Bilstein 5100 too long for Quigley?!

[derjack]

I am just about to finally put the purchased Moog CC880s and the Bilstein 5100 on my Quigley but ...

noticed that the Coils will probably fit fine - eyeballed and roughly measured. But the carefully researched Bilstein most, most likely, don't 😬

My truck is an early 1993 Quigley with the square 4 link tubes. It's the Bilstein 5100 24-186018. These measure uninstalled and uncompressed roughly 60cm. The installed ones, under pressure of course, roughly 35cm. Without going into details - this WILL NOT FIT.
The lower part of the Bilstein is 35cm, so it will just sit on it, if best.

I don't get this. Plus it's expensive, as just the shocks have been, including tax and transport, almost 400$!
It seams that it's again an 100% sure, if maybe, we don't know. Maybe I am a but too German, but Quigley has a really bad documentation on their products as it looks for me right now.

They have probably changed the mounting points fit the shocks in an in-life change w/o documentations. So nobody knows until it's too late.
Anyone an idea, besides welding new baskets?


PS: these trucks are so rare that it's impossible to seek these new shocks. I do know from less than 5 owners in Germany and I probably know most of them.

 

[derjack]

Alright I did some research in my collected Quigley pictures:

This one has a total different Shock mount - as it has also different 4-link mountings (besides the custom links). Though it should be clear that there was a change from square to round ones (4-links). If this includes a new shock it should be mentioned anywhere...

The Bilstein 5100 24-186018 is documented in 13,59 inch collapsed / aka 345,3 mm and extended 21,42 in / aka 544 mm -> that translates into my rough measurements.

A CC880s should be ~ 1 inch longer. This would mean that the 5100 will fit in normal ride high ~ at the max collapse. Though if the coil is compressed the should will be out if it´s range.


PS: No I did not contact Quigley support before because I only once ever received an answer with page 4/5 from my personal conversion. The 3 or 4 attempts after that have been without any answer, like the other pages as well.
PPS: My rig was sitting 200 miles away while it did the purchase in a garage, so I was not able to measure.

 

[comptiger5000]

I'd say either hunt down a shorter version of that shock, or if it's got the right amount of travel but is just too long when compressed, then re-locate the shock mounts if there's space to do so. Judging by the first pictures, they could go down a couple of inches.

 

[Eaglefreek]

If you call Quigley, they are good at answering questions. Maybe you can email someone here your VIN and questions and they can call for you. I'd offer, but I'll be unavailable for the next couple of days due to work.

 

[derjack]

If you call Quigley, they are good at answering questions. Maybe you can email someone here your VIN and questions and they can call for you. I'd offer, but I'll be unavailable for the next couple of days due to work.

Thanks for that - very kind. Language is not my issue, maybe not even time zone. Shipping and tax is extremely expensive when parts are heavy. In this case its almost 200$ shipping and 60$ tax for 2 shocks. So this exceeds the cost of the shock itself - though these are more or less not available in GER + they just cost double the price here.

I need to make sure if I can use these in an adequate way - w/o too expensive fabrication. If not I will look for some local (EU) shocks that will be OK.

Question is what will be OK? Has anyone the concrete information about the 24-18060? like the rebound and pressure stage? So I can try to translate these into a shock from Koni e.g.

 

[kcernest]

I put 5100's on my '94 quigley with the same box tubes up front. I'd have to see if I have any paperwork on them to find out the exact model number but I seem to recall calling quigley and asking them what would fit. Honestly I was very underwhelmed with the performance. If I was going to do it again(which I may), I would just spring for the RIP kit.

Edit: I just looked in my email and there is one saying they just recommend the regular stock size E350 shock. If that's the part number you have there than they fit.

 

[derjack]

I put 5100's on my '94 quigley with the same box tubes up front. I'd have to see if I have any paperwork on them to find out the exact model number but I seem to recall calling quigley and asking them what would fit. Honestly I was very underwhelmed with the performance. If I was going to do it again(which I may), I would just spring for the RIP kit.

Edit: I just looked in my email and there is one saying they just recommend the regular stock size E350 shock. If that's the part number you have there than they fit.

