Electric expedition vehicle

[motas]

So given the increase in electric vehicles I thought this may be an interesting discussion on the potential advantages and disadvantages of having an electric expedition vehicle. At the moment it probably isn't practical but I'm sure it will be in the near future.
Any thoughts?

 

[Haf-E]

Are we talking a pure electric vehicle or including hybrids in the discussion?

I think there is great potential for hybrids in the expo world...

 

[AFBronco235]

I agree, a hybrid vehicle would be a more likely solution than a purely electric vehicle. Maybe have the drive be entirely electric with a ICM (Internal Combustion Motor) purely as a generator for the battery bank. The downside would be weight I think, with current battery technology. I hear newer LI batteries are lighter.

The upside would be the electric motor has higher low end torque and a longer RPM band for some SUPER low gearing. Yes, I DO assume a geared transmission will be used.

 

[jeep-N-montero]

In order for it to be light enough you would have to run LI batteries that in turn will make it very cost-prohibitive.

 

[LocoCoyote]

Didn't Land Rover do something along these lines? I seem to remember some kind of extensive test drive or something....have to do some Googleing later

 

[AFBronco235]

In order for it to be light enough you would have to run LI batteries that in turn will make it very cost-prohibitive.

Lets leave cost out of it for now and just focus on what an electric expo vehicle would need. Just about any new tech is going to be cost prohibitive until its not. Honestly, right now, the only tech that's preventing electric cars from becoming more common is battery or electrical generation tech. Everything else already exists and at reasonable costs.

Lets see, it would need to be capable of several hundred miles on a charge (including an on board generator or APU so we can still carry fuel cans), a sturdy tube based exoskeleton frame to hold down weight and support the battery banks, a high torque, low rpm motor with selectable gear box (think 3 or 4 speed but with paddle shifters since its going to be fancy new) 4wd (if you want 2wd, buy a prius or smart car), dynamic braking with hydro-boost brakes, maybe a cooling system for the electric motor to ensure it runs at top efficiency even in high temps. (I'm just free writing at this point, so feel free to contradict or correct me and argue any point you want.)

 

[boxcar1]

I see no advantage to the electric expedition vehicle be it hybrid or not . It will still be a gross polluter.
At some point some one has to figure out how to safely dispose of the dead batteries.
And one that is more susceptible to failure in the field.
Picture an electric fording a river repeatedly. Or running in deep snow for a couple of hundred miles.
Complex , software dependent vehicles are generally a bad idea in the off road community.
If you can't fix a failure 100 miles out with basic hand tools and no internet then don't build or buy it......
The tech isn't there yet , and may never be.

 

[donaldj]

The tech isn't there yet , and may never be.

When it is there, we'll likely have hoverable vehicles anyways. True 'over' landing. =)

 

[billiebob]

This is now on the market.



I look at this and think of all the parts you can disgard.

Engine, transmission, driveline.
Gastank, radiator, exhaust, cats, heat shields.
If want 4WD lose the transfer case, add a second motor.
Traction control, lockers are often electronic which this entire powertrain would be.

You need to add batteries or hydrogen and a heat pump for AC, heat, defrost.
In an overlander/RV everything can now be electric. no need for propane or white gas unless you want it.
You will have room for MASSIVE batteries or hydrogen given all the space now empty plus all the weight you discarded.

Its not here yet but how long before you can recharge off grid. Beyond solar, shock absorbers could be electric, fully adjustable while driving, you will be looking for washboard to generate MORE electricity. Thinking how far ICEs have progressed over the past 40 years, think where battery tech, charging, might be in 20 years. How hard would it be to add a powered axle to your trailer... So many opportunities once we commit to getting rid of infernal combustion engines.....

Never need an oil change lol.

Regarding the myth that stuck in a snow storm yer car will die with nowhere to recharge.... that is a myth and the Toronto storm last week proved it.
Fact, a heat pump while parked is infinitely more efficient that an idling infernal combustion engine. Fact the nurse in her pure electric car sat in the line up for 6 hours and had lots of power ince the traffic started moving. Fact people were delivering gasoline to the ICS cars out of gas. And the biggest problem for people in that gridlock was over powering exhaust fumes from everyone idling on that cold day.

Heat is energy, you idle a gas engine most of the heat is lost thru the radiator. The heater core is tiny by comparison. Then theres the exhaust. Slide under that idling car and grip the catalytic converter. With an electric car there is no lost energy, it all heats the cab with a heat pump and defrosts the windshield with electric resistance..... just like those heated mirrors and seats in every SUV out there.

There are way more plusses to converting to electric power than any of the mythical negatives. We just need to work on better batteries and charging.

 

[rruff]

In order for it to be light enough you would have to run LI batteries that in turn will make it very cost-prohibitive.

These things (XBUS) are going on sale in Europe this year for ~$25-$35k. It's a very light (1,300+ lbs empty) low-powered (20hp continuous, 75hp peak) modular electric vehicle. Max 124 mi range on 10 kw-hr of batteries, 370 miles on 30 kw-hr. You can buy 10 kw-hr of LiFePO4 batteries retail now for < $2,000, and weigh ~200 lbs. I don't see battery cost being an issue.

The EU has a special class of vehicle that is exempt from typical safety testing and certification. These vehicles are at the upper limit of power and weight to still get that classification. Ya, it's slow and crude, but it's also efficient. And with 4 independent hub motors it should get around well offroad.

BTW... the payload for the 10kw-hr version is over 2,000 lbs!

ElectricBrands | XBUS | Home

XBUS. A modular concept. Two chassis variants. An infinite number of possible uses thanks to different modules.

electricbrands.de

 

[rruff]

We just need to work on better batteries and charging.

Or work on lighter and lower powered vehicles. The Rivian will typically be hauling a < 200 lb payload. Do we really need a 7,000 lb, 800hp midsized pickup for this?

I would not expect any huge strides in battery tech. Small increments for awhile, sure... but... they've already come a long way. And just because it would be nice doesn't mean it's possible.

Lightweight full electric city vehicles and plug-in hybrids are the applications that makes sense now. 4WD where the rear axle is electrically driven only and the front is engine driven, seems like a good application for hybrid.