.

 

[Wanderlusty]

Well, they say it is ready to pick up. I hope this time they got it. It sounds from what they are saying that they covered all the bases as far as checking alternative issues, like clogged breather, bearings, axle shafts, so hopefully, whatever/however they did it differently this time...works....