Air Lockers or Factory Lockers, and M8000 winch questions

[KevinMLee]

Hey guys, so I couldn't figure out the difference between Air lockers and the factory lockers. What are the advantages? I've tried to search the forum but it didn't turn anything up for that. My '96 fj80 has factory lockers and since I'm dumping so much money into this build, I wanted to make sure I at least looked at everything. I was looking at the ARB Airlockers and I know I have factory lockers, so I was curious to the advantages of both and should I invest in the ARB lockers.

Also, I've been searching for a "how to" in installing a Warn M8000 winch onto an ARB to no real help for what I need. I've heard mention of taking the planatery cover off and "clocking" it from the 12 o'clock position to the 5 o'clock position (assuming that 6 o'clock is the down position in the direction of the mounting feet. those of you with M8000's, does that mean actually taking off the cover with the hex screwheads and literally moving it to the 5 o'clock position? Or what position is best that will allow me to access the clutch easily? Also, is there anything I should watch out for as I'm doing this? Sorry if this sounds dumb but I wanted to make sure I'm getting this right, since the winch may save me one day.

Thanks Guys

My truck is a 1996 FJ80

 

[Mountainhound]

I wouldn't worry about switching lockers. Yours are electronic arb is compressed air. I have heard of a few factory lockers having issues, but until you do I wouldn't spend 3 grand on arbs. Unless of course you have that money burning a hole in your pocket. If thats the case mine came without lockers:sombrero:

 

[Ramjet]

Also, I've been searching for a "how to" in installing a Warn M8000 winch onto an ARB to no real help for what I need. I've heard mention of taking the planatery cover off and "clocking" it from the 12 o'clock position to the 5 o'clock position (assuming that 6 o'clock is the down position in the direction of the mounting feet. those of you with M8000's, does that mean actually taking off the cover with the hex screwheads and literally moving it to the 5 o'clock position? Or what position is best that will allow me to access the clutch easily? Also, is there anything I should watch out for as I'm doing this? Sorry if this sounds dumb but I wanted to make sure I'm getting this right, since the winch may save me one day.

Thanks Guys

My truck is a 1996 FJ80

You are correct. You will have to take the cover off, the ones with the hex screws, and rotate it. It's really not that hard. Also note, that if you are using the the steel,fair lead, you will have drill new holes to mount it to the bumper. Hope this helps.

 

[Jonathan Hanson]

Kevin, definitely don't even think about changing lockers. Spend your money elsewhere - like on fuel to go somewhere!

 

[1911]

The factory electric lockers are quite good and I would not replace them with air lockers if they are working for you now. The only disadvantage to factory electric lockers (IMO) is that they don't always engage or disengage instantly, sometimes you have to roll a few feet before either happens. And one advantage they have over air lockers is that you don't need a compressor or air source to run electric lockers.

Air lockers on the other hand usually engage and disengage almost instantly, but they require a compressor (or a compressed air source) and air lines from the diff.

Either are fully-selectable and much better than any full-time locker or limited-slip diff, again IMO.

 

[krazytoy]

If you were to switch to ARB's you would have to change the rear axle shafts as well. The stock shaft necks down and is a weak point in the shaft. The ARB is defiently a stronger unit and the axle design that does not neck down is definetly stronger. Unless your running a tire 37" or bigger the factory e-locker and axle shaft will be very reliable and you will have to try very hard to break them. I personally would not change the e-locker's out unless I was doing some serious rock crawling with 37's or bigger tire.

 

[long dong silver]

I like my ARBs, but if I had elockers I'd spend the money on a bigger winch.

 

[Driver-Navigator]

I agree with the others about sticking with the factory lockers, assuming that they're working as they should.

I had to Google a bunch before I found decent instructions for mounting my Warn winch into my ARB front bumper. ARB's site and instructions were not especially helpful, and I ended up picking up info from several threads here and on 'mud. That's how I learned about clocking the winch, that it had to be mounted feet-forward, and that I'd likely need the ARB spacer kit.

I had originally planned to use my Warn x8000i winch but given the weight of the 80-series I opted to go with a Warn VR12000 instead. YMMV.

 

[86tuning]

Air lockers would be better if you were rockcrawling with large tires. However, they do come with their own set of headaches. Like where you're going to mount your air source. And plumbing. And eventual failure of the actuator seals...

If you're not rock crawling on big tires, then factory e-lockers will work fine. If you were doing that, you'd want a higher clearance rock crawling bumper too. And bigger tires.

