Solar / RV / Vehicle wiring. Solder and Crimp or just Crimp?

wb9wb

Member
I'm use to dealing with small electronics so I always solder, but I read someplace NEVER solder with dealing with RV Solar because the solder could melt, loosing and start a vehicle fire. That makes sense, but should you never solder or is it ok to crimp and solder? I'm thinking of long term connectivity issues since copper oxides.

Views? Thoughts?

thanks.
 

IdaSHO

IDACAMPER
Proper crimp + double layered adhesive heat shrink.

What size wiring? Make sure you get the correct crimper.

For small stuff, a ratcheting crimper is good.
For large stuff, the ebay or harbor freight hydraulic crimper is worth the investment.
 

dreadlocks

Well-known member
solder is too rigid and could fracture, if it gets hot enough to melt the solder (>350F) then you put way too much load on too small of a wire and you got a fire hazard either friggin way.

crimping and marine shrink wrap is the best way for vehicles, though I've still soldered my share in either and never had an issue.. if you needa join some wires in a tiny spot without leaving a lump in the carpet or something you just gotta do it, and in those locations wires are not really expected to move.
 

wb9wb

Member
solder is too rigid and could fracture, if it gets hot enough to melt the solder (>350F) then you put way too much load on too small of a wire and you got a fire hazard either friggin way.

crimping and marine shrink wrap is the best way for vehicles, though I've still soldered my share in either and never had an issue.. if you needa join some wires in a tiny spot without leaving a lump in the carpet or something you just gotta do it, and in those locations wires are not really expected to move.

thanks. I was just looking for "best practices" approach to vehicle wiring for an Aux battery setup and future solar MPPT setup.
 
Hydraulic crimper 8 AWG and up. If you don't want to spend much on a quality tool, harbor freight offers one. It is decent just be aware crimp dies are metric. The dies will work just fine for AWG crimps.
 

wb9wb

Member
Hydraulic crimper 8 AWG and up. If you don't want to spend much on a quality tool, harbor freight offers one. It is decent just be aware crimp dies are metric. The dies will work just fine for AWG crimps.
Actually, I was headed there today because of their 25% off coupon. ;)
 

Joe917

Explorer
FYI From : https://marinehowto.com/making-your-own-battery-cables/




Poor Quality Tool- Harbor Freight Hydraulic Crimp Tool
After many requests I have added my experiences with the Harbor Freight Hydraulic Crimper. I can sum it up in two words, very poor….. Read on if you want the why behind my review…. (wink)
Please let’s not misconstrue my review above. It’s not to say the Chinese can’t do things right, they certainly can, and they do every day, but when you send stuff out to the lowest, bottom feeder bidders, you often get what you pay for, as is the case here.
This tool was $59.99 and worth about what the corrugated box cost to ship it in. Go figure..
Lets get something out in the open, I like Harbor Freight Tools, for certain things. I am not dissing all their products in any way… I recently bought boxes of nitrile gloves for a 1/3 of what I can buy them for at my local hardware store, and they were the same exact brand. I like their wrench sets because I lose lots of wrenches and consider them disposable. HFT is good for many things and they truly serve a purpose. You can’t take that away from them.
This tool however is not own of their better products.
1-
The die sizes are apparently from some mythical made up Chinese back room standard. They are not AWG sized dies. I repeat, they are not AWG sized dies, despite being labeled as such. This is not only misleading it is blatant lying. They are so bad, and so mislabeled, I suspect some poor soul in a dirty dark room, with no internet connection, actually made it up after complaints from US customers that the dies were not AWG sized?
2- Apparently, with the earlier models of this tool, they were originally labeled in the MCM standard. I can see the meeting at HFT tools now; “Oh yeah we can fix that lets just re-label the MCM dies in AWG.“. Sorry HFT, it doesn’t work like that…
3- Even when you do find a die that works okay they tend to fall out of the tool and into the bilge. My tool/dies are mildly magnetic but no where near enough to prevent the dies from falling out and getting lost. HFT will not and can not get you replacements. I tried..
4- The dies are horribly machined, even if machined to a mythical made up wire standard
5- Can someone PLEASE tell the Chinese that there is NO SUCH AWG wire as 7 GA in the real world…….. ******!




1/0 Lug In The 1/0 Die
Here we go, this picture is an HFT 1/0 labeled die with a 1/0 lug in it. Yeah, that fits….
The lugs used in this demonstration were all starter lugs or the smallest OD lugs that will fit over 1/0, 2GA or 4GA wire. These were not the heavy duty power lugs.
The heavy duty lugs are considerably larger, OD wise. In fact a 1/0 heavy duty lug will not even fit between the jaws of this crimp tool when wide open.








Crimping The 1/0 Lug In 1/0 Die
Yeah right…..! Bad fit, wrong size, grossly mislabeled die, no good…..




Straining….
This 1/0 labeled die is so far off this is not even laughable.








Ouch………
Beautiful alignment for the top and bottom dies. Should I go on…….?




OVER-CRIMP !!!!!!
This is not how a crimp should be formed. Over-crimping can fracture wires and drastically weaken the lug. Over-crimping is equally as bad as under-crimping.
So the 1/0 lug cost me $3.30 and the 1/0 wire about $2.00 so I am now up to $65.30 trying to figure out this mythical HFT/Chinese die standard….. Sheesh…








2GA Lug In a 1/0 Die..?
Well 1/0 wire and flared starter lugs did not work in the 1/0 AWG die so lets try skipping right over 1GA and go straight to 2GA…
Here is a 2GA lug & wire which is two full sizes smaller than the 1/0 die is labeled for…..
Think it will work??




Hmmmmm….
And crimp……..








Holy Over-Crimp Batman!
Even a lug and wire two sizes smaller than the HFT crimp die is labeled for, and this tool, and I use that term lightly, is still GROSSLY over-crimping. This is NOT GOOD. A crimp should never look like this, never….
So, another $3.30 lug and $1.85 in wire ruined and we’re closing in on $70.00…………




Perhaps a 4GA Lug In a 1/0 Die ???
I am desperate now…. So let’s try THREE SIZES SMALLER……
Harbor Freight 1/0 AWG Die
1/0 = FAIL

1 GA = FAIL
2GA = FAIL
4GA = Let’s see…….








That’s a Bit Better………
Finally, a crimp that looks somewhat acceptable. Only problem is this tool is sold to crimp UP TO 1/0 wire and it will only crimp to 4GA.
My RIP OFF ALERT is beeping loudly..
Harbor Freight Hydraulic Crimp Tool = CAVEAT EMPTOR
You will ruin a lot of battery lugs trying to figure out this mythical Chinese / AWG standard so please factor that into your total cost of the tool.
If you want to use heavy duty power lugs, fagedaboutit…..




1/0, 2GA, 4GA – 1/0 Die
From top to bottom, using the 1/0 die, I tried:
1/0 = FAIL

1GA = FAIL (Did not need to physically test, knew it would not work.)
2GA = FAIL
4GA = Possibly Passable








What The Heck is 7GA Wire….?????
They missed the mark so badly they actually made up a new wire size. (smirk)
Commercially available 7 AWG wire simply does not exist in North America.
These are the standard AWG sizes, that actually do exist, this crimper is claimed to work with…
1/0
1GA
2GA
4GA
6GA
8GA
10GA
12GA
14GA
Why anyone would require a hydraulic crimp tool to crimp 8GA – 14GA wire is beyond me.




Chrome Plated Dies & 7GA Dies…?
That is some pretty odd chrome plating.? Also interesting to note is that they completely skipped over 1GA wire, which is readily available, but made up 7GA, which is not.. Wow!!!!
Until HFT can get the AWG die size conundrum sorted out I would advise buying a tool from a company that actually knows what they are talking about when it comes to crimping large gauge wire.
While it may not be a horrible tool for sizes smaller than 4GA, this is not a tool for anything larger than 4GA and that simply makes it a very poor value..
If you do decide to buy this tool there should be NO PINCHING when the lugs are crimped. All crimps should look like the 4GA crimp shown.
Expect to burn through about $30.00 – $40.00 in wire and terminals figuring out what dies work with what AWG wire & lugs and when you do WRITE IT DOWN… You’re on your own on figuring this out. I have given you the first one, the 1/0 AWG die works with 4GA starter lugs, but the rest are on your buck.. (wink)

 

IdaSHO

IDACAMPER
I've read that guys review.
Perhaps more a review-for-dummys
It isnt that hard to get great crimps out of the chinesium crimper.

Just have to use your brain-cells more than he did.

So far I've used mine for 2AWG, 4AWG, and 10AWG, and was able to get proper crimps without the over-crimp "wings" that he notes.
For 4AWG it simply took what Id call a 75% crimp, release, rotate 90 degrees in the jaws, then finish the crimp. Not that hard.

OEM cables and both leads to custom distribution block are all 4AWG.
Worked great.

44609374880_c29041ff74_b.jpg


32554106628_3ed55ae874_b.jpg
 
Yes do not full cycle the crimper. Use your eyes to watch the crimp as it progresses and release the pressure and rotate 90 degrees. These aren't aerospace crimps being done and as such not fully cycling the crimper you aren't going to jail or unemployment line for it. I suggest ordering a few extra terminals to practice with your first time using it. If he was doing this for a living then yes I would recommend a better crimper.
 

IdaSHO

IDACAMPER
Also, fit your lugs correctly to the wire used.

To use 4AWG as an example again, I find that 6AWG lugs fit better, and produces better results.
That is what is shown in the photos I posted above. 6AWG tinned marine lugs on "true" 4AWG wire.

4AWG lugs on 4AWG wire takes a lot more crimping, and can get ugly quick.

Not all sizes/gauges are this way however. Not all wire is true AWG. And not all lugs fit the same.
 

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