So you want to put King shocks on a Third Gen Montero...

[offthepath]

OME shocks are just re-branded Monroe shocks. I believe that both Biltstein and OME shocks are valved predominantly with high-way driving in mind. It is not very often that folks will intentionally drive +35mph over corrugated terrain.

@SONICMASD has what most people have considered to be the "perfect" combo.

I believe a great middle of the road shock that will perform a lot better than the Bilsteins in this scenario would be KONI RAID90s.

I have no idea who makes OME shocks, but the fact they have several different part numbers based on spring rate, shows they valve them differently.

You can't slap on a shock made for a stock spring rate with a much heavier spring and expect it to work, simple physics.

If you had kings set up for stock springs and ran them with heavier springs they would behave the exact same.

 

[SONICMASD]

I do wonder how a set of shocks with appropriate valving for the heavy springs would have compared. Bilsteins are valved for stock spring rates. From the video, you can see the heavy duty springs up front are blowing out the rebound on the shocks, which is what you'd expect.

If you don't want to spend a ton of money, I'm sure you'd see an improvement just moving to an ome shock that is valved for more rebound damping.

I'd love to see the same video vs an OME truck. Any takers! ?

I'm on the fence, it's a lot of money but does look sweet.

I had OME HD Coils with their Nitrocharger shocks on my 2003 Limited (you can see the Lawrence of Arabia build thread in the sticky) which was set up very similarly to my 2005 (same tires, yota wheels, arb bumper, 4.90s,etc.) and can say that the Lovells/Bilstein combo is definitely better. Not that OME was bad, definitely an improvement over stock. I almost never bottom out on this set up, even with the front of the truck bouncing all over in this video the Bilsteins never bottomed out until slamming on the brakes at the very end of the run. If you search the Victoria Pajero Forums, you'll find that at least 80% of the guys down there recommend the Lovells/Bilstein combo and many have run OME as well. While I think my front springs might be a little too oversprung still despite being near the top of the weight range they were designed for, I'm always impressed by how the Bilsteins soften the blow. We would have bottomed out sooooo many times if we tried that same track with my previous Gen3 on OME HD suspension.

Granted, I don't think either suspension is designed to drive that fast over terrain like this and we maybe should have just done the test on a regular dirt road with normal washboard. Corrugations on a dirt road are one thing, but this was a cinder field torn up by 4x4s crisscrossing in all directions creating big divots and speed bumps all over. Each bump is like 6" tall, then a 6" valley, not like a 1"-2" bump on a washboard road.

I actually have an extra set of brand new OME HD front coils that I might slap on Yoshi to see if the front comes down a little and softens up the ride but first I need to reach back out to Lovells with some questions and add the last pieces of weight to my front end to see what those changes do.

PS - Also, I think you guys are both right - I believe OME does valve their shocks differently from model to model for different spring rates...in the Monroe Australia factory.

 

[SONICMASD]

Oh PSS - I could also try moving the Bilstein Shocks to the higher spring perch which would I guess shorten the stroke but firm up the compression?

 

[ChrisCosta416]

Old Man Emu has 2-3 different valved struts/shocks.

It seems that Old Man Emu bases its valving on the stock weight of the truck (Petrol/Diesel) and their (ARB) accessories.

For example the HD Coils and medium duty struts are recommend to be paired with their ARB bumper.

A very interesting combo to see would be KONI RAID90 struts and shocks paired with King Aus Coils.

 

[wolfdog]

Any further updates mate, how are the shocks and arms performing?

jim

 

[Toasty]

Any further updates mate, how are the shocks and arms performing?

jim

My prediction is AMAZINGLY!

 

[wolfdog]

My prediction is AMAZINGLY!

I am sure your right.

jim

 

[wolfdog]

Jamie, If I could bug you once more regarding the king shock's.
I have been waiting for the right pajero to come up for sale and now it has I own one and I am now deciding on my suspension.
So could you elaborate further on the comfort level of the kings compared to stock.
I am old so the only thing that matter to me is a comfortable ride. But the beauty of the kings is I can re valve and tune to my liking as I have done a lot of shock tuning in the past but would rather just bolt something on now days .

Jim

 

[Toasty]

Jamie, If I could bug you once more regarding the king shock's.
I have been waiting for the right pajero to come up for sale and now it has I own one and I am now deciding on my suspension.
So could you elaborate further on the comfort level of the kings compared to stock.
I am old so the only thing that matter to me is a comfortable ride. But the beauty of the kings is I can re valve and tune to my liking as I have done a lot of shock tuning in the past but would rather just bolt something on now days .

Jim

Comfort level over stock is HUGE, comfort over everything else available for these trucks is so far above even the best over the counter stuff it makes them all seem the same by comparison. They're expensive but they're the last shocks you have to buy for the truck and when other Montero people ride with you (especially offroad) they'll always comment how nice it rides.

 

[wolfdog]

Thanks mate, I take it that is across the board over the complete range of uses including just the small bitumen bumps/chop?.
I am reasonably satisfied with the stock shocks besides on bitumen choppy stuff.

Jim

 

[sucksquishbangblow]

The cool thing Jamie and i discussed while he was here was the potential to do a subframe lift then essentially lower the suspension AND run a slightly longer shock. This would gain the a small amount of travel but more importantly allow you to utilize the full suspension arc vs a suspension lift since you're now riding center of the arc. Also less wear on CV's.

