'94 F-250 suspension question
- Thread starter fjatheart
- Start date
shortbus4x4
Expedition Leader
If money is an object then put new shocks on first, I have done shocks on a few older fords and am amazed at the ride improvement. Of course if you want a lift kit then get the springs and shocks together.
78Bronco
Explorer
New shocks, good springs (alcan or deaver). If you have a solid aaxle consider a shackle reversal for the front.
A shackle reversal will move the shackle to the rear mount for the spring. As you drive foward and hit a bump the shackle will compress in an arc with the natural flow of energy and the axle moving up and towards the back of our truck. It seems too logical. The kit also provides a couple inches of lift.
http://www.sky-manufacturing.com/new/detaproduct.php?id=162
What do you have? A solid axle or TTB?
A shackle reversal will move the shackle to the rear mount for the spring. As you drive foward and hit a bump the shackle will compress in an arc with the natural flow of energy and the axle moving up and towards the back of our truck. It seems too logical. The kit also provides a couple inches of lift.
http://www.sky-manufacturing.com/new/detaproduct.php?id=162
What do you have? A solid axle or TTB?
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IdaSHO
IDACAMPER
Unless it has had a swap done, it will have the D50 TTB
How many moles on the thing?
If it has anywhere near 200k or more, plan on replacing everything from leak spring and shackle bushings, TTB bushings, and shocks.
Running a lower PSI will help loads too.
As a general rule though, the D50 TTB rides like poo.
How many moles on the thing?
If it has anywhere near 200k or more, plan on replacing everything from leak spring and shackle bushings, TTB bushings, and shocks.
Running a lower PSI will help loads too.
As a general rule though, the D50 TTB rides like poo.
As a general rule though, the D50 TTB rides like poo.
Unless you mod it. Then it is a dream offroad....pound whoops all day long.
http://giantmotorsports.com/content/view/47/70/
chasespeed
Explorer
Yeah, it depends on the size of your wallet.
You could switch over to a D60 front from a 1 ton ford....
OR....
Get rid of that D50 ttb or pay to have it modded.....
If you get rid of it, go with a D44 ttb, MUCH MUCH more options.
Either way, you're going to spend some coin.
It can be done....
BUT, I would start with cheap stuff first... some GOOD shocks... Bilstein 5100s minimum. then, some deavers, alcans, or national springs.....
Might also be able to get some brackets made for a good 2.5 or 3inch coil over....then, you'll need trailing arms, etc..
Chase
You could switch over to a D60 front from a 1 ton ford....
OR....
Get rid of that D50 ttb or pay to have it modded.....
If you get rid of it, go with a D44 ttb, MUCH MUCH more options.
Either way, you're going to spend some coin.
It can be done....
BUT, I would start with cheap stuff first... some GOOD shocks... Bilstein 5100s minimum. then, some deavers, alcans, or national springs.....
Might also be able to get some brackets made for a good 2.5 or 3inch coil over....then, you'll need trailing arms, etc..
Chase
There are not many TTB suspension kits that are going to work on your F250, most are designed for the F150/Bronco.
Your truck has leaf springs and a D50, not coils and a D44.
An RSK (Reverse Shackle Kit) from Sky Offroad is an option, but you are still going to be dealing with the minimal travel of the leaf sprung TTB. This lack of travel is the reason your truck rides like a board. Most F250 owners looking to improve the ride switch over to the solid axle D60 found on the F350's.
Reverse Shackle http://powerstrokenation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42940
D60 Swap http://powerstrokenation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41695
^looks like you need an account to read the write ups, sorry.
You will see minimal improvement after spending a lot of money trying to fix this particular axle set up.
- Look up your axle code and find out your diff ratio (Most likely 4.10 or 3.55)
- Start looking in your local junk yards and Craigs for a D60 with this same ratio.
- Swap it out with the RSK and OEM SD springs (V-Codes) **read the links above**
Good luck, Chris
Your truck has leaf springs and a D50, not coils and a D44.
An RSK (Reverse Shackle Kit) from Sky Offroad is an option, but you are still going to be dealing with the minimal travel of the leaf sprung TTB. This lack of travel is the reason your truck rides like a board. Most F250 owners looking to improve the ride switch over to the solid axle D60 found on the F350's.
Reverse Shackle http://powerstrokenation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=42940
D60 Swap http://powerstrokenation.com/forums/showthread.php?t=41695
^looks like you need an account to read the write ups, sorry.
You will see minimal improvement after spending a lot of money trying to fix this particular axle set up.
- Look up your axle code and find out your diff ratio (Most likely 4.10 or 3.55)
- Start looking in your local junk yards and Craigs for a D60 with this same ratio.
- Swap it out with the RSK and OEM SD springs (V-Codes) **read the links above**
Good luck, Chris
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fjatheart
Adventurer
Yeah...that's not going to happen.
It's a daily driver and one day possibly an adventure vehicle. I would like a mild life and better ride if it can be had with the stock twin beam.
If new springs and some Bilsteins only leave me with the same ride quailty then it's not worth it to me.
Thanks for the info and ideas. I'm going to look into alcan and deaver.
Thanks!
fjatheart
Adventurer
Thanks Chris, this is really some great information!
ntsqd
Heretic Car Camper
Bang for buck switching to coil springs (not necessarily coil-overs, just coils) will be the best answer. Not the easiest, but the best. Convert it to work like the F-150 front suspension of the same general vintage. I'd venture that a lot of the relavent F-150 parts could be used. Some as-is, some with modifications.
The inherent problem is that the arcs of travel at the spring pad are in perpendicular directions. The axle half is trying to deflect the spring laterally, which the spring happens to be shaped in a way that is good at resisting this.
Solid axle swaps reduce ride quality from an independent system, but given the starting point it may still be an improvement.
The inherent problem is that the arcs of travel at the spring pad are in perpendicular directions. The axle half is trying to deflect the spring laterally, which the spring happens to be shaped in a way that is good at resisting this.
Solid axle swaps reduce ride quality from an independent system, but given the starting point it may still be an improvement.
Do you know of anybody who has used coil springs for the ride height and kept the leaf springs for axle location ? I know you would still have the lateral deflection of the leaf spring but it might be a low budget alternative.
Also do you have any links to people who have converted to coil springs and radius arms?
I am on my third TTB frontend. My first was a light duty 83 f250 with a 300 6 cyl. 4 sp. it even had an 8.8 semifloat rearend. I think the gvw was around 6,800. It rode very nice from what I remember. The next two were diesels and they obviously ride much worse.
This topic has been bugging me and since I am by no means an "expert" I have been lurking and reading as much as I can. So if someone knows please post up.
ntsqd may be on to something with this sentence.
Bang for buck switching to coil springs (not necessarily coil-overs, just coils) will be the best answer. Not the easiest, but the best. Convert it to work like the F-150 front suspension of the same general vintage. I'd venture that a lot of the relavent F-150 parts could be used. Some as-is, some with modifications.
It appears there are three versions of the TTB in the Bronco/F150/F250 platform (Leaving the D35 TTB for the Bronco II and Explorer out of this conversation). The D44, the D50 and another I was unfamiliar with the D44HD. It is referred to as the HD by enthusiasts, but is really a D44 with an aluminum "third member" that uses different bearings and seals, and rumors of 8 lug hubs.
Questions (I have no answers to)
- Did the D44HD come with 8 lug hubs?
- Was there a model year switch from D44 to D50 for the TTB F250's?
- Was the D44HD used on the gasoline motors and the D50 on the diesel's?
I like being able to use oem off the shelf type parts to meet my vehicle needs, its usually cheap, especially with older vehicles. Converting a leaf TTB to the coil version just might be doable.
Here are the questions you will need to answer.
- IF the F250 frame has the same holes as the Bronco/F150 you can swap out the upper spring bucket. http://www.off-roadweb.com/tech/0904or_do_it_yourself_long_travel_ttb/photo_04.html Ford uses heavy duty steel rivets on their frame attachments and you are going to have to remove a lot of them.
