05-07 Tacoma Snorkel Thread

[heeltoe989]

Guys... you love your chosen rigs as overland rigs, I don't blame you, the Tacoma and 4Runners are excellent platforms. However, there is a reason the FJC is getting 10x's the product coverage... it has 15x's the market IMO. The number of vehicles sold honestly means nothing... its all about the number of vehicle owners wanting to install a snorkel, bumpers, etc. Do you think Safari Snorkel is honestly in a conspiracy to tout the FJC as a better off-road rig than the Tacoma

My perspective (also biased towards the proven Tacoma platform), the FJC market is waaaaay stronger than the Tacoma/4Runner market will ever be. The users that are buying FJC's mods as such. I get faaaaar more calls for FJC components than I do for Tacomas or 4Runners, sure there are a few die-hards that are building Taco's/4Runners (I have done extensive builds on both recently). Its nothing compared to the FJC stuff... and I know for a fact other shops are getting the same response. You should have seen SEMA, the FJC for a second year in a row stole the show, countless companies using the FJC as their show platform, offering their line of accessories. All these companies can't be wrong

However, I truly hope the aftermarket sector catches up a bit with the new gen Toyotas, it helps us all out

yeah its makes sense and its good business for the companies, but we still don't have to like it.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

... but we still don't have to like it.

I know, and I wouldn't either

 

[Dave Bennett]

yeah its makes sense and its good business for the companies, but we still don't have to like it.

:iagree: :bigbossHL:

 

[AlexJet]

Guys... you love your chosen rigs as overland rigs, I don't blame you, the Tacoma and 4Runners are excellent platforms. However, there is a reason the FJC is getting 10x's the product coverage... it has 15x's the market IMO. The number of vehicles sold honestly means nothing... its all about the number of vehicle owners wanting to install a snorkel, bumpers, etc. Do you think Safari Snorkel is honestly in a conspiracy to tout the FJC as a better off-road rig than the Tacoma

My perspective (also biased towards the proven Tacoma platform), the FJC market is waaaaay stronger than the Tacoma/4Runner market will ever be. The users that are buying FJC's mods as such. I get faaaaar more calls for FJC components than I do for Tacomas or 4Runners, sure there are a few die-hards that are building Taco's/4Runners (I have done extensive builds on both recently). Its nothing compared to the FJC stuff... and I know for a fact other shops are getting the same response. You should have seen SEMA, the FJC for a second year in a row stole the show, countless companies using the FJC as their show platform, offering their line of accessories. All these companies can't be wrong

However, I truly hope the aftermarket sector catches up a bit with the new gen Toyotas, it helps us all out

I agree that percentage of 4Runner and even Tacoma from overall sale numbers are much smaller then FJ which actually wheels. BUT anyway, I still think that Safari lost a huge market and continue loosing. They spend allot of $$$ to design this snorkel, but how many of this vehicles from overall sales will see off-road, not counting the fact that it just started showing up in dealerships: Safari Snorkel SS87HF

Safari, YOU MUST MADE one for Tacoma and 4Runner !

 

[Dave Bennett]

Yeah, most people aren't going to 'wheel a brand new 200 Series Land Cruiser through any water or anything else for that matter... :smilies27

 

[Sgt Grunt]

Forgive me for not being up to speed, but didn't someone find one the would work from a Hilux or something????????

 

[heeltoe989]

Yeah, most people aren't going to 'wheel a brand new 200 Series Land Cruiser through any water or anything else for that matter... :smilies27

I WOULD!!!! and I know you would to TACODOC :chowtime:

 

[cruiseroutfit]

I agree that percentage of 4Runner and even Tacoma from overall sale numbers are much smaller then FJ which actually wheels. BUT anyway, I still think that Safari lost a huge market and continue loosing. They spend allot of $$$ to design this snorkel, but how many of this vehicles from overall sales will see off-road, not counting the fact that it just started showing up in dealerships: Safari Snorkel SS87HF...

I respectfully disagree...

I can gaurantee in 5 years Safari Snorkel will have sold double or triple the amount of 200 Series LC snorkels, versus US spec. Taco/4runner units. Keep in mind the Land Cruiser is a WORLDWIDE market, and markets outside the US (including Aussie where Safari Snorkel is located) outfit brand new vehicles for real work use immediately.

I remember similar murmurs when the 100 Series debuted, and its a popular snorkel these days, lots of 80 owners converting into 100's, the 200 will follow short suit.

