Just for the halibut....

[Zaphod]

Just for the sake of discussion...

My beloved Trooper is coming up on 81K miles, and while it has hardly given me a headache, I can't help but wonder what I'll do if/when the engine and/or tranny decide to go to that great big junkyard in the sky.

So, what realistic options exist for swapping out engines and transmissions for a 2000 Trooper LS? Can it be done in a home garage? What do you think it would cost? WOULD DIESEL BE A SERIOUS CONSIDERATION?

Yada, yada. Let it all hang out.

 

[bigreen505]

This was discussed on PlanetIsuzoo and the message I got from people actually doing it is that replacing the engine with another 3.5 is no big deal as long as you have the tools, a small warehouse, a forklift, a couple people and another daily driver. If that is not the case then $4,000 +/- will suffice. I have no idea about the transmission and I don't plan to either.

As for other options, there is a 3.0 TDI available, but the message I got, admittedly from people who wanted to sell me a 3.5, is that you have to want a diesel motor regardless of the cost because the credit and debit columns will never balance. If your engine, transmission and ECU commit mass suicide that may be a different story. Some preliminary hunting suggested that the engines are hard to source in the US, but I didn't try real hard either, it was more just a curiosity.

 

[Zaphod]

ECU?

One site that addresses the engine-swap issue...

Sadly, the link to the Aurora engine is broken...

 

[bigreen505]

Thanks, that looks cool. I saw that a while ago, but long since forgot about it.

As far as I know if you go the diesel route you have to swap the engine computer (ECU) with one from a diesel. Probably better off going with the Aurora swap.

 

[Zaphod]

I only brought up the deisel because some folks seem to get all hot and heavy over the idea. I'd be satisfied with the Aurora.

 

[bigreen505]

There are a lot of great reasons to go for diesel over gas, especially on a new vehicle, but if you are doing a retrofit you have to make sure you are in it because you want a diesel above all reason.

I did the math in another thread based on Graham's 110, which gets exceptional mileage, and it came out to about $7,000 - $10,000 in fuel savings (at the cost of limited highway hp) over something that gets about 15-17 mpg. Considering that you are doing the swap in a truck with close to 100,000 miles it may not make sense. On the other hand, if you are looking at $4,000 for a new engine, and a diesel is only a few thousand more, that might be a different story.

 

[bootzilla]

Sometimes you can get a whole front clip from one of the car importers - I have seen them from time to time, although I admittedly haven't done a lot of looking.

I remembered seeing a couple of clips that, if I remember correctly, were under 2k - which got you the engine, tranny, ecu, wiring harness - everything from the dashboard forward. I have no clue how much freight would be from Japan to the US, though - then there is the whole emissions issue....

The beauty of the 4L30 transmission is the compatibility with GM motors - a Northstar or an Aurora V-8 would be far easier to find, and a pushrod Caddy V-8 or GM V-6 would be downright cheap from a junkyard - plus parts availability would be way better (as well as performance parts!)

 

[datrupr]

The problem with the Aurora or Northstar engines in the Trooper is that they are not direct bolt in's. There will be some modifications needed, plus new electronics. However, the 4L30E will bolt up to it with (I think) no problems.

 

[bootzilla]

Yeah - didn't think about that - they will bolt right up to the 4L30, but you'd still have to fab motor mounts. Depending on how far apart the stock mounts are from the GM ones, it might not be that bad to come up with something, or have something fabbed up by a machine shop....I wonder how many people have done it to know how involved it is......sure would be nice to drop in a Northstar if the 3.5 ever goes south...

 

[datrupr]

I do know that the GM 4.3 & 4.6 motors are a direct drop in, but you still have to mess with the ECU & wiring, and I do believe there are bell housing issues with the 4L30E tranny, as these motors are usually hooked up to the 4L60E trannies in the GM trucks. And as you stated before Bill, the Isuzu 3.1 TDI would be the ideal solution, but again with it's own myriad of challenges, the least of being part sourcing in the long run. It will drop right in, but it will not mate at all to the 4L30E, so you would have to source the proper auto (or manual) tranny, new ECU, wiring, and a new hood to boot, as the intercooler for the turbo sits atop the motor and it draws its air from a scoop on the hood. It does look cool, and is way functional, and who wouldn't love to have this stout little diesel in their Trooper? I know I would. But, I have gotten used to the quirkieness of my 3.5, and I actually kinda like it. I have about 130K on it and still runs great, oil consumption is actually dropping a bit, and if you stay on top of it, I do not think it will fail in over 250K. And, it is a non interference engine, so if you did happen to pull a bone head move and forget to change, say the timing belt, and it breaks on you, it will not toast your entire engine. Just put a new one on and it will keep on going. The 3.5 does have it's idiosynchrecies, but do not let it scare you away. Know what they are, pay attention to them, and you will have a great failure free motor for many miles down the road.

I do hope I don't have to eat my words on that one.......knock on wood.

 

[Zaphod]

Well, I just spent 11 days in Dublin, Ireland, where it seems to be impossible to throw a cat and NOT hit a 2nd-Generation Isuzu Trooper.

The thing is..... ALL of them are DIESEL over there!

My biggest goals in ANY engine swap would be the following:

1) Improved gas mileage. I am being eaten alive right now. While I don't expect to ever reach the Hybrid-claim zone, something above 20 mpg would be a huge improvement.

2) Reliability vs. Cost. While the 3.5 seems to be reliable enough, I'd love to be able to more easily find parts for it, and for less money, than I do now. Also, I'd like to be free of this damned oil-burn problem.

3) Power. I fully recognize that this is a TRUCK and not a Porsche, but I sure would like to be able to see the thing accelerate a little faster on the road. Even mashing the gas pedal gets only moderate results.

Those are posted in no particular order, BTW. If I am smoking dope, please let me know.

Guys in Dublin had me ready to order an entire engine (including a manual tranny, which I don't know how to drive) from them and shipping it over here. I'd need a new DD before that, though.

 

[AZTrooper]

I've been getting a little curious about possible swaps too. I've looked into diesels and V8s... If I had the money and the time I'd drop a 3.1 diesel in mine. But seeing as how I don't have a money tree, I'm more tempted in looking for a V8 that will bolt up to the 4L30E. Yeah gas prices blow, but I'll sacrifice the few extra cents for the extra two pistons that will dominate off-road.

 

[Zaphod]

I wish I had the link, but I could swear that I read somewhere that the Aurora would actually get better mileage than the stock 3.5.

Is that even possible?

 

[AZTrooper]

Ok... I'm not familiar with the Aurora motor. Will you guys give me more details about that motor? Thanks!!

 

[datrupr]

The Aurora engine is basically a detuned Northstar, to put it in the simplest terms. It is a small but powerful V8 that is I think 4.3L in displacement. It will mate to the 4L30E tranny in the Trooper, but the motor is not a direct bolt in.