- Are there oem springs that will hold the weight? (F150 X-cab 460ci longbed 4x4?)
- For the TTB what you want is the D44 arms that already have the lower coil spring perch and shock mounts combined with the D50 9" differential and 8 lug hubs. This might be what guys are refering to as the D44HD but I do not know.
I like the TTB in coil form. It just does not work with the leaf's, like ntsqd said its two arc's perpendicular to each other, all it does is bind.
ntsqd may be on to something with this sentence.
Bang for buck switching to coil springs (not necessarily coil-overs, just coils) will be the best answer. Not the easiest, but the best. Convert it to work like the F-150 front suspension of the same general vintage. I'd venture that a lot of the relavent F-150 parts could be used. Some as-is, some with modifications.
It appears there are three versions of the TTB in the Bronco/F150/F250 platform (Leaving the D35 TTB for the Bronco II and Explorer out of this conversation). The D44, the D50 and another I was unfamiliar with the D44HD. It is referred to as the HD by enthusiasts, but is really a D44 with an aluminum "third member" that uses different bearings and seals, and rumors of 8 lug hubs.
Questions (I have no answers to)
- Did the D44HD come with 8 lug hubs?
- Was there a model year switch from D44 to D50 for the TTB F250's?
- Was the D44HD used on the gasoline motors and the D50 on the diesel's?
I like being able to use oem off the shelf type parts to meet my vehicle needs, its usually cheap, especially with older vehicles. Converting a leaf TTB to the coil version just might be doable.
Here are the questions you will need to answer.
- IF the F250 frame has the same holes as the Bronco/F150 you can swap out the upper spring bucket. http://www.off-roadweb.com/tech/0904or_do_it_yourself_long_travel_ttb/photo_04.html Ford uses heavy duty steel rivets on their frame attachments and you are going to have to remove a lot of them.
- Are there oem springs that will hold the weight? (F150 X-cab 460ci longbed 4x4?)
- For the TTB what you want is the D44 arms that already have the lower coil spring perch and shock mounts combined with the D50 9" differential and 8 lug hubs. This might be what guys are refering to as the D44HD but I do not know.
I like the TTB in coil form. It just does not work with the leaf's, like ntsqd said its two arc's perpendicular to each other, all it does is bind.
Here is a TTB 50, heavily massaged. You can get those TTB's for work, and work well.
More or less how mine is setup. Had a buddy who builds race trucks mod one up for me, lucky for me we traded out work. So I don't have too much money into it.
http://www.insideoutservicesllc.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=2506&g2_page=1
Auto Fab has 2WD coil kits that you could be able to convert to the TTB.
http://www.autofab.com/wheel.htm
More or less how mine is setup. Had a buddy who builds race trucks mod one up for me, lucky for me we traded out work. So I don't have too much money into it.
http://www.insideoutservicesllc.com/gallery/main.php?g2_itemId=2506&g2_page=1
Auto Fab has 2WD coil kits that you could be able to convert to the TTB.
http://www.autofab.com/wheel.htm
ntsqd
Heretic Car Camper
Mixing types of leaf springs (i.e coils with leaves) is a bad idea from a damping perspective. Each type has it's own damping rate needs. Trying to get a damper to work with both is very likely to be more work than just dumping the leafs and going to a radius arm.
I doubt that the F-250 frame has holes for the F-150 spring buckets. The frame modulus is different so they will not be the same stampings. One of the Samurai vendors offers a suspension kit that uses coil-over springs without using coil-over shocks. That is an excellent idea! By doing this you are not tied to spring rates offered for an OE application, you can get them in 50 - 100 lbs increments and most spring retailers will exchange new springs if they are not cosmetically damaged.
I doubt that the F-250 frame has holes for the F-150 spring buckets. The frame modulus is different so they will not be the same stampings. One of the Samurai vendors offers a suspension kit that uses coil-over springs without using coil-over shocks. That is an excellent idea! By doing this you are not tied to spring rates offered for an OE application, you can get them in 50 - 100 lbs increments and most spring retailers will exchange new springs if they are not cosmetically damaged.