Vw Vanagon to Westy?
- Thread starter BIGdaddy
- Start date
SWbySWesty
Fauxverland Extraodinaire
Craigslist has westy cabinets and stuff on there right now in LA section...~$300! *haven't read your whole thread yet.
I like your thoughts, and I, too, looked into doing the conversion myself...even went to look at a few Sprinter trucks. I decided I didn't want the hightop for practical purposes. I also don't daily drive the van. My specification was to be able to fit easily into a container/parking structure/low hanging trees!
Also, since it isn't the daily driver, I also knew I didn't have a ton of TIME to spend on it so it would take FOREVER to do the conversion. So far, with proper maintenance, it hasn't had a hiccup.
Here is a guy that contacted me when I had your debate - he was very much in favor of the hightop; however, the deal came up for my 86 and I jumped at it...too good of a price.
--------------------
I'm not advocating for any of the vans below - I'm only using
the ads to illustrate a point. If you look at hte first two, they are for
vans,not campers. One is a stock van, good shape etc, the other is in
really nice shape and has a suby conversion engne in it. The 4K price
differentiol between them is reflective of the value (at least) of the
suby engine. More on engine transplants later.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1026016
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1025918
If you compare the prices of the vans above with the westys below, you'll
see a marked difference. Yet none of the westys have had a replacement
engine in them. When you have a westy, I find, that you have alot of
wasted space - it sounds romantic to have everything on board, stove,
sink, water supply etc - yet the reality is that the stove, sink and water
supply is rarely, if ever used. The space they take up is wasted. Given
this then, what is the advantage of the westy - well - you can pop the top
and sleep up there - great, but where have the sleeping bags, pillows etc
to sleep up there been all the time while travelling? In the main area of
the westy - probably behind the rear seat. Add clothes bags and other
"stuff" and perhaps the bedding for the lower bed as well and you have a
pretty full westy while you are travelling and on the road and you're
always stepping on or over stuff as you move about the van.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1025322
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1016866
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1027517
So what's the answer? Folks in Europe discovered it long ago - there were
more hightop conversion vans sold there than westys throughout the vw
vanagon production run. Very few were made available to be sold here, and
only one conversion company, Adventurewagon, did hightops in North
America.
For long distance travelling, the high top is just far better. All of the
"stuff" goes up top, out of the way, leaving the main cabin clutter free
for travelling.
The math of it goes this way - if you were to pick up the red suby van
above for 8K, then add a hightop for 2.5K, you'd still be below the price
of the westy's above and you would have a vehicle with a good reliable
engine (the original wbx engine is a POS), and the space to travel in
comfort. Gas mileage would be better than with any of the westys as well.
You could then finish off the interior of the top and set up the entire
vehicle the way you would want it to be for your travels without having to
live with or work around the wasted space inherent in the westy interior.
The following fuel consumption figures are pretty well what folks are
experiencing.
Van or westy with waterboxer engine(wbx) 16-18mpg
Van or westy with subaru 2.2 or 2,5 20 - 22 mpg
van or westy with Vw diesel TD or TDI engine 30+ mpg.
I don't know how comfortable you are with working on a vehicle yourself -
perhaps if you could tell me, it could open up a whole new direction.
As I said. I'm not advocating any of the vans above - just using them as
examples. Personally, were I beginning to assemble a vehicle for the trip
you outlined, I would start looking for a late model (88-91) van with a
standard transmission and a clapped out or inoperable engine. If
everything else was good on it - no rust etc - it would probably cost less
than 2K. I would then put a diesel engine into it, either TD or TDI
depending on what I could find in terms of a good engine at the time -
cost would be somewhere 4 - 6K doing the work myself. Replace the original
4 speed tranny with a 5 speed, regeared to better suit the diesel 2.5k
Then I would add the hightop 2.5k and do a custom interior 1K. Total 12 -
14k . The van would then have a market value of well in excess of 20k -
and would have that value even after your trip.
Hope that this has been helpful. I have a westy, its a love hate
relationship. i love the 2.5 suby engine and the way it drives - but -
there are 4 of us on trips - imagine the "stuff" in the main cabin when
we're driving.
The AW's were great - the tops are relatively heavy though. The problem
with them as vehicles is that you're going to pay a premium for the AW
hightop van and still have an older van with an older wbx in it. The math
still favours getting a good later model van and putting a top on it.
There is nothing special about the AW interior - you propbably still will
not use the sink, stove and water supply. Fridges are great in any camper
- more on this if you like.
as I told you, I sell the hightops http://canadianhightops.ca
I have a distributor/installer in Flagstaff Arizona. Because of the size
of the tops - they don't weigh all that much, but they are bulky, they
pretty well have to be delivered to regional distributors or else the
delivery fees for them are ridiculous. So - the distributor/installer for
the South West is Andrew Libby in Flagstaff Arizona. Actually I wa there
working with him on installs the last week of August. One of the installs
was for a guy who drove down from SF to have it done. Its a bit of a drive
from LA but not too bad. In any case he has one top there now. Other than
that one, the next tops available will be either from me in Toronto, or
as part of a regional shipment of tops to our PNW distributor/installer in
Portland Oregon.
Which Engel fridge do you have? I replaced the POS DOmetic in my westy
with a good truckfridge - really great, but I'm looking at the Engels and
derivatives for my '88 diesel conversion that i'm doing a custom interior
for.
Let me know your thinking on all of this.
BTW - I had almost this exact conversation with the guy who drove down
from SF to get a top - he also bought a van, later model in good cond. and
had us put a top on it. He is actually living out of the van now in SF
saving on rent - I think he plans on packing his job in in a couple of
months and doing the big tour as well. - go figure!!
