New to trailers. A few basic questions.

[Saharicon]

Hey guys. I just purchased Jeff Lawrence's cargo trailer build.

Jeff did an amazing job on this trailer. It was exactly what I had been looking for. I will be starting another thread about the trailers new adventures as I assured Jeff's wife and son it would go on, as Jeff would of wanted.

The wife and I purchased our Tacoma in August last year with for the purpose of overland travel. I should note that it does have the tow package.

Fortunately, the misses loves traveling all over in the middle of nowhere. We also have 2 siberian huskies and would like to be able to stay out for weeks at a time. The trailer seemed perfect for our needs.

I have never owned a trailer so I have a few questions if you guys wouldn't mind...

First off, I picked the trailer up and had about a two and half hour drive from LA back up 15/395 to the DV area. Never hauling a trailer I was pretty nervous, but it went great! Trailer towed awesome and a couple times on those long boring stretches across 395 I almost forgot we had a trailer.

I read a lot about what gear to tow in before I picked it up and got mixed reports on the forums. I stayed in 4th most of the time. Is this the proper gear I should be in when towing with the Tacoma?

Also, I am not sure what the exact tongue wait is. I believe the trailer weight about 2100lbs overall. What is the best way to find out the tongue weight? Truck scale under the front jack?

The Tacoma towed the trailer just fine, but I noticed that the rear end did sag some and the rear was a little bouncy over some bumps. I had planned on doing a full 3" lift, but with the trailer purchase this will have to wait a little bit longer. What would be the best thing to do in the rear suspension for hauling the trailer, but also daily driving without the trailer?

Lastly, Jeff put airbags on the trailer. I have zero experience with airbags, but I read in the build that you could lower and raise the trailer with this. I did find where the air lines and everything ran with a typical tire stem. What are the proper PSIs I should be checking especially for during towing? Also, I was going to get a CO2 tank for airing up tires on the trail. Can the airbags use CO2 as well?

I think that is the majority of the questions I have. If you guys think I should know anything else about hauling a trailer, especially off road, please let me know. I am getting a break controller first thing.

Thanks in advance!

 

[ACON]

you can tow in fifth if you want as long as it isnt much load. 2100lbs isnt all that much for a tacoma on road. obviosly weighed down woulld be different.

toss some weigjt in the trailer and it will be less bouncy

airbags are not difficult to tune. adjust for height and load balance and you shouldnt need to worry about pressure. they are so small, checking the pressure will change the pressure.

co2 wont be a problem as long as you make adjustments slowly tto the bags, they use very little volume of air.

tongue weight...can you pick it up by the tongue?

a factory "tow package" is nothing more than a hitch mount and wiring.it is called a package so they can charge you more than its worth.

 

[Saharicon]

you can tow in fifth if you want as long as it isnt much load. 2100lbs isnt all that much for a tacoma on road. obviosly weighed down woulld be different.

toss some weigjt in the trailer and it will be less bouncy

airbags are not difficult to tune. adjust for height and load balance and you shouldnt need to worry about pressure. they are so small, checking the pressure will change the pressure.

co2 wont be a problem as long as you make adjustments slowly tto the bags, they use very little volume of air.

tongue weight...can you pick it up by the tongue?

a factory "tow package" is nothing more than a hitch mount and wiring.it is called a package so they can charge you more than its worth.

Thanks for the input.

I can not pick up the tongue and move it around.

Just for reference if anyone else reads this. The Tacoma Tow package comes with the following opposed to the non tow package Tacoma to my knowledge:
Class IV reciever
Engine oil cooler
Trainsmission cooler
HD Battery
130 amp alternator
and the plug and play brake controller pigtail

 

[ACON]

sorry, on my older tacoma(long since gone) it was only the class IV hitch and the wiring hatness.

the easiest thing to do about "squat" is to load balance the trailer, that will give you the best performance for your truck when you dont have the trailer there. you do want more weight on the tongue than rearward of the trailer axle so it will track correctly but not so much that your truck suffers the load. Deaver makes really nice soft progressive springs that can flex and handle a load nicely. that is what i put on my SAS 2000 Tacoma years ago.

i saw the build thread for that trailer last night as i havrnt been anything but a guest here until recently. so now i have a reference of what we are talking about

if the batteries havent been moved to the rear, i would do that soon. also carry the lightest things in your truck and the front of the trailler and heavier things in the rear or over the axle of the trailer. this will change depending on the type of terrain expected as your truck will have less problem rolling over rougher terrain with the load than your trailer will but on smooth roads and highway i would put the weight in the trailer.

 

[Saharicon]

sorry, on my older tacoma(long since gone) it was only the class IV hitch and the wiring hatness.

the easiest thing to do about "squat" is to load balance the trailer, that will give you the best performance for your truck when you dont have the trailer there. you do want more weight on the tongue than rearward of the trailer axle so it will track correctly but not so much that your truck suffers the load. Deaver makes really nice soft progressive springs that can flex and handle a load nicely. that is what i put on my SAS 2000 Tacoma years ago.

i saw the build thread for that trailer last night as i havrnt been anything but a guest here until recently. so now i have a reference of what we are talking about

if the batteries havent been moved to the rear, i would do that soon. also carry the lightest things in your truck and the front of the trailler and heavier things in the rear or over the axle of the trailer. this will change depending on the type of terrain expected as your truck will have less problem rolling over rougher terrain with the load than your trailer will but on smooth roads and highway i would put the weight in the trailer.

No worries, man. Just wanted to post the difference for anyone reading.

The battery hasn't been moved yet. It still sits on the same spot it shows in the build thread at the front. I will look at moving this to over the axle.

Thanks for the info.


Sent from my fancy city machine.

 

[702krawler]

There are a couple of fairly accurate ways to figure out tongue weight (which should be 10 to 15 percent of total weight). First, you can simply use a bathroom scale. This obviously won't work if the tongue weight is more than the scale's capacity (though there are ways around that as well). Second, take it to a truck scale, weight the trailer with it still attached to the truck (which should be completely off the scale), then weigh the trailer disconnected from the truck completely. The second weight minus the first weight is your tongue weight, and as a bonus you now also know the overall weight of the trailer.

 

[shogun]

The generally accepted value for tongue weight is 10% of total load. Its generally accepted because nobody has any other imperical data to counter it, and there is no imperical data to support it either.

If the tongue weight is negative (upward lift) it will be an unstable situation and may result in vehicle instability. So you need some positive weight, but the whole point of a trailer is to allow you to place weight on an axle other than the vehicle primary axles. So that goal is to place as much of the load on the trailer axle. If a large portion of the trailer load is being carried on the vehicle rear axle you havent gained anything except space, and the vehicle is likely to protest.

The goal with the tongue is to keep it down (positive) but to not make it (and your vehicle) carry the load. On a smooth surface it will only require minimal weight to keep the tongue positive while on uneven surfaces you will need more. So on a highway trip you could load almost at zero tongue weight (exclusive of aerodynamic loads). Note I said almost. On uneven terrain you need more, but still be able to lift it by hand, maybe 50-100lb. Keep in mind that on rough terrain you will not be going 75mph so the need for lots of weight to keep the tongue down is not huge.

Pay attention to the rear lift while driving and you will get a feel for how its doing. Momentary negative (lift) unloads are not critical.

 

[Saharicon]

The generally accepted value for tongue weight is 10% of total load. Its generally accepted because nobody has any other imperical data to counter it, and there is no imperical data to support it either.

If the tongue weight is negative (upward lift) it will be an unstable situation and may result in vehicle instability. So you need some positive weight, but the whole point of a trailer is to allow you to place weight on an axle other than the vehicle primary axles. So that goal is to place as much of the load on the trailer axle. If a large portion of the trailer load is being carried on the vehicle rear axle you havent gained anything except space, and the vehicle is likely to protest.

The goal with the tongue is to keep it down (positive) but to not make it (and your vehicle) carry the load. On a smooth surface it will only require minimal weight to keep the tongue positive while on uneven surfaces you will need more. So on a highway trip you could load almost at zero tongue weight (exclusive of aerodynamic loads). Note I said almost. On uneven terrain you need more, but still be able to lift it by hand, maybe 50-100lb. Keep in mind that on rough terrain you will not be going 75mph so the need for lots of weight to keep the tongue down is not huge.

Pay attention to the rear lift while driving and you will get a feel for how its doing. Momentary negative (lift) unloads are not critical.

Thank you very much! That is exactly the kind of instruction I need being brand new to trailers. Makes perfect sense though.

One question. When you say pay attention to the rear lift while driving. What exactly are you referring too and how would you check this in motion?




Sent from my fancy city machine.

 

[Saharicon]

There are a couple of fairly accurate ways to figure out tongue weight (which should be 10 to 15 percent of total weight). First, you can simply use a bathroom scale. This obviously won't work if the tongue weight is more than the scale's capacity (though there are ways around that as well). Second, take it to a truck scale, weight the trailer with it still attached to the truck (which should be completely off the scale), then weigh the trailer disconnected from the truck completely. The second weight minus the first weight is your tongue weight, and as a bonus you now also know the overall weight of the trailer.

Thanks, Krawler. Im pretty sure it would squash a regular scale so I am going to see if I can find a truck scale anywhere close. Should probably know the exacts anyway.


Sent from my fancy city machine.

 

[colorado matt]

found this while was researching tongue weight myself .................. http://hildstrom.com/projects/tonguescale/index.html

 

[Saharicon]

found this while was researching tongue weight myself .................. http://hildstrom.com/projects/tonguescale/index.html

Oh sweet! Thanks! That is def helpful.

 

[shogun]

Thank you very much! That is exactly the kind of instruction I need being brand new to trailers. Makes perfect sense though.

One question. When you say pay attention to the rear lift while driving. What exactly are you referring too and how would you check this in motion?




Sent from my fancy city machine.

If you have a pintle hitch you can hear it rattle when it unloads. It hits the top inside of the pintle, so you can get a feel for how easily it goes negative. So long as you dont have vehicle instability its OK, but if its happening alot you might want to add a few more pounds to reduce the unloading.

If you use a ball hitch, first get rid of it, but if not then you need to try to feel the rear of the vehicle lifting and the front wandering.

Generally I load the trailer, then lift up on the hitch to get a feel for it. Easily lifted is fine, like a 25-50 lb sack of sand.

 

[Saharicon]

If you have a pintle hitch you can hear it rattle when it unloads. It hits the top inside of the pintle, so you can get a feel for how easily it goes negative. So long as you dont have vehicle instability its OK, but if its happening alot you might want to add a few more pounds to reduce the unloading.

If you use a ball hitch, first get rid of it, but if not then you need to try to feel the rear of the vehicle lifting and the front wandering.

Generally I load the trailer, then lift up on the hitch to get a feel for it. Easily lifted is fine, like a 25-50 lb sack of sand.

Ok, I have a Max Coupler. Any recommendations for checking that?

I did not notice any odd driving habits when I drove it 2hrs back from LA and up to the Sierras. The only time the trailer made a peep was once a car cut me off and I had to break and it sounded like a metal slam (nothing bad) and then once I accelerated a little too much and felt it. Was maybe the pin slamming back after being stopped?

I have the trailer all leveled right now with the rear leveling jacks. If I raise them a little to get them off the ground then I can check better if I can pick up the tongue. I realized I was being a complete newbie last night when I tried to lift the tongue and the rear leveling jacks were all the way down.

Oh also, what is the best way to disconnect from the Max coupler? I just pulled the pin that is in the truck receiver. Put all the jacks down, 1 front and 2 year, and then pulled the truck away as the max coupler and hitch and everything slide out of the receiver.

After I did it, I realized that was probably not the right or smartest way to do it.

Let me also clarify why I brought the tongue weight and everything up. When the tongue has its full weight as it is configured right now on the Taco I saw it sag to what I thought was considerable low and I could also really feel the all of the roads bumps and waves in the rear as I went over them. Now this could all be completely normal and I am just not experienced.

Also, I should note. If anyone is familiar with 395 just north of Adelento, CA. I hit those large dips at about 60 which gives a heavy -/+ G effect. Again, I didn't notice anything odd in the truck or how the trailer pulled. I don't know if that means anything, but thought I would share.

Thanks so much for all your input. It is really appreciated.


Sent from my fancy city machine.

 

[702krawler]

I do something similar with my max coupler, but I put down only the tongue wheel, move the trailer back by hand, then put down the other jacks and/or chock the wheels. Pulling away seems a little unsafe. If something gets hung up you won't notice in time (unless you have a spotter).

 

[Saharicon]

So I raised the rear jacks and tried to pick it up by the tongue. Not even close to happening.