Rover Gear and a Beer Ashcroft D2 CVs & 1/2 shafts

[SeaRubi]

do you know what is really cool about dt/tt combo and skinny tires? 4-wheel burnouts uphill on wet pavement :roost:

 

[SeaRubi]

DII's that get wheeled will destroy one CV joint after another with a Truetrack and stock shafts/cv's. Too many happened to a friend of mine while we were out wheeling. I had the Rubi by that point and was giving it hell and he was matching every line; '99 DII with dual TT's. It's an effective setup for sure. Just don't chintz out on the upgraded cv's and shafts.

 

[Red90]

Yes, lets not confuse a 2WD car with a torsen and a full time 4wd. It is a whole other matter. Take a Rover with dual TTs and one with open diff in the snow and have a race. The TT truck will kill it.

 

[muskyman]

Yes, lets not confuse a 2WD car with a torsen and a full time 4wd. It is a whole other matter. Take a Rover with dual TTs and one with open diff in the snow and have a race. The TT truck will kill it.

well if the race was 100 miles over ice covered crowned roads I would bet the TT equipped truck would DNF.

conditions will always come into play when set up is being discussed.

 

[Riflman]

hate to break it to you but the tru-tracs torque steer in snow alot and although they work and many people like them in general if you really spend 5 months a year on snow covered roads ARB's would have been a better choice.

Maybe the guys in the UK were not the best to ask when it comes to snowy conditions/

I agree with the snow comments with dual TT's. I run them now on stock axles and CVs and am moving to ARBs. My truck is GREAT in snow, but I fight the steering on the trails like crazy. It's a side to side frenzy in the ruts and you have to keep both hands on the wheel and pay attention or you get pulled off the trac pretty easily. Plus, if you ever have one wheel off the ground like I sometimes do (usually the front), you can forget brake modulation with 33" tires and up. Your front end is useless in that situation. Here's one from yesterday where my back end fell through ice at the bank of a drainage. The driver's side wheel was off the ground until I started winching, then was on pure ice. The other tire was on the the lip if the ice but would not turn at all. All power was going to the driver's side tire with CDL looked, TT's and working the brake. I tried feathering, tapping it soft, tapping it hard and holding it down like I was pushing it to the floor while applying power. You could hear it trying to engage but it wouldn't.

Oh and the Greg Davis Bumper was installed just in time:

That ice was a foot thick and would have crunched some body panels for sure.

Modulation when the wheels are on the ground works great and ETC in light stuff works great with them, but I turn them off because of some issues I've heard of with the system overheating because of the ETC working too hard. Not sure on that last part, but I do it manually anyway.

 

[Alaska Mike]

I'm going to have to agree with Muskyman here. While a TT is nowhere near as bad as a Detroit on slick, off-camber surfaces, I definitely prefer an open differential. That's why I run ARBs. The cost is a little more (initial cost and installation), but it's the stronger and more versatile of the two.

More often than not, I run my ARBs open when off road, only locking them for very short periods when it's likely that I will encounter significant tire spin.

I've found that aggressive tires like TSLs with open differentials are more effective than less aggressive tires and locked differentials, at least in my application (mud). When I ran SSRs, I locked my differentials far more often and had far less directional control.

 

[Riflman]

When I ran SSRs, I locked my differentials far more often and had far less directional control.

Well this is interesting. I got my TTs and SSRs at the same time, so now I'm not sure if it's the TTs or the SSRs that are causing the torque steering. I do know that I was sliding side to side constantly on the trails. That said I had the best performance in deep snow than the 11 other trucks on the run, including one other rover with a 2" lift, 32" KM2's and CDL locked but with open diffs. I used to run chains and while I'll still keep at least a pair in the truck for emergencies, like having to back up a steep hill after freezing rain, I'm sure pretty sure these SSRs and TTs would get me through most snow conditions in my area. If I was climbing snow covered rock, then no way.

 

[Alaska Mike]

Understand that most summer wheeling up here is in the mud. Muddy hills, muddy rocks, miles of muskeg... you get the point.

My main problem with the SSRs was that the lugs would deflect, reducing their effectiveness in the mud. While that would make them more effective in certain environments, like rocks, they were less than impressive in this application. They cut/chunked easily, and were almost as noisy as TSL bias plys on the road once they were used off road a couple times.

In snow? Well, they were OK, but not really any more effective than off-road tires costing $100 less. More often than not I would just use my old BFG ATs, which didn't have the same tread voids but had more effective siping patterns for ice.

 

[Riflman]

Understand that most summer wheeling up here is in the mud. Muddy hills, muddy rocks, miles of muskeg... you get the point.

My main problem with the SSRs was that the lugs would deflect, reducing their effectiveness in the mud. While that would make them more effective in certain environments, like rocks, they were less than impressive in this application. They cut/chunked easily, and were almost as noisy as TSL bias plys on the road once they were used off road a couple times.

In snow? Well, they were OK, but not really any more effective than off-road tires costing $100 less. More often than not I would just use my old BFG ATs, which didn't have the same tread voids but had more effective siping patterns for ice.

OK. You lost me now. I ran BFG AT's for 7 years on two trucks, and as far as I'm concerned, with four wheel disc brakes and four wheel ABS, they were no better on ice than by BFG MT's. Everywhere else,my BFG MT's were 100 times more effective than the ATs. I would never EVER run the ATs again. In mud the lugs filled up and they turned into slicks. Same as wet, muddy snow. Slicks. The MTs would shed the mud and snow and dig down and bite. The MTs were a LITTLE louder, but not enough to be that noticeable and didn't bother me.

My SSRs?? When doing my research, I read that they were on par for noise to the BFG MT. To that, I call BS. My truck sounds like turbo prop airplane taking off. I got stuck in my Ford not far off the highway (with 33" BFG AT's) and had my GF come out with my rover to get me. My son and I had made it to the highway and were walking in the ditch toward home. We heard my truck coming from a LONG way off. I cannot carry on a phone conversation while on the highway and the stereo has to be up pretty loud. Convos among people in the truck are...taxing.

Performance wise? They are fantastic on ice, snow and mud. I am getting the torque steering but got my TTs the same time, so can't really compare that. I wasn't getting that before the TTs/SSRs. They are at least as good on ice and in mud as my MTs. They are pretty good for rock climbing, although once again, I didn't crawl much rock with my BFG MTs so I can't compare as well. That said, I'm pretty happy with how well the truck with SSRs performs on rocks, and there are several other guys I wheel with that use different tires, including another lifted disco with open diffs, CDL and 32" KM2s.

 

[Alaska Mike]

Obviously, ice is not ice and snow is not snow. It varies. In the conditions I encountered, the BFG A/T siping was more effective. There was also the fact that the BFGs sliced less easily than the SSRs (harder compound) and I was less concerned about them (older tires). YMMV

 

[muskyman]

I ran 285 75 16 SSR's for 4 years. I had them heavily siped on the center blocks and they were great tires for me except the sidewalls were junk and I was tearing up a tire on almost every other trip. We have alot of granite around here and the sidewalls just dont hold up to it. I have to say I never saw any kind of torque steering type issue from the SSR's in fact they always were pretty predictable.

I replaced them with heavily siped BFG KM's in 255 85 16 and the BFG's really suck in all ways and I cant wait to get rid of them. They pack full of mud to easy because of the narrow voids, they are mediocre on ice covered roads. The only thing they do well is balence and thats nice but not a reason to keep a tire.

I have not yet decided what I will run next...but we will see

 

[R_Lefebvre]

Modulation when the wheels are on the ground works great and ETC in light stuff works great with them, but I turn them off because of some issues I've heard of with the system overheating because of the ETC working too hard. Not sure on that last part, but I do it manually anyway.

When you were stuck in those photos, was ETC on or off? I understand that the system could overheat, but it seems odd to disable it prematurely. I've never had mine overheat on a trail run.

 

[muskyman]

When you were stuck in those photos, was ETC on or off? I understand that the system could overheat, but it seems odd to disable it prematurely. I've never had mine overheat on a trail run.

You also dont have a ton of trail time by your own admission.

I have seen DII brakes smoking like they just got off a race track from the ETC.

It is a very good idea to disable it before you get on the trail, you can always reactivate it if you are in a place that needs it. When you overheat the brakes the hub bearings tend to go bad. I have a friend that smoked a number of hub bearings and had constant leaking hub seal until he started to deactivate the ETC at the trail head.

Real trail use may not have been inside the design perameters of the system IMHO, lets face it with the three amigoes issues the braking system on the DII's is not stellar.

 

[Alaska Mike]

Might be a difference of environment too, as a cooler/wetter trail ride up north might not bring ETC shortcomings as plain.

 

[Red90]

You guys need let the air down, from what I can see.... Those tires appear over inflated.

I run a Detroit. The trails here are pure ice in the winter, often with water on top. I have never had any problems with sliding sideways, ever, in any conditions. I keep reading about how bad a Detroit is and keep waiting in anticipation of the bad behaviour.....

I find the SSRs quite good in snow and ice. Not a winter tire, for sure, but better than any ATs out there. I was very surprised when I took them out on the trail earlier this year. On ice, they were doing better than the others in the group by a good margin.

I should also question if traction control is working. With a Truetrac, traction control should work much better. You should not be needing to manually apply the brakes.