You speculate they are losing a "huge market", IMO they have the market pretty dialed in, had they asked for my input on a snorkel between the 200 and the 2nd gen Taco, I would have said the 200 without a bit of hesitation. And how are they losing anything? Unless there is competition, they are merely focusing on the hottest markets at the appropriate time I have no doubt they will produce one, and the sales lost... minimal at best.

 

[Dave Bennett]

I WOULD!!!! and I know you would to TACODOC :chowtime:

Yup. I'd drive that thing like I stole it! :shakin:

It's true, I do harbor a secret Land Cruiser fetish...

 

[heeltoe989]

Yup. I'd drive that thing like I stole it! :shakin:

It's true, I do harbor a secret Land Cruiser fetish...

I wish we just got it here in Canada. It hasn't come to any dealers and I dought we'll get it. Its too cool for us. I know I would bought one for the wife if it had come to Canada. I had to settle ( well not really settle) for the Mercedes Benz ML 320 CDI. All though I do love the diesel benz's gas milage. I have said on numerous occasions I would love to have the engine from it.

 

[AlexJet]

I respectfully disagree...

I can gaurantee in 5 years Safari Snorkel will have sold double or triple the amount of 200 Series LC snorkels, versus US spec. Taco/4runner units. Keep in mind the Land Cruiser is a WORLDWIDE market, and markets outside the US (including Aussie where Safari Snorkel is located) outfit brand new vehicles for real work use immediately.

I remember similar murmurs when the 100 Series debuted, and its a popular snorkel these days, lots of 80 owners converting into 100's, the 200 will follow short suit.

You speculate they are losing a "huge market", IMO they have the market pretty dialed in, had they asked for my input on a snorkel between the 200 and the 2nd gen Taco, I would have said the 200 without a bit of hesitation. And how are they losing anything? Unless there is competition, they are merely focusing on the hottest markets at the appropriate time I have no doubt they will produce one, and the sales lost... minimal at best.

Yes and no... You're right Kurt for the market of 200 in general. The point I'm saying is that right now when 200 just start coming to the dealers Safari already has the snorkel designed while Tacoma and 4Runners are on the market for a long time, but nobody, I'm saying nobody, even start designing one. Safari would sell allot of the 200 snorkels, but not now, sometime in 2-3 years and we need one yesterday. After long period ARB realized that they need to produce Tacoma and 4Runner bumpers what they did this year after 5 years of the vehicle on the market and I know many people who got them. This is showing that there is am off-road market for our trucks. Safari owned by ARB and there is no big deal to design or adopt one of the existing models to fit our trucks and I think the money spend on R&D will be paid back with profit.
I hope I got my point clear. If there is a market, you should fight for it and get it. I hope ARB will understand it and offer us something in the future.

 

[AlexJet]

I wish we just got it here in Canada. It hasn't come to any dealers and I dought we'll get it. Its too cool for us. I know I would bought one for the wife if it had come to Canada. I had to settle ( well not really settle) for the Mercedes Benz ML 320 CDI. All though I do love the diesel benz's gas milage. I have said on numerous occasions I would love to have the engine from it.

100% with you on this. I'd love to get one here as well, but I want it diesel. I can bring 100 from US, but it still be gas version.

 

[heeltoe989]

Yes and no... You're right Kurt for the market of 200 in general. The point I'm saying is that right now when 200 just start coming to the dealers Safari already has the snorkel designed while Tacoma and 4Runners are on the market for a long time, but nobody, I'm saying nobody, even start designing one. Safari would sell allot of the 200 snorkels, but not now, sometime in 2-3 years and we need one yesterday. After long period ARB realized that they need to produce Tacoma and 4Runner bumpers what they did this year after 5 years of the vehicle on the market and I know many people who got them. This is showing that there is am off-road market for our trucks. Safari owned by ARB and there is no big deal to design or adopt one of the existing models to fit our trucks and I think the money spend on R&D will be paid back with profit.
I hope I got my point clear. If there is a market, you should fight for it and get it. I hope ARB will understand it and offer us something in the future.

I agree, but we can all talk about it and contact the companies, but at the end of the day, if they don't want to make it they won't. Regardless of how much business we think they are losing.

 

[cruiseroutfit]

We could argue this all day... but I'll let this be my final post on the subject.


1. ARB does NOT own Safari Snorkel, they are their own company. ARB-USA is however the sole distributor of the products in the US, so they do have alot of "weight" in the decision to produce said snorkels. In this case ARB-USA made the decision NOT to have a snorkel made for the 05-07, and according to higher-ups within ARB, they never will The tooling alone costs nearly $30k, when the are making ~$50 per snorkel, they would have to sell roughly 600 units even to consider it being worth it. The same ARB rep told me that even if they had an order for 100 pre-paid units, they still wouldn't do it. He actually mentioned that the previous generation Tacoma/4Runner snorkels didn't sell as they had hoped, even to this day. In hindsite they might not have produced that unit.