@Toasty - Any news on this? I know it's been a while since you guys talked about this. I'd love to see some more information in the Montero world re: subframe drops. They're too few and far between and having a solid place for information on them (including benefits/costs) would be helpful for a growing community of off-road enthusiasts who are getting into the Gen 3 platform.

 

[Toasty]

@Toasty - Any news on this? I know it's been a while since you guys talked about this. I'd love to see some more information in the Montero world re: subframe drops. They're too few and far between and having a solid place for information on them (including benefits/costs) would be helpful for a growing community of off-road enthusiasts who are getting into the Gen 3 platform.

I've made one complete and helped a few others with theirs, basically it's worth it if you're planning on wheeling and running 35" or larger but if you're just trailing and doing rough FR roads just stick to 33's. In general, 35's plus require crawler gears if you plan to 4 wheel which will run upwards of $2k installed so figure that on top of a potentially $2k lift depending on what parts you use and if you hire someone to do the work. Not terribly hard or expensive to Diy if you're handy so really if you can do most of the work yourself you'll save a heap.

 

[sucksquishbangblow]

I've made one complete and helped a few others with theirs, basically it's worth it if you're planning on wheeling and running 35" or larger but if you're just trailing and doing rough FR roads just stick to 33's. In general, 35's plus require crawler gears if you plan to 4 wheel which will run upwards of $2k installed so figure that on top of a potentially $2k lift depending on what parts you use and if you hire someone to do the work. Not terribly hard or expensive to Diy if you're handy so really if you can do most of the work yourself you'll save a heap.

Very cool information. What did you find in regard to longer shocks? Were the Kings the way to go, or were you thinking of taking a part that wasn't manufactured for the Montero that could give better travel? (Or is that even possible?)

My eventual goal is to likely do the crawler gears (I've already done the 4.90 and lockers) while running my current 33s and look into what goes into the subframe drop. I'm neither handy nor handsome, so I'll be working with my local shop to do the work. I plan on reaching out to you about your trailing arms when I'm at that point, but that's a fair distance away right now.

Appreciate you taking the time to come on over to Expo. I love seeing what you're up to on IG and I get a little fan-boy-ish when you like one of my photos on there.

 

[Toasty]

Very cool information. What did you find in regard to longer shocks? Were the Kings the way to go, or were you thinking of taking a part that wasn't manufactured for the Montero that could give better travel? (Or is that even possible?)

My eventual goal is to likely do the crawler gears (I've already done the 4.90 and lockers) while running my current 33s and look into what goes into the subframe drop. I'm neither handy nor handsome, so I'll be working with my local shop to do the work. I plan on reaching out to you about your trailing arms when I'm at that point, but that's a fair distance away right now.

Appreciate you taking the time to come on over to Expo. I love seeing what you're up to on IG and I get a little fan-boy-ish when you like one of my photos on there.

Extra suspension travel on the Gen 3 isn't in my opinion the best for dollar per capability points, extra travel is great and so are huge tires but the money is in gears and lockers. I'm working on a real long travel rear suspension for the Gen 3 in my head, My buddy has a truck to experiment on so that may be a thing I do in the future.

I used to very much have the attitude "Let's do the most of everything" but now that I'm getting older my thinking has turned to "Just the right amount" in terms of modifications. It's lead to some getting a little frustrated with me because they went and did something I recommended doing 5-10 years ago only to have me now say "Yeah, that thing. Don't do that."

I've learned a lot in the last few years especially, not to say I've got it all figured out but the results have been far better than ever. Monteros are older, less common and parts are kinda drying up. I still enjoy doing dumb stuff to cars but one thing I think about is "How can I make this more serviceable in the future?" I plan around that largely. Unfortunately for Gen 3 owners their trucks are running out of parts quicker than the others and that's going to be the challenge faced by those that are in for the long haul. What's common and available for these machines? What can I replace/retrofit with commonly available parts? This is basically my thought process on modifying Gen 3's at the moment, how can we make them better while making them last longer and be servicable?

 

[sucksquishbangblow]

Extra suspension travel on the Gen 3 isn't in my opinion the best for dollar per capability points, extra travel is great and so are huge tires but the money is in gears and lockers. I'm working on a real long travel rear suspension for the Gen 3 in my head, My buddy has a truck to experiment on so that may be a thing I do in the future.

That's good to know. I went full-on into 4.90 gears and lockers as one of my first moves and along with some 33" tires, it has been an amazing experience so far.

I've learned a lot in the last few years especially, not to say I've got it all figured out but the results have been far better than ever. Monteros are older, less common and parts are kinda drying up. I still enjoy doing dumb stuff to cars but one thing I think about is "How can I make this more serviceable in the future?" I plan around that largely.

I'd love to pick your brain about this part sometime. Maybe I'll shoot you a DM on IG so you aren't stuck answering dumb questions in public.

Unfortunately for Gen 3 owners their trucks are running out of parts quicker than the others and that's going to be the challenge faced by those that are in for the long haul. What's common and available for these machines? What can I replace/retrofit with commonly available parts? This is basically my thought process on modifying Gen 3's at the moment, how can we make them better while making them last longer and be servicable?

That's a great approach, and one that I've been curious about. I mainly rock crawl right now and take trails in ORV parks. Having the gears and lockers really helps out without having to bump everything and rely on the traction control. I worry about a lot of things like axles and such since I've heard so many horror stories of the off-the-shelf cheap ones failing very quickly and RCV not having any interest in making a truly rugged design for the Gen 3.