John
-----------------------
I just noticed that this is the canadian hightop guy. So he knows what's up.
I like your thoughts, and I, too, looked into doing the conversion myself...even went to look at a few Sprinter trucks. I decided I didn't want the hightop for practical purposes. I also don't daily drive the van. My specification was to be able to fit easily into a container/parking structure/low hanging trees!
Also, since it isn't the daily driver, I also knew I didn't have a ton of TIME to spend on it so it would take FOREVER to do the conversion. So far, with proper maintenance, it hasn't had a hiccup.
Here is a guy that contacted me when I had your debate - he was very much in favor of the hightop; however, the deal came up for my 86 and I jumped at it...too good of a price.
--------------------
I'm not advocating for any of the vans below - I'm only using
the ads to illustrate a point. If you look at hte first two, they are for
vans,not campers. One is a stock van, good shape etc, the other is in
really nice shape and has a suby conversion engne in it. The 4K price
differentiol between them is reflective of the value (at least) of the
suby engine. More on engine transplants later.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1026016
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1025918
If you compare the prices of the vans above with the westys below, you'll
see a marked difference. Yet none of the westys have had a replacement
engine in them. When you have a westy, I find, that you have alot of
wasted space - it sounds romantic to have everything on board, stove,
sink, water supply etc - yet the reality is that the stove, sink and water
supply is rarely, if ever used. The space they take up is wasted. Given
this then, what is the advantage of the westy - well - you can pop the top
and sleep up there - great, but where have the sleeping bags, pillows etc
to sleep up there been all the time while travelling? In the main area of
the westy - probably behind the rear seat. Add clothes bags and other
"stuff" and perhaps the bedding for the lower bed as well and you have a
pretty full westy while you are travelling and on the road and you're
always stepping on or over stuff as you move about the van.
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1025322
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1016866
http://www.thesamba.com/vw/classifieds/detail.php?id=1027517
So what's the answer? Folks in Europe discovered it long ago - there were
more hightop conversion vans sold there than westys throughout the vw
vanagon production run. Very few were made available to be sold here, and
only one conversion company, Adventurewagon, did hightops in North
America.
For long distance travelling, the high top is just far better. All of the
"stuff" goes up top, out of the way, leaving the main cabin clutter free
for travelling.
The math of it goes this way - if you were to pick up the red suby van
above for 8K, then add a hightop for 2.5K, you'd still be below the price
of the westy's above and you would have a vehicle with a good reliable
engine (the original wbx engine is a POS), and the space to travel in
comfort. Gas mileage would be better than with any of the westys as well.
You could then finish off the interior of the top and set up the entire
vehicle the way you would want it to be for your travels without having to
live with or work around the wasted space inherent in the westy interior.
The following fuel consumption figures are pretty well what folks are
experiencing.
Van or westy with waterboxer engine(wbx) 16-18mpg
Van or westy with subaru 2.2 or 2,5 20 - 22 mpg
van or westy with Vw diesel TD or TDI engine 30+ mpg.
I don't know how comfortable you are with working on a vehicle yourself -
perhaps if you could tell me, it could open up a whole new direction.
As I said. I'm not advocating any of the vans above - just using them as
examples. Personally, were I beginning to assemble a vehicle for the trip
you outlined, I would start looking for a late model (88-91) van with a
standard transmission and a clapped out or inoperable engine. If
everything else was good on it - no rust etc - it would probably cost less
than 2K. I would then put a diesel engine into it, either TD or TDI
depending on what I could find in terms of a good engine at the time -
cost would be somewhere 4 - 6K doing the work myself. Replace the original
4 speed tranny with a 5 speed, regeared to better suit the diesel 2.5k
Then I would add the hightop 2.5k and do a custom interior 1K. Total 12 -
14k . The van would then have a market value of well in excess of 20k -
and would have that value even after your trip.
Hope that this has been helpful. I have a westy, its a love hate
relationship. i love the 2.5 suby engine and the way it drives - but -
there are 4 of us on trips - imagine the "stuff" in the main cabin when
we're driving.
The AW's were great - the tops are relatively heavy though. The problem
with them as vehicles is that you're going to pay a premium for the AW
hightop van and still have an older van with an older wbx in it. The math
still favours getting a good later model van and putting a top on it.
There is nothing special about the AW interior - you propbably still will
not use the sink, stove and water supply. Fridges are great in any camper
- more on this if you like.
as I told you, I sell the hightops http://canadianhightops.ca
I have a distributor/installer in Flagstaff Arizona. Because of the size
of the tops - they don't weigh all that much, but they are bulky, they
pretty well have to be delivered to regional distributors or else the
delivery fees for them are ridiculous. So - the distributor/installer for
the South West is Andrew Libby in Flagstaff Arizona. Actually I wa there
working with him on installs the last week of August. One of the installs
was for a guy who drove down from SF to have it done. Its a bit of a drive
from LA but not too bad. In any case he has one top there now. Other than
that one, the next tops available will be either from me in Toronto, or
as part of a regional shipment of tops to our PNW distributor/installer in
Portland Oregon.
Which Engel fridge do you have? I replaced the POS DOmetic in my westy
with a good truckfridge - really great, but I'm looking at the Engels and
derivatives for my '88 diesel conversion that i'm doing a custom interior
for.
Let me know your thinking on all of this.
BTW - I had almost this exact conversation with the guy who drove down
from SF to get a top - he also bought a van, later model in good cond. and
had us put a top on it. He is actually living out of the van now in SF
saving on rent - I think he plans on packing his job in in a couple of
months and doing the big tour as well. - go figure!!
John
-----------------------
I just noticed that this is the canadian hightop guy. So he knows what's up.
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