Portable battery jumper question

Ruffin' It

Explorer
So I have one of those oh-so-handy portable battery jumper box-things. You know, the kind that you plug-in, charge and forget to put back in your truck only on the trips where you end up really needing it. My problem is I have lost the thing to plug it in to the wall to charge it making it a highly effective paperweight.
My question is this; can I hook it up to my car battery while on a trip and charge it that way? Sort of a poor man's dual battery system. I know just enough about electronics to know that I don't know enough about electronics to figure this out.

Any thoughts?

Thanks,
 

Herbie

Rendezvous Conspirator
Without knowing a lot more about the inner workings of the thing, I'd have to guess "no". Even if the device is dumb-simple, there may still be a diode or the like in the output circuit to protect against accidental reverse-hookup. This diode (if it exists) would prevent current from flowing back into the battery, which would prevent charging. Unless you can dig up the manual and it indicates this is ok, I wouldn't do it.

Now for your REAL problem: The wall charger. Should be easy enough to replace or bodge. What was the connection? Was it just an AC cord with a special plug, or was it a "wall wart" transformer with a DC plug to the unit?

If it was a wall-wart, the jack on the unit should be labeled with the correct input polarity and voltage (and usually current), which should make shopping for a replacement wart very easy. If it was an AC cord, chances are its one of a few standard shapes, might also be easy to replace. Either way, take a good close-up picture of where the wall charger plugs in. (Have macro mode on a digital camera? Use that.)

If I can figure out the input, I can help you get a replacement.

Incidentally, if the unit was charged via a DC input, and a 12VDC input at that... THEN you might be able to use THAT input to charge it from the car's battery/alternator system. Get a good picture, and we'll take a look.
 
Last edited:

Ruffin' It

Explorer
....aaaannnnd I'm back.

Sorry for the delay. Too many things going on compounded by computer issues. I am having a hard time getting my computer to recognize my camera so I can't get it to download the photo and the camera on my phone won't focus close enough to be of much use. There are no markings at all around the charger input so I am clueless about amperage, but I would guess it is a 12 volt (due to the 12 volt DC output socket it has and the fact that if i am wrong, the worse thing that will happen is it will blow up :ylsmoke:). The cylindrical part of the adapter plug that inserts into the unit is 1/4 inch wide with a mid-sized center post and hails from the "wall wart" family tree.

I know this isn't a whole lot to go on and if it doesn't give you enough information to help I totally understand and appreciate the help regardless.

Thanks!!

Without knowing a lot more about the inner workings of the thing, I'd have to guess "no". Even if the device is dumb-simple, there may still be a diode or the like in the output circuit to protect against accidental reverse-hookup. This diode (if it exists) would prevent current from flowing back into the battery, which would prevent charging. Unless you can dig up the manual and it indicates this is ok, I wouldn't do it.

Now for your REAL problem: The wall charger. Should be easy enough to replace or bodge. What was the connection? Was it just an AC cord with a special plug, or was it a "wall wart" transformer with a DC plug to the unit?

If it was a wall-wart, the jack on the unit should be labeled with the correct input polarity and voltage (and usually current), which should make shopping for a replacement wart very easy. If it was an AC cord, chances are its one of a few standard shapes, might also be easy to replace. Either way, take a good close-up picture of where the wall charger plugs in. (Have macro mode on a digital camera? Use that.)

If I can figure out the input, I can help you get a replacement.

Incidentally, if the unit was charged via a DC input, and a 12VDC input at that... THEN you might be able to use THAT input to charge it from the car's battery/alternator system. Get a good picture, and we'll take a look.
 

wrcsixeight

Adventurer
I have opened up several of the portable jumper packs. None of them had diodes on the jumper cables themselves, so they can be recharged by hooking them up to your regular battery and running the engine. They should not be left connected over long periods when the engine is not running.

While they all contain different sizes of 12 volt AGM sealed batteries, the ciggy plugs might or might not be able to flow electricity backwards(possible diodes), meaning you might not be able to just plug a cord with 2 male ciggy plug adapters to charge it. This would not work very well anyway because the limited wire sizes in vehicles limit the charging current anyway.

A fully charged 12 volt battery should actually read 12.8 volts, so a wall wart which only outputs 12.0 volts will not charge the battery. Usually they are 13.7 to 14.4 volts and 600 to 1400 milliamps.

If you have a regular automatic battery charger with a 2 amp setting you can use this hooked up to the alligator clips. A fully discharged 12 amp hour battery would need ~ 6 hours to be brought upto 100%. 12 a/h is the smallest battery I have seen in these jumper packs, with 24 a/h being the biggest. They are sealed AGM batteries and are sensitive to overcharge, so do not use a high amp charger on them, or even a low amp manual charger unless you monitor it closely. Do not let the voltage go up and over 14.8 volts, and when they get warm, they are full. If they get hot, they are being overcharged, will offgas, possibly dangerously, and lose capacity.

The batteries within these jumper packs are designed as starting batteries, versus deep cycle batteries, so they really do not like to be discharged below 80% State of Charge(SOC)very often. The deeper any battery is drawn down, the less cycles it will give. Deep cycle batteries just are more tolerant of this abuse.

While AGM batteries self discharge at a much slower rate than flooded batteries, they will still sulfate and lose capacity quickly if they are left in a discharged state. The length of time they sit discharged and the depth of the discharge dictate how much capacity they have lost. If your jumper pack has sat uncharged for months, It might not be worth the effort of trying to find a wall wart charger for it. You could get one, fully charge it, and then find that when you need to use it, it doesn't have enough juice to jump your vehicle.

I have replaced the AGM batteries inside these units for about half the price of buying a new one. I have also cannabalised them for parts.

When you look at the cost of them you realize you are buying convenience. For the same price you could buy another full size battery that has 5 to 9 times the capacity and use a pair of jumper cables.
 

Ruffin' It

Explorer
I love this place. It has actually sat for about two years, so I'm guessing it is a paperweight now.
Thanks to everyone who offered info and help. It is really appreciated.


I have opened up several of the portable jumper packs. None of them had diodes on the jumper cables themselves, so they can be recharged by hooking them up to your regular battery and running the engine. They should not be left connected over long periods when the engine is not running.

While they all contain different sizes of 12 volt AGM sealed batteries, the ciggy plugs might or might not be able to flow electricity backwards(possible diodes), meaning you might not be able to just plug a cord with 2 male ciggy plug adapters to charge it. This would not work very well anyway because the limited wire sizes in vehicles limit the charging current anyway.

A fully charged 12 volt battery should actually read 12.8 volts, so a wall wart which only outputs 12.0 volts will not charge the battery. Usually they are 13.7 to 14.4 volts and 600 to 1400 milliamps.

If you have a regular automatic battery charger with a 2 amp setting you can use this hooked up to the alligator clips. A fully discharged 12 amp hour battery would need ~ 6 hours to be brought upto 100%. 12 a/h is the smallest battery I have seen in these jumper packs, with 24 a/h being the biggest. They are sealed AGM batteries and are sensitive to overcharge, so do not use a high amp charger on them, or even a low amp manual charger unless you monitor it closely. Do not let the voltage go up and over 14.8 volts, and when they get warm, they are full. If they get hot, they are being overcharged, will offgas, possibly dangerously, and lose capacity.

The batteries within these jumper packs are designed as starting batteries, versus deep cycle batteries, so they really do not like to be discharged below 80% State of Charge(SOC)very often. The deeper any battery is drawn down, the less cycles it will give. Deep cycle batteries just are more tolerant of this abuse.

While AGM batteries self discharge at a much slower rate than flooded batteries, they will still sulfate and lose capacity quickly if they are left in a discharged state. The length of time they sit discharged and the depth of the discharge dictate how much capacity they have lost. If your jumper pack has sat uncharged for months, It might not be worth the effort of trying to find a wall wart charger for it. You could get one, fully charge it, and then find that when you need to use it, it doesn't have enough juice to jump your vehicle.

I have replaced the AGM batteries inside these units for about half the price of buying a new one. I have also cannabalised them for parts.

When you look at the cost of them you realize you are buying convenience. For the same price you could buy another full size battery that has 5 to 9 times the capacity and use a pair of jumper cables.
 

wrcsixeight

Adventurer
If it wasn't fully discharged before you put it away for 2 years, it could possibly still be okay. Especially if it has been kept cool. AGMs lose 3 to 4 percent a month at 75 degs f where as regular flooded batteries lose 12 to 14% a month at 75degs.

I have a battery from one of those jumper packs which is over 10 years old now. It could never jump my van, but I do use it to power my 9.6 volt formerly cordless drill or my 12 volt TV when I'm running an 15.5 volt Equalization on my house batteries. I keep a ciggy plug socket on it.
 

wrcsixeight

Adventurer
I don't know if traditional battery load testers can test such small a/h batteries.

You could do your own version of a test by fully charging it, and see how long it can produce a known current before it drops to 10.5 volts and do some math.

You could see if it can indeed jump start a vehicle that needs it.

But it can be safely said that if it has not been fully charged monthy for it's whole life, and is more than a few years old, the remaining capacity has been greatly reduced.

It is surprisingly easy to change out the batteries inside these. Take the old one out, and google the part numbers and order one.
 

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