+1 on a bigger winch if you've got the money. That said, I've got an M8000 and it works fine.

Also consider a synthetic winch line.

 

[KevinMLee]

I had to Google a bunch before I found decent instructions for mounting my Warn winch into my ARB front bumper. ARB's site and instructions were not especially helpful, and I ended up picking up info from several threads here and on 'mud. That's how I learned about clocking the winch, that it had to be mounted feet-forward, and that I'd likely need the ARB spacer kit.

Hmmm... Maybe I'll do a write up as I'm installing this ARB and M8000 Combo.

THANKS to everyone that responded! It definitely solidified what I initially thought about the ARB Airlockers but wasn't completely sure until you each said something. I'm not planning any intentional rock crawling with this truck in the future, but may have to get around a few large rocks if need to. I believe the E-Lockers will work out nicely enough.

I've heard about the M8000 being a bit under, considering the "Rule-of-Thumb" 1.5x the weight of the rig. However, I've heard many mixed reviews from both industry leaders and other overlanders about an M8000 vs XD9000. Some say that you won't be pulling dead weight most of the time and the truck does roll, plus you can snatch block it to multiply the force depending on the angle of the wire and block (done a little research but it is pure high school physics). I went with the M8000 primarily because it is highly serviceable, and seems to be a solid piece of kit, even if it isn't a super power house.

 

[KevinMLee]

Also consider a synthetic winch line.

Yeah I've heard of the synthetic winch line, what are the advantages and disadvantages? How do I know when to replace it? I'm good with a wrench and a soldier gun, but learning the winch stuff isn't my knowledge yet... I'm planning to hit Overland Expo 2013 and specifically taking any winch and recovery classes.

You are correct. You will have to take the cover off, the ones with the hex screws, and rotate it. It's really not that hard. Also note, that if you are using the the steel,fair lead, you will have drill new holes to mount it to the bumper. Hope this helps.

Thanks! I was a gunsmith once, and just taking off coverings without a bit of understanding whats UNDER the coverings could be dire.

I wouldn't worry about switching lockers. Yours are electronic arb is compressed air. I have heard of a few factory lockers having issues, but until you do I wouldn't spend 3 grand on arbs. Unless of course you have that money burning a hole in your pocket. If thats the case mine came without lockers:sombrero:

:Wow1:$3k? yuuuup! looking at other things to do... like drive the country with $3k

 

[Mountainhound]

Benifits of synthetic line, lighter no getting jabbed by frayed wire more flexable. Cost a little more but definitly worth the extra price in my opinion.

 

[86tuning]

take the winching course first, then swap the line if you want to.

A syn rope is about $200 + aluminum hawse fairlead. The advantages are that you won't get wire rope burrs, so you can handle the syn rope with bare hands. It's lighter (1/7 the weight of steel) and floats. Doesn't get coily so that a 6 year old child can run the winch line up hill for you. It's about 30% stronger that steel wire. 5/16" steel rope has a break stregth of about 9-10,000 lbs. The same size syn rope has a 13,000 lbs break strength.

A syn rope that breaks the anchor off a truck won't slingshot the broken piece back thru your windshield and kill you like a wire rope can. Also, if the syn rope itself breaks, it will tend to fall to the ground and not whip back at both anchors with terrific and lethal force.

Disadvantage is that you can cut it with a knife. Abrasion resistance is lower than steel wire rope. It costs more.

 

[KevinMLee]

Benifits of synthetic line, lighter no getting jabbed by frayed wire more flexable. Cost a little more but definitly worth the extra price in my opinion.

take the winching course first, then swap the line if you want to.

Doesn't get coily so that a 6 year old child can run the winch line up hill for you.

I gotcha. But definitely to the +1 about getting the 6-year old to run the rope up the hill

Having a stronger breaking strength is a +1 in my book. I was a rock climbing instructor so I understand being a little more aware of synthetic ropes frailties. I think I may upgrade my wire to syn. after I take the course. I'll feel more confident in exactly what I want.

So a synthetic rope requires a Hawse fairlead? I can't get by with using roller fairleads and a syn rope?

 

[KevinMLee]

Okay, so this may also sound a bit dumb, which side does the clutch handle/planatery cover go on when looking at the vehicle from the front? Does the clutch go on the right side/driver side?

Thanks so much guys! Again, I want to make sure I'm getting this right and that the majority of the Collective approves.