U1300L doka as an expedition vehicle

[gbreden]

I am in the (very!) early stages of planning a long (one year) trip through Africa (basically London to Cape Town) via The Black Sea.

I have settled on the most lovely Unimog and it needing to be a doka. The main reason is that I have two sons and having them in the cab is just a safer option (read between the lines...where I can control the chaos...)

The question I am homing in on is the Unimog Type. I am sorta settled on the U1300L. Specifically the late 80's model that were made with the stronger engine (i.e. being able to travel at 100pkh / 55mph) and fast axels.

The main reasons for the U1300L has been:
[*] This seems to be a very popular choice
[*]The Vehicle driver’s license required is lower. Basically if I can keep it below 7500kg's I would be ok
[*]The taxes and duties to move with a motorhome / camper van (i.e. below 7500kg's) is much less than over 7500kg's which would classify it as a truck which will attract higher charges and duties.

The question:
[*]Will I be able to build a box on a U1300L doka that remains below 7500kg's once it has been fully loaded?
[*]Is there really a difference in taxes and duties between the below 7500kg's and above 7500kgs vehicle when travelling across countries. Other costs?

I am more than willing and able to get the required heavy goods license (HGV) if required.

However cost (i.e. duties and fees) and safety (i.e. is the 7500kg limit realistic) are my main two concerns.

I would very much like to hear your advice and experience in this matter.

Kind regards

Gerard

 

[mogcamper]

Hi
My 1300L is not a DOKA but with a large camper on the back I am at 5000kg without any fluids, personal possessions, food, recovery gear, spares etc. Hope that helps.

 

[Victorian]

Hi,

I'm not familiar with the taxation in the UK. But building a U1300 at 7.5 tons should be doable! Worst case would be that you would have to "cheat" a bit :ylsmoke: Before you get the truck inspected, remove all deep cycle batteries from the back, make sure your water tanks, fuel tanks are empty, maybe even remove some of the cabinetry.... That should reduce the overall weight by a lot! It has been done before..... :sombrero:

Another weight safer could be by using smaller tires. Also saves you some cash in the long run!
Have a look at the attached pic.

Good luck!
Andreas

 

[gbreden]

7500kgs

Hi

Thx - yes I was also not worried about the registration ;-) I have to much Dutch blood in me:victory: I was worried if I get stopped at a weigh bridge ro the other point which is safty.

I assume it alos depends on which material you use for the box.

Kind regards

Gerard

 

[Victorian]

Hi

Thx - yes I was also not worried about the registration ;-) I have to much Dutch blood in me:victory: I was worried if I get stopped at a weigh bridge ro the other point which is safty.

I assume it alos depends on which material you use for the box.

Kind regards

Gerard

Oh, well that sucks! I didn't know that campers would get checked at weight stations.... Not the case in North America or Germany...

 

[Allroader]

Hello,

Any car can be put on the weight station, if the police belive it is overloaded. In Germany you state that you are not overloaded, if they still but you on the scale and then you don't have to pay the scale (police has to). If you are overloaded, then you have pay the scale (Ticket?) and unpack until your are in the limit. So dropping your freshwater is a easy task.

A Unimog with a 3,20m wheelbase and a Doka, will leave you very little room for a Camper. So should be searching for a long wheelbase (3850mm), but then also have the heavy duty Axels (which will add weight). I do believe you can still beet the 7,5t limit, but now getting very close.

We also looked at the Unimog, I was very close to buying mine. But then talked to several unimog Owners and decieded that it is to much for us. Their are many things that can break (and cost a ton).
Since we are also on the road with 2 Kids we went a MB 917 AF. Has a large cabin, what puts our kids in the cab with us. As a for the offroad, the Unimog will be better, but how far and how extreme will go with Kids on board.
Now we have to change our base, but only because of the importing rules to the USA, since we are moving to the USA fulltime.
If you have some questions feel free to ask.

Take a look on This Site to get some more Ideas what is possible.

 

[haven]

Have you read Stephen Stewart's account of building his 1300L for expedition use? It's here http://www.unimog.org.uk/mymog/ Stephen drove his Mog across central Asia and China, and in South America for several months.

Also read the story of the 1300L conversion done by Darrin Fink http://www.ki7xh.com/camper.htm

Neither project is doka, but there are plenty of good ideas and advice here.

Speaking of advice, read Stephen Stewart's essay, "Which Van?" on the pages of the Silk Road Motorcaravan Club's web site. http://www.xor.org.uk/silkroute/index.html

Among Stephen's many words of wisdom is the following: "In my opinion, the extra cost of a 4x4 version of an on-road truck is worthwhile, but the extra cost of a true 'off-road' truck is not."

In other words, the Unimog's portal axles, 40 inch tall tires and impeccable departure angle are not necessary for typical overland travel situations in 2011. Better to use the money saved to travel longer, or more frequently.

 

[Iain_U1250]

Have you read Stephen Stewart's account of building his 1300L for expedition use? It's here http://www.unimog.org.uk/mymog/ Stephen drove his Mog across central Asia and China, and in South America for several months.

Also read the story of the 1300L conversion done by Darrin Fink http://www.ki7xh.com/camper.htm

Neither project is doka, but there are plenty of good ideas and advice here.

Speaking of advice, read Stephen Stewart's essay, "Which Van?" on the pages of the Silk Road Motorcaravan Club's web site. http://www.xor.org.uk/silkroute/index.html

Among Stephen's many words of wisdom is the following: "In my opinion, the extra cost of a 4x4 version of an on-road truck is worthwhile, but the extra cost of a true 'off-road' truck is not."