Thanks for your comment.
- RIP Kit: Me and a friend of mine with a different E350 Sportsmobile tried to get in contact, 2 years ago. NO chance to get any further. Just like many others. I need to have reliable products and support on my (soon restored) rig, otherwise it will never get in a valuable range. NOBODY in Germany would ever by a car where you don´t get parts for.
- There is no chance to fit this shock on my 1993 in the designed way. This is obvious.
- Quigley support will not help, as it´s too late. Remember the shipping cost exceed the purchase cost! If I purchase a new shock this shock - see my Argument above - will be sourced in Germany/ Europe. Weather OEM or for another car/truck. Same for the rear.

So I will most likely NOT use these Bilstein shocks. Koni makes some OEM shocks for the Econoline (4x2) that will probably fit. This is most likely the way Quigley in a fist glance designed the shock mounts.

PS Quigley: They will recommend what is the best in their terms. They are the manufacturer > this means they develop products in a cost effective way (as ALL manufacturers). This DOESN`t mean it´s the best possible way! In this process of manufacturing parts purchasing/ supply chain/ costs/ quality/ development time etc ALL come into play when Quigley developed the 4x4 E350.
THIS is not the best way for me as a customer. It simply isn´t.
An example: I will probably never ever again change my shocks, as I will probably never drive this more than 70tmiles. Therefore the price for the shocks is not that relevant and the ease of purchase. Being a manufacturer this is totally different: Quigley has to make sure that they can easy deliver hundreds of shocks very fast and that all Ford garages can easy install them, then guaranty etc.

So Whatever they recommend does not mean it´s best for me, maybe it is easy. btw this is not a blaming Quigley. It´s just the way it always is.

 

[Jsweezy]

Those definitely look like the stock ford e-series van shocks. Is the problem that your having a hard time finding a shock that you can buy locally?

These are the stock ford front shock specs...
Compressed Length (in) 10.12
Extended Length (in) 14.96
Stroke (in) 4.84

Bottom sleeve should be 5/8" ID. Don't quote me on that as they may have modified that but I doubt it.

Sounds like they have those shocks near the end of their up stroke, like most 4wd conversions do because they are too lazy to put the correct shock on, so I'd try to find one just a bit taller than the stock if you can.

 

[malcolmzilla]

My Clydesdale uses oem 80-95 F150 front radius arms that have the lower shock eye mount on top of the radius arm. These are shorter than the E series radius arm mounted shocks, by about 3" fully compressed, so the F150 application Bilsteins may work for your van?

 

[derjack]

Those definitely look like the stock ford e-series van shocks. Is the problem that your having a hard time finding a shock that you can buy locally?

These are the stock ford front shock specs...
Compressed Length (in) 10.12
Extended Length (in) 14.96
Stroke (in) 4.84

Bottom sleeve should be 5/8" ID. Don't quote me on that as they may have modified that but I doubt it.

Sounds like they have those shocks near the end of their up stroke, like most 4wd conversions do because they are too lazy to put the correct shock on, so I'd try to find one just a bit taller than the stock if you can.

Sorry overlooked your post completely.
There are shocks available in Germany of course, but in general more expensive one and / or for different applications, like lighter trucks.
I measured similar specs from my OEM shocks, to the one you posted, so my measurements look correct. Thanks for that.

I will probably end up let someone weld new mounts on my axles or maybe the lower one of the 4-link. It´s now on the upper one, the lower one is roughly 5" lower which will probably work out.

e.g. if I would by some Koni shocks for an E350 2x2 are ~250$ a pair.

 

[Pangle]

I had 5100s on my stock 2001 quigley e350. I called Quigley gave them the VIN and they helped me out. Also the guys at SD truck springs KNEW exactly which ones I needed... They bolted right up and looked/road great.

 

[derjack]

These shocks work for your truck, but not mine!
Quigley changed the 4-link right after the production beginning. I have seen ´96 with the newer style. Never ever seen mine before in the net. I can get shocks like stock ones easy but I have a 4x4 and a heavy Diesel engine. An E150 shock, would not work better than what I have.

I cannot sell them, as it seams in Germany. Nobody has a F250/F350 in Germany with a need for new shocks. I paid ~ 300$ inkl. shipping. So I keep them and make new mounts.

I live in Germany. There is nobody who knows more about Quigley in Germany than me - and this is not very much :wings: