Junkyard 44s, HP Dana 30s, D35s and 8.8s

[JeepN95YJ]

I'm starting to see a LOT of recommendations for axle swaps lately in the Jeep section. It is starting to remind me of JeepsUnlimited, JeepForum and Pirate4x4.

While I agree upgrades are necessary for heavy duty rockcrawling I just don't think they are NEEDED for what most do or for what this forum is intended. I saw someone in another thread that posted "just get out and do it". I think that was perfect advice.

None of the newer Jeeps need the front D30 axle replaced up to 35" tires. HP or LP, really doesn't make that much difference. I have seen the LP30 in TJs break spider gears, but that is usually from VERY aggressive driving. For overlanding, just run it.

The D35 has bad reputation. I've seen my fair share of broken axle shafts and a few bent housings. Again, these were usually the result of heavy throttle and very little common sense. Also, every one I've seen broken was on 35 inch tires or bigger. The main reason I see to swap it though is for peace of mind.

The 8.8 is a great/cheap upgrade that will provide that peace of mind. It is fairly easy to fit and is considerably stronger than the D35. Fabrication required.

Junkyard D44s are A LOT OF WORK and require multiple changes. Steering, wheels, driveshafts, etc. Definitely requires fabrication.

Of course I swapped my first D35 for an 8.8 in my YJ on 35s. Then I swapped in a D60 front and a 9 inch rear and went to 37s. Now my TJ has a 9 inch rear and a Currie HPD44 front on 33s. If the TJ didn't already have the axles installed when I bought it, I'd have left them alone.

It is real easy to get caught up in the build-it bug. Just remember to get out and enjoy it.

 

[BIGdaddy]

8.25 is a bolt-in swap. no fab required. good up to 35's. this has been asked and answered.

seems commonly held that if the d35 breaks the chrysler model is the way to go for overlanding.

thanks though, these ARE just discussions, homie...nothin' wrong with that.

 

[cocco78]

One of the big reasons I got rid of my D30 was I was constantly going through unit bearings every year when I was on 33x12.5 goodyear mt/r's... And if you plan to put on alot of miles off the highway the unit bearings are going to start pissing you off. Also the smaller ball joints of the D30 tend to not last as long as the D44 ball joints. I did some pretty decent wheeling with an aussie locked d30 and the only real carnage were u-joints, and that was mostly because to much throttle. I wheeled for a couple years on the c-clip d35 as well but I swapped it out to a junkyard 8.8 with disk brakes which is a very stout axle, 1.5" shafts, 31 spline...

I cought the build bug as well when my 4 wheeling started to see more and more rocks... Now i'm on a 3/4t hp44 and a D70 rear and 37" tires, lol... I build it to be able to run down the highway at 70mph and crawl at 2mph though, so its not a total rock crawler. Maybe a hybrid crawler/expo, i'm not afraid to drive it anywhere.

this pic was from my recent 1000 mile overland trip across the UP of Michigan...

 

[emohn]

8.25 is a bolt-in swap. no fab required. good up to 35's. this has been asked and answered.

seems commonly held that if the d35 breaks the chrysler model is the way to go for overlanding.

thanks though, these ARE just discussions, homie...nothin' wrong with that.

We don't all have XJ's. :sombrero:

8.25's are a direct swap (and a damn fine idea) for leaf sprung rear Jeeps like XJ's and YJ's.

For TJ's, the most cost effective upgrade (in my opinion, just an opinion) is the 8.8 if you have the ability to weld the bracket kits yourself or have someone who can do it on the cheap. The Super 35 is waaaayy too much money for too little improvement, and 44's are a bit overrated for what people ask for them - then again, if you get a used factory or Mopar D44, then the price you pay goes to bolt-in convenience.

All that said, I'm still on my stock 35, but I've yet to do anything stupid or remotely "hardcore".

-Erik

 

[Xjaddiction]

True, that it's easy to get caught up in the build bug... BUT, overlanding requires more mixed driving, and farther distance than the local off road park. I have always prided myself in the fact I didn't trailer a rig. I always drove on the road to the off-road park, then home. Anything that broke, had to be fixed.

I broke a dana 35 open, easy pedal comming down a gravel road back to the trail head. I had 32 AT's on my XJ at this point. Somewhere along my many off road travels, a sheared a few teeth off of the spider gears. Finally pinched one between the diff cover and the ring gear. Pushed right through bottom of the cover, draining most of the oil out of the diff. If at high speed on the interstate, prob. wouldn't have noticed till the rear end burned up. That could have been nasty at interstate speeds.

Now, They had a shop, and I welded the cover, and the the spiders to get home. I replaced it with a Chryco 29 spline 8.25.

On a trip through the U.P. for instance... on one of those long lonely old logging roads from Grand Marais along Lake Superior... well that would be a bummer, trip over, and a long walk if ya broke. Although one of those nice Uppers would pick ya up for sure.

point is, I think expedition rigs need to be well maintained, and built to handle loads, and long miles in all conditions. Ask one of those Mid-West dudes what would happen if ya broke down in the dead of winter in a remote area...

Anyway, I agree that you should get out there. But... a dana 35 is useless with anything above a stock tire. Swaps are cheap in most cases... I guess build it for what you feel comfortable driving around with your family inside.

I've been trail riding, and rock crawlin' for years... I look at expedition as a step up in my abilities to build and maintain a rig for anything.

 

[BIGdaddy]

We don't all have XJ's. :sombrero:

8.25's are a direct swap (and a damn fine idea) for leaf sprung rear Jeeps like XJ's and YJ's.

For TJ's, the most cost effective upgrade (in my opinion, just an opinion) is the 8.8 if you have the ability to weld the bracket kits yourself or have someone who can do it on the cheap. The Super 35 is waaaayy too much money for too little improvement, and 44's are a bit overrated for what people ask for them - then again, if you get a used factory or Mopar D44, then the price you pay goes to bolt-in convenience.

All that said, I'm still on my stock 35, but I've yet to do anything stupid or remotely "hardcore".

-Erik

you're right, sorry:victory:, I forgot you coilers...

 

[Overland]

my jeeps play a multipurpose role in my life. from some pretty serious rock crawling to long highway drives and everything in between. i swapped out the 30/35 or upgraded them at different times for piece of mind. i dont care if i am crossing the yukon or crawling the local rocks i dont want to be slowed down or completely stopped by breakage. and since i choose to run 35's or biger on all my rigs i know the 30/35 axles wont make it.

heres a scenario, your on an 'overland' trip on a river crossing (doesnt have to be deep) just the bridge that was there 30 years ago is gone or no longer safe. out in the middle of 2 feet of running cold water you get hung up on a rock and give it a bit of skinny pedal, you break an axle in your rear 35 and...now what? not a gret aplace to change an axle or even try to setup the axle hold in hilift handle.

sure you can use a stock jeep for overlanding. go ahead and get out there doing it. sooner or later almost all of us want that extra clearance give by bigger tires and then you may have to start thinking about axle upgrades.

i am not saying it is some thing we will all do or have to do. but if people have questions about it, I for one will be glad to answer and help out with any experience i can give.

happy trails guys (and girls)

 

[sass3g]

i have a yj and i cant find any info on whether or not the 8.25 is a direct swap for me. is this a complete bolt in or is it about the same as an 8.8 install? ive never been able to find what all is involved in a 8.25 swap into a yj. any info or links on this subject would be awesome!

Thanks,

Dave

 

[cocco78]

i have a yj and i cant find any info on whether or not the 8.25 is a direct swap for me. is this a complete bolt in or is it about the same as an 8.8 install? ive never been able to find what all is involved in a 8.25 swap into a yj. any info or links on this subject would be awesome!

Thanks,

Dave

XJ's are all setup for spring over axle, your YJ is spring under axle... The the spring perches on the 8.25 will be on top the axle and you need them on the bottom. Plus, I believe the spring pads are a different width apart, not sure on that. Either way it will cost you about $120 for a swap kit with spring perches, ubolts and everything you need except someone to weld it on. http://www.ruffstuffspecialties.com/catalog/simple-spline-p-186.html that link is for the 8.8 kit but they have others... Then figure a couple bucks for brake lines and misc parts. It gets expensive when you have to start swapping gears though, most 8.8's i've seen have 3.73 gears....

Yeah, my jeep might be overkill for expo'ing but I agree that a D30/D35 gets less reliable as the tire size increases. In my case I was just wearing out unit bearings and ball joints, I wasn't breaking them. Just long miles on rough roads doesn't agree with light duty parts. My Jeep, the one pictured above, only gets trailered about 10% of the time, and thats mostly because I don't feel like driving a wet dirty Jeep home after a weekend of wheeling at a park. that and 38" bias swampers on H1 rims that I recentered myself don't do well on the road above 20mph, lol. But I don't have any problem with getting in the Jeep and driving it to CA from MI and back. For our honeymoon we plan to drive the Jeep out to CA and spend a week on the rubicon and drive it home....

 

[IXNAYXJ]

True, that it's easy to get caught up in the build bug... BUT, overlanding requires more mixed driving, and farther distance than the local off road park. I have always prided myself in the fact I didn't trailer a rig. I always drove on the road to the off-road park, then home. Anything that broke, had to be fixed.

Yes.

heres a scenario, your on an 'overland' trip on a river crossing (doesnt have to be deep) just the bridge that was there 30 years ago is gone or no longer safe. out in the middle of 2 feet of running cold water you get hung up on a rock and give it a bit of skinny pedal, you break an axle in your rear 35 and...now what?

Bingo!

I think Overland travel is all the more reason for big axles. If you're just towing your rig to the local ORV area or Off-Road park, who cares if you break something. If you're out of cell range, 300 miles from another human being, don't you think being over built is a good thing? I did my narrowed HPD44/Super8.8 swap while I was on 34" tires. Granted, I wheel harder than the average Overlander, but, the point remains.

Besides, isn't it nice to know you can do something, even if you rarely or never do? My .02% of a dollar worth.

-----Matt-----

 

[78Bronco]

Heep axles!

I see what you are saying about keeping it stock and just wheel it but from what I have seen most Jeep axles don't survive at all. I wouldn't rely on them let alone risk being stranded in the bush. It has to be the most lacking aspect of Jeep engineering.

For comparison my Mitsubishi has a 9.5" rear diff and 8" front from the factory and it's camparable in size to an XJ.

 

[IXNAYXJ]

...most Jeep axles don't survive at all.

A D30 and 8.25 can hold up to 33's, easily. Anything more than that and shafts are required in the 30. The 29-spline 8.25 is good to 35's, at least. As much as I dislike 'em, they're pretty darn alright.

Another thing to consider is axle tube size. If you go to a bigger axle and ring gear, you're going to need bigger tires to clear the axle tube and differential housing. That 9.5" ring gear on your Mitsu must SUCK with smaller tires.

-----Matt-----

 

[78Bronco]

That 9.5" ring gear on your Mitsu must SUCK with smaller tires.

-----Matt-----

Yes it does suck having factory 4.90:1 and 31's...sucks even more fitting 33's without any lift/sheet metal mods. Really sucks.:ylsmoke:


If I ever mod the truck it'll be a dana44 sas for the front to simplify the setup. For now I drive it.

----Matthew-----