In other words, the Unimog's portal axles, 40 inch tall tires and impeccable departure angle are not necessary for typical overland travel situations in 2011. Better to use the money saved to travel longer, or more frequently.

Whilst I agree with much of what Stephen says in his essay, the 10% of the the time when you need the Unimog's off-road ability will more than make up for the possible savings associated with a lesser vehicle. When I was working in Africa, all we had was a 2 wheel drive car - you seldom see 4x4's as they cost a lot more to buy and run. However, if you get a lesser vehicle, and it either breaks or get stuck, the cost be really high. Most of the game viewing vehicles were two wheel drive Toyota or Nissan mini buses when we where in Kenya / Malawi / Tanzania.

The OP's plan was a Trans Africa trip - and you could do that with a 2CV if you want to as long as you stick to the major roads. If you want to take a few side roads, then something a bit better is required. If your aim is a truck than can occasionally be used on a rough dirt road, then a Fuso or similar is all you need. However, if you want head off into desert areas, then the extra ground clearance and bigger tyres are very useful. The other good thing about a Unimog is that it is designed to hand rough roads all day long - you don't here of a Unimog chassis or drive train breaking that often, but there are plenty of reports of MAN / Fuso etc chassis breaking, shock supports cracking and springs snapping. I've been following two trips of fellow travellers one across Africa and the other across Asia and both have had major problems with their vehicles and both vehicles were both new for the trip. Diff problems, brake failures, suspension support breaking, springs snapping off, shock towers breaking, and chassis cracking. All within 20,000km of new.

A Unimog is not unbreakable, there are a few known problems, major one being the portal axle bearings - there is a problem with the oil being pumped out of the breather at high speed resulting in the portal running hot leading to excessive wear on the bearing. If the wear, then you need to replace them because if you don't you will more than likely have a catastrophic failure of a portal box when a ball bearing jams between the portal gears and shatters the whole portal box. There are simple fixes for the breather problem and 80-100,000km seems to be the known limits on the bearings from what I can tell - and a new set of bearings and seals ( 4 bearings in each corner) is not cheap - $400 per set.

 

[haven]

It's true that there are places in Africa where a true "off-road" vehicle is an advantage. We don't yet know what the OP's chosen route or interests are.

I suppose it's a moot point, since the OP has decided to use a Unimog.

 

[mhiscox]

A Unimog is not unbreakable, there are a few known problems, major one being the portal axle bearings - there is a problem with the oil being pumped out of the breather at high speed resulting in the portal running hot leading to excessive wear on the bearing. If the wear, then you need to replace them because if you don't you will more than likely have a catastrophic failure of a portal box when a ball bearing jams between the portal gears and shatters the whole portal box. There are simple fixes for the breather problem and 80-100,000km seems to be the known limits on the bearings from what I can tell - and a new set of bearings and seals ( 4 bearings in each corner) is not cheap - $400 per set.

When I was a Mog owner, it seemed to me that the most common failures I'd hear of among people who actually drove their Mog's long distance were related to the portals. One of the Moggers who accomplished the most trips, Bill Caid, had six portal-related failures on his expeditions, and he was quite a capable mechanic. So over the years, I gained a good appreciation for the decision the engineers of the Netherlands Train Authority who spec'd my 416 camper made to use a 6.5 ton NAF truck axle in lieu of the rear portals. People would look at the fact that my ground clearance had been cut from something like 18 inches down to (still-better-than-a-Wrangler) 10.5 inches at the pumpkin and think that was sad, but in reality, I never needed more ground clearance and I really appreciated the trouble-free, near maintenance-free load carrying ability.

 

[charlieaarons]

80-100,000km seems to be the known limits on the bearings from what I can tell - and a new set of bearings and seals ( 4 bearings in each corner) is not cheap - $400 per set.

I hope that's not true for the U500. Mine has 71000 km so far, I change the portal and diff oil every 6-800hrs, it comes out clean with a tiny bit of "dust" on the magnetic drain plug. The U500/5000 do not have the oil-pumping-out-through-the-breather issue, and take roughly double the oil capacity of the U1300 portal.
I do carry one spare set of portal bearings.
My portal temps are ~135F. even in 90-100F. ambient.

Charlie

 

[grizzlyj]

Hi

Bearing in mind a Mogs intended use seems to have been (apart from a few recent N. American ones) 55mph max to get to a place of work, I wonder how many of Bill Caids failures have been more due to (I think he has?) an overdrive, and bigger tyres than a 3 piece axle might like, to achieve continued high speed use??

Jason

 

[Iain_U1250]

Based on what I have read - Bill's problems seem typical of high mileage , high speed usage. However I agree that his XM47's and now the 395/85-20's may have an influence on the bearings lifespan. Those tyres weigh a lot more than the "standard" 12.5 R 20's - My MPT81 - 365/80-20's with a "super" wheel weigh in at 85kg's, my 425-70 R20 XM47's tyres by themselves weigh 85kg's and a friends 395-85/20's Michelin's weighed in at 135kg for wheels and tyres. He also has a set of 14.00R20's on split rims that are even heavier.

Charlie's maintenance procedures are what is needed to keep things running and to determine problems before the break down. I will have temperature sensors on my portals - so I can check what they are doing and will probably get the oil analysed on a regular basis on my trips around Australia - cheap insurance I think.