Ok, everyone knows that a diesel Jeep is the greatest idea ever...so, they made a Liberty in a CRD up to I think 07? Are these worth a ****? I know the back seat of the Liberty is complete crap to ride in if your any bigger than 4ft tall but as far as motor/vehicle package does anyone LOVE these? Just havn't heard much as far as the diesel Liberty being built up as an Expo. Thanks. Walt
Jeep CRD?
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jeepdreamer
Expedition Leader
"Are they worth a ****?" Well... depends on what you expect and who you talk to. The VM diesel (Italian made) was found to be fairly problematic and was known to suffer head gasket issues. Google it and you will find a lot of intel both ways. Some folks were content with them while others (dare I say the lion's share) felt screwed. My best friend bought one for him and a Grand Cherokee diesel for his wife. The Lib spent almost a year of the three they owned it in the shop.
Add to that the fact that the Lib is sort of the bastard child with the jeep name badge and its kinda already got the deck stacked against it. Un-jeep looking, independant suspention, low ground clearance, not much of gearing options, etc..Got the cold shoulder in the jeeping comunity.It was "supposed" to be a replacment for for the XJ and it wasn't.
Now for my take. Its a true dissapointment that jeep has left the rugged "do all" aspect for more car like package but I fully understand why and that times change. I'm sure that by now most of the short comings with the libs engine have been identified (if not fixed) so maybe it could be made worthy.I just don't know that for an expo rig where I was heading into the wilderness and wasn't more sure it wasn't going to explode. That not withstanding, there are the other downfalls of the lib. Space as you've discovered is kinda limited. That can be addressed I'm sure but then you have the off road capabilities of it, or lack there of. Its not dreadful off road but you'd be limited to more mild trails without significant modifications.
Its too bad the Grand Cherokee diesel is so expensive to buy, even now. The 3.0 MB diesel in that one is outstanding!
Add to that the fact that the Lib is sort of the bastard child with the jeep name badge and its kinda already got the deck stacked against it. Un-jeep looking, independant suspention, low ground clearance, not much of gearing options, etc..Got the cold shoulder in the jeeping comunity.It was "supposed" to be a replacment for for the XJ and it wasn't.
Now for my take. Its a true dissapointment that jeep has left the rugged "do all" aspect for more car like package but I fully understand why and that times change. I'm sure that by now most of the short comings with the libs engine have been identified (if not fixed) so maybe it could be made worthy.I just don't know that for an expo rig where I was heading into the wilderness and wasn't more sure it wasn't going to explode. That not withstanding, there are the other downfalls of the lib. Space as you've discovered is kinda limited. That can be addressed I'm sure but then you have the off road capabilities of it, or lack there of. Its not dreadful off road but you'd be limited to more mild trails without significant modifications.
Its too bad the Grand Cherokee diesel is so expensive to buy, even now. The 3.0 MB diesel in that one is outstanding!
matthewp
Combat Truck Monkey
I wouldn't bash the Liberty too bad, it's been a faithful rig for me the last 4 years and 93,000 miles.:smiley_drive:
As for the CRD, I haven't heard too many nice things about the motor either. There is quite a bit of information from CRD owners on L.O.S.T Jeeps (http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/) to help you make an informed decision.
As for the CRD, I haven't heard too many nice things about the motor either. There is quite a bit of information from CRD owners on L.O.S.T Jeeps (http://www.lostjeeps.com/forum/phpBB3/) to help you make an informed decision.
I have almost 50k miles on my '06 CRD that I've used and abused to no end. If anything, the truck will probably fall apart around the little diesel. That motor is what drew me to the KJ, however the size and appearence of the vehicle has worked perfectly for me.
I think it's funny someone would view a WK as more authentic Jeep. I seriously considered one with the diesel but in the end decided the Libby was a better off roader out of the box and was easier to mod.
With OME springs and real 31" tires, my CRD is as capable as a lot of Wranglers out there with more room, power and economy.
I think it's funny someone would view a WK as more authentic Jeep. I seriously considered one with the diesel but in the end decided the Libby was a better off roader out of the box and was easier to mod.
With OME springs and real 31" tires, my CRD is as capable as a lot of Wranglers out there with more room, power and economy.
jeepdreamer
Expedition Leader
It isn't my intent to bash the lib. I had high hopes for it when it was brought out as the XJs replacment. And I got very excited when the diesel snuck in. I just think it has a different... scope(?). Asthetics don't really matter to me so I don't like/hate it based on that. I just have a prefernence to less plastic and more utilitarian aspects for my jeeps. But its just that.. personal opinion. My sister has driven her gas lib almost to death and has had very few troubles. Does she ever do what I do with my jeeps? No. But thats not why she bought it.
As for the Lib being easier to mod and better out of the box than a grand? *shrugs* Guess that depends on perspective. I think the lack of a solid front axle in both platforms makes them harder to mod. I do feel like the grand got more after market support since it has had better acceptability.
As for the Lib being easier to mod and better out of the box than a grand? *shrugs* Guess that depends on perspective. I think the lack of a solid front axle in both platforms makes them harder to mod. I do feel like the grand got more after market support since it has had better acceptability.
No doubt the small suv market changed between '84 with the xj and the intro of the kj in '04 and they are very different vehicles. But I'm not sure how a wk or even a zj is closer to traditional jeep roots than the libby.
When I compared a stock crd to the gc I was looking at, the crd had better tires(size and design), gearing and ground clearance for off road use. While neither vehicle is anything serious, wks are awfully low from the factory.
When I compared a stock crd to the gc I was looking at, the crd had better tires(size and design), gearing and ground clearance for off road use. While neither vehicle is anything serious, wks are awfully low from the factory.
jeepdreamer
Expedition Leader
Different breeds of apples. Without sounding harsh and offending anyone with my opinion, neither model is close to Jeeps traditional roots. But that is not what they were created for. In a way they have their own lineage and share only the basic concept of going where cars don't and the moniker. Do I think the only "true" jeep is a '40s era flatfender? No. Hardly. That is where it all began but unless we all decided that rolling around at 50mph with niether seatbelts or a rollbar was normal...? Point is that times have changed and Jeep has slowly gone along. They maintain the full frame jeeps to cater to the diehard folks but more importantly.. its top still comes off. Once Jeep stepped into the SUV arena it was a new game for them. Add to that the constantly changing technology, tougher restrictions for saftey and standards, and a very difficult economy (to say the least) and they have done well to just keep their doors open. That is where and why the SUV Jeeps are so important. But they were not truely intended to be compitition for the CJ/YJ/TJ/JK. they are a different animal. But I would risk that the GC and the LIB are siblings. Having wheeled both and wheeled With both, they do ok. Not going to be running the Chilie Challenge or KOH in either but so? Couldn't do that with a bone stock any Jeep. For me it seems as if there is a realistic limit to how far either of the two could be built. I say realistic from a money point of view. The lack of a solid front axle in either means a very expensive conversion should one decide to go bigger than say a 33" tire. Add to that the smallish wheel well openings and the amount of lift required to gain the tire clearence...*shrugs*I suppose it all depends on what one does when they are exploring?
But to address the OP...could a Lib be built, well, for overland or expo adventures? Most certianly yes! Could you spend the time to work on any possible weaknesses of the VM diesel? Sure. The end result could be a unique and fun little ride. But maybe a long preplanning session and cost to value discussion should take place prior to jumping in?
But to address the OP...could a Lib be built, well, for overland or expo adventures? Most certianly yes! Could you spend the time to work on any possible weaknesses of the VM diesel? Sure. The end result could be a unique and fun little ride. But maybe a long preplanning session and cost to value discussion should take place prior to jumping in?
We have a Liberty CRD, had a few problems but nothing really out of the ordinary in over 100k miles. Between our TJ being sold and our JK being on order, we took a couple of trips in it that had some decent off-roading (nothing extreme, but fairly rough trails over passes, up to ghost towns, etc) and it did surprisingly well
Mostly I like the fact that with a small lift and aggressive tires I still get 21-24 mpg highway even with a lot of hills. And the torque is great. I wish there was a Diesel option for my Wrangler, even after re-gearing, with 35's and a rooftent, I could use the torque and a few extra mpg would be great for the extra range.
There are some pretty built Liberty's out there; the L.O.S.T. site is a good place to look.,but, as mentioned in another post, the lack of a solid front axle, among other things, makes anything really extreme fairly costly.
Mostly I like the fact that with a small lift and aggressive tires I still get 21-24 mpg highway even with a lot of hills. And the torque is great. I wish there was a Diesel option for my Wrangler, even after re-gearing, with 35's and a rooftent, I could use the torque and a few extra mpg would be great for the extra range.
There are some pretty built Liberty's out there; the L.O.S.T. site is a good place to look.,but, as mentioned in another post, the lack of a solid front axle, among other things, makes anything really extreme fairly costly.
Thank you Gentlemen! I was just wondering if it was cost-worthy to find and try and build one. It's hard enough to find one if wanted. You have brought up a lot of great deciding factors as to a yes or no answer. Not bashing the Liberty but I think my money may better be spent on transforming my Ram 3500 Cummins...altho a lot more money, but probably a better platform. Thanks again you guys! I see I am definatly not alone as I await the arrival of a diesel Wrangler. Take care, Walt