2. ARB did have a 2nd gen Taco in Aussie, however it is back in the US (not sure if could stay in Aussie due to DOT issues???). At that time they made the decision not to have a snorkel prototyped, and due to the fact the vehicle is North-American ONLY, Safari Snorkel had likely less interest in it. Why would they, they won't sell any except through ARB in the US. If their word was no go, they took it as such.

3. I still don't think there is the market you guys are imagining. YES, there are a bunch of die-hards like yourselves that would buy one today if available, but are there 600? That the "break-even" point... And that alot of money just to "break even" if you see where I'm going with this. ARB is very keen to the market demands for products, a fraction (10%?) of the customers that would/have buy a ARB bullbar and suspension, might also buy a snorkel, I find this true for 40's, 60's, 80's, 100's, FJC's, etc... and 10% is generous, more like 5% at best overall as I'm more likel to "push" a snorkel as we stock them and run them on all of our personal rigs here. When the FJC bumpers are outselling the late model 4Runner/Taco bumpers 10:1, they get the picture. I have no doubt I will sell 5x's the amount of 200 bumpers as I will the 4Runner/Taco setups in the next couple years. (These are my guestimates, not verified nor compared to ARB's experience, though I'd bet they have a similar stance )

4. Do you have to accept defeat? Of course not, and neither would I. Using another snorkel (as noted in this thread) is WELL documented and should work just fine. Afraid of the "complexity's" of the install? Well, you'll be surprise to know I think it looks easier than alot of the LC installs we do. Many of the LC Safari kits we are using were always intended for diesel rigs, with airboxes on the opposite side of the motor, modifying the system to work is nothing new and not a major issue IMO. Buy the snorkel that works... and install it...

 

[heeltoe989]

We could argue this all day... but I'll let this be my final post on the subject.


1. ARB does NOT own Safari Snorkel, they are their own company. ARB-USA is however the sole distributor of the products in the US, so they do have alot of "weight" in the decision to produce said snorkels. In this case ARB-USA made the decision NOT to have a snorkel made for the 05-07, and according to higher-ups within ARB, they never will The tooling alone costs nearly $30k, when the are making ~$50 per snorkel, they would have to sell roughly 600 units even to consider it being worth it. The same ARB rep told me that even if they had an order for 100 pre-paid units, they still wouldn't do it. He actually mentioned that the previous generation Tacoma/4Runner snorkels didn't sell as they had hoped, even to this day. In hindsite they might not have produced that unit.

2. ARB did have a 2nd gen Taco in Aussie, however it is back in the US (not sure if could stay in Aussie due to DOT issues???). At that time they made the decision not to have a snorkel prototyped, and due to the fact the vehicle is North-American ONLY, Safari Snorkel had likely less interest in it. Why would they, they won't sell any except through ARB in the US. If their word was no go, they took it as such.

3. I still don't think there is the market you guys are imagining. YES, there are a bunch of die-hards like yourselves that would buy one today if available, but are there 600? That the "break-even" point... And that alot of money just to "break even" if you see where I'm going with this. ARB is very keen to the market demands for products, a fraction (10%?) of the customers that would/have buy a ARB bullbar and suspension, might also buy a snorkel, I find this true for 40's, 60's, 80's, 100's, FJC's, etc... and 10% is generous, more like 5% at best overall as I'm more likel to "push" a snorkel as we stock them and run them on all of our personal rigs here. When the FJC bumpers are outselling the late model 4Runner/Taco bumpers 10:1, they get the picture. I have no doubt I will sell 5x's the amount of 200 bumpers as I will the 4Runner/Taco setups in the next couple years. (These are my guestimates, not verified nor compared to ARB's experience, though I'd bet they have a similar stance )

4. Do you have to accept defeat? Of course not, and neither would I. Using another snorkel (as noted in this thread) is WELL documented and should work just fine. Afraid of the "complexity's" of the install? Well, you'll be surprise to know I think it looks easier than alot of the LC installs we do. Many of the LC Safari kits we are using were always intended for diesel rigs, with airboxes on the opposite side of the motor, modifying the system to work is nothing new and not a major issue IMO. Buy the snorkel that works... and install it...

AMEN!!!! Now lets all go do some wheeling:rally_guys: