Cummins 2.8 Swap

Stroked 550

Adventurer
Has anyone done the Cummins 2.8 swap into their Wrangler?

How do you like?

What kind of fuel mpg are you getting?

hows the power? Can you maintain freeway speeds up steep grades? ( I have a 2011 wrangler with 5.18s on 35s and It struggles going up grades)
 

vintageracer

To Infinity and Beyond!
There were several Cummins 2.8 Jeep Wrangler swaps at the East Coast Expo in Ashville NC when the 2.8 Cummins crate engine first came debuted with all sorts of gushing great reviews.

IF it was so good where are all these Cummins Jeep Swaps at these days?

These swaps are far and few between even at Jeep meets much less on the trail.

The cost (Expensive) versus what ya git in the end (The Reward) apparently does not match and you can now buy a diesel Wrangler straight from Fiat, I mean Jeep.

Given the above observations why waste your time and your money doing this swap?
 

pittsburgh

tacocat
I contacted cummins about a crate 2.8 for my Wrangler and this was thier response;

"Thank you for contacting Cummins. The resolution to your inquiry, - Will the R2.8 be street legal for my 2005 Wrangler Unlimited in the future?, is as follows:


As of right now, it is for 1999 and older. We have not been told otherwise.

You can see the information at https://www.cummins.com/engines/repower



Due to state/provincial law restrictions, these engines are not currently available for purchase in the state of Texas, state of West Virginia or the province of Quebec. Warranty service with respect to the engines and loose components will not be available in the states of Texas and West Virginia.

The Cummins R2.8 Turbo Diesel (PN 5467036) has demonstrated through the testing procedures prescribed in 40 CFR Part 86 to meet EPA’s Tier 0 (LDT 1 and 2) and Tier 1 emissions standards (LDT 2 weighing less than 4000 lb complete weight). This means that the R2.8 generally is suitable for Model Year 1999 or earlier light duty trucks. However, the suitability of the R2.8 engine to any vehicle is the responsibility of the installer and may depend on state or area laws. Installation of this part in a vehicle for which it is not intended may violate U.S. and Canadian laws and regulations related to motor vehicle emissions. Check your state and local emissions requirements before purchasing."

I think many people shy away from it since the jeeps that they want to put it in aren't old enough?
 

1stDeuce

Explorer
My buddy did a Cummins 2.8 conversion on his early Bronco. He's running 35's IIRC, and he is pretty happy with the 2.8. It crawls along nicely, and is torquey. I don't think mileage is spectacular, as the main limit is aerodynamics, and an early Bronco on 35's is, well, not aerodynamic in any way. Still better than it was with the 351 that was in it... The same would apply to a Wrangler, which would likely struggle to hit the low 20's if converted, unless you routinely travel large distances at 55 or 60mph max. I do think he's happy with the power, and there are now higher output calibrations that can be installed if you want even more...

My wife had with a CRD Liberty when we met in 2011, and we kept it until about 2015. It was a good powertrain, excepting the drainback issues with the 545RFE by 150k or so. I hated the Limited seats in her Liberty, but it was indeed a pleasure to drive. Unfortunately, the liberty powertrain is very difficult to "swap" without the ability to do some significant re-calibration because it gets vehicle speed over the can bus from the ABS module IIRC. Green Diesel used to be able to help with the calibration end of things, but I'm not sure they'll even touch one these days with EPA concerns. I believe there was an export diesel JK almost since the beginning, but I don't think it used the VM, so swapping a KJ VM into a JK is not going to be easy. Since people couldn't be bothered to sign the petition to change the import restrictions from 25 years to 15 years a couple years ago, importing a diesel JK is still a decade away.

Warning, a bit off topic...
When I worked at Jeep in the late 90's and early 2000's, I spent some time in a 2.5l VM turbo diesel Cherokee, which was assembled here in the US, but for export only. The diesel was only available with a 5 speed manual. While it was only 110 or so hp, it had 330ftlbs of torque IIRC, and IMO, was a GREAT powertrain for a relatively stock Cherokee. It was a bit "buzzy" on the highway, but I recall it getting 24or 25mpg on a trip down into IN. (probably @ 65mph...) I really wanted that powertrain in a TJ, but Diamler never chose to package it for TJ, even for export. For those of us interested, '97 Cherokees should be elligible for import now, but finding a nice enough one to justify shipping it here will be tricky. Still not a great swap for a bigger Jeep like the JK though.

The same 2.5L VM was also used in chrysler minivans and the ZJ in export markets, starting I believe around 1995. Either of those might be a doner for a TJ as well. The VM 2.5 was an indirect injection engine. It later recieved common rail control and a bit of an over-bore to become the KJ 2.8L CRD. At one time, I had thoughts of getting the heads, IP, and ECM from a euro 2.5 and using the parts to convert a 2.8L CRD to old school injection, which would work in my manual trans TJ...

Finally, the diesel that AEV put in a TJ back in the mid-2000's was the VM out of a Cherokee. (Possibly, the one I drove, as I think that was one of the last diesel cherokees in the development fleet...) I think AEV still has that TJ...
 
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You could put the direct copy of the vm2.8 just with extra epa parts by using gms 2.8 duramax they were built in the same vm plant and not much has changed since that stopped. They are visibly still almost identical, and I'm gonna let out a huge secret here they use some of the same parts. My colorado has a vm2.8 timing belt in it right now and I'm in texas where the parts were shipped to me.

One reason you have trouble finding vm2.8 is because of the cash for clunkers program alot of people traded them in for new vehicles during that and they were destroyed with that beautiful engine soup they poured in em to lock up the clunkers engines.
 
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1stDeuce

Explorer
You could put the direct copy of the vm2.8 just with extra epa parts by using gms 2.8 duramax they were built in the same vm plant and not much has changed since that stopped. They are visibly still almost identical, and I'm gonna let out a huge secret here they use some of the same parts. My colorado has a vm2.8 timing belt in it right now and I'm in texas where the parts were shipped to me.

One reason you have trouble finding vm2.8 is because of the cash for clunkers program alot of people traded them in for new vehicles during that and they were destroyed with that beautiful engine soup they poured in em to lock up the clunkers engines.

Are you talking about the Colorado/Canyon 2.8L in the US? I hadn't thought about that. It is a descendant of the VM 2.8 used in the CRD. Just gotta find a wrecked baby dmax colorado... And do a whole lot of programming I bet... Looks like the going price on car-part.com is about $6k. About half what a Cummins 2.8 costs,and has better torque and hp... Standalone harness ~$2k. Still cheaper...

Please expand on your comment about cash for clunkers... CFC was ~2009... I highly doubt many 2005 or 2006 CRD's got turned in for the $4500 rebate, as they would have been worth ~20k still... Those are the only VM 2.8's in the US at the time, so how were VM 2.8's affected? I suppose that if there had been a similar program in europe, many of the VM 2.5's in older vehicles might have been scrapped... ??
 
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Are you talking about the Colorado/Canyon 2.8L in the US? I hadn't thought about that. It is a descendant of the VM 2.8 used in the CRD. Just gotta find a wrecked baby dmax colorado... And do a whole lot of programming I bet... Looks like the going price on car-part.com is about $6k. About half what a Cummins 2.8 costs,and has better torque and hp... Standalone harness ~$2k. Still cheaper...

Please expand on your comment about cash for clunkers... CFC was ~2009... I highly doubt many 2005 or 2006 CRD's got turned in for the $4500 rebate, as they would have been worth ~20k still... Those are the only VM 2.8's in the US at the time, so how were VM 2.8's affected? I suppose that if there had been a similar program in europe, many of the VM 2.5's in older vehicles might have been scrapped... ??

Yep colorado is the same, and im sure there would be a rats nest of wiring to figure out.
On cash for clunkers it's just a guess but I haven't seen too many 2.8 jeeps running around since 2012 or so, maybe the owners wreck em,maybe the owners didnt take care of em or maybe they are hiding em I can't say for sure but after cfc I don't see em anymore in texas or Indiana.
 

1stDeuce

Explorer
On cash for clunkers it's just a guess but I haven't seen too many 2.8 jeeps running around since 2012 or so, maybe the owners wreck em,maybe the owners didnt take care of em or maybe they are hiding em I can't say for sure but after cfc I don't see em anymore in texas or Indiana.

Aside from CRD Liberties, there were no 2.8l diesel Jeeps in the US in 2012. They didn't sell many CRD liberty models anyway, and their slow disappearance certainly has nothing to do with the CFC... Are you thinking of the gas 2.8l cherokees built from '84 to '86? I'm sure many of them would have been turned in if they were still around. ?



Sent from my E6910 using Tapatalk
 
Aside from CRD Liberties, there were no 2.8l diesel Jeeps in the US in 2012. They didn't sell many CRD liberty models anyway, and their slow disappearance certainly has nothing to do with the CFC... Are you thinking of the gas 2.8l cherokees built from '84 to '86? I'm sure many of them would have been turned in if they were still around. ?



Sent from my E6910 using Tapatalk
Crd liberty was the only 2.8 diesel jeep I've ever seen, haven't seen them on road since 2012 so something happened. What then?
 

Stroked 550

Adventurer
Crd liberty was the only 2.8 diesel jeep I've ever seen, haven't seen them on road since 2012 so something happened. What then?


Cummins has a drop in crate motor package
 

1stDeuce

Explorer
CRD Liberty was the only 2.8 diesel jeep I've ever seen, haven't seen them on road since 2012 so something happened. What then?
Nothing. I bought one for my nephew last year, and found several others for sale. I think many owners are hanging onto them "till death do us part" at this point. Plenty of them have probably ended up in junkyards due to rust in the midwest or accidents. I imagine that they have been dispersed from places where they may have been more popular. My wife's '05 CRD is still bumping around this area, and I saw it just a few months ago. Remember, there were only about 5000 sold each year. That's not many when you spread them over the country... I'd bet half of them have been taken off the road due to rust and wrecks, so they are getting quite rare at this time. I am certain that nothing happened in 2012 to cause them to cease existing, especially not a cash for clunkers program that was in 2009, for which they didn't even qualify as a turn-in because they weren't old enough...

Cummins has a drop in crate motor package

Welcome to the party. If you look at the first post, the Cummins 2.8l was the original reason for this post. I rather took it into the weeds talking about other alternatives to the fairly expensive Cummins conversion. :)
 
Weird, I thought there was a tj kit from cummins for like $10K. I dont see it now- just the motor and none in stock? RIP I guess.
 

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