Frame Strength, Who to Believe! The RV Sales Guy or the New Truck Dealer? Maybe Neither?

[neliconcept]

Wreckers are also F550 Ram 5500, or F600s . I don't think I've ever seen one less than a 5500 series, no f450s, no ram 4500s. Maybe their are.

MY thoughts are, how the hell are camper companies making slide ins built for trucks that are obviously 3500 series trucks with beds (only F450 has a bed, all other 4500 series trucks are chassis cabs). that is that damn heavy.... Plus that big.. At that point, flat bed it on a 5500 or bigger..

 

[RAM5500 CAMPERTHING]

It seems there might be more to this whole "truck camper thing" than:

A: "the salesman said"

B: "I think we are under GVWR"

C: "so far I have had no problems"

D: "It's a full size truck"

E: Just add airbags, you'll be fine bro

 

[stevo_pct]

Given some of the pics above, I'm wondering about potential frame damage when towing. I have an F150 (2019 super crew, 5.5' bed) and tow an "off road" trailer. Everything is well within all specs. The trailer fully loaded is maybe 3000 pounds. The tongue weight is 220# dry, but is probably closer to 300+ when loaded.

There is almost no sag in the rear when fully loaded and towing. The truck is level or maybe even a little higher in the back. The specs say 500# max tongue weight and trailers up to 5000# can be towed without a weight distribution hitch. I'm well within payload.

What can I look into to make sure it's not a problem? I didn't even think there would be an issue until I saw some of the pics above with bent frames towing an off road teardrop camper. I thought those things would tow behind a full size or even most mid sized trucks no problem.

 

[rruff]

This wrecker boom example, payload / COG on the wrecker is slightly ahead of its axel. Length of its boom is irrelevant to the max load what can be applied to the wrecker chassis.

It's the moment that matters... and how that force/torque is distributed on the frame. I don't know, but it would make sense that wreckers are specifically beefed up for this type of load, while a normal pickup is not at all.

I'm willing to bet all these failures occurred with "bottoming out", which is a big force amplifier.

 

[tacollie]

Wrecker frames also crack and get repaired. That goes for any commercial vehicle carrying heavy loads.

 

[tacollie]

Does that mean somebody regularly inspects their heavily laden trucks to discover cracks to repair ?
Perhaps going heavily laden into Baja is exempt from inspection ?
Maybe there is a lesson there. Dammed if I know what it is...

They say ignorance is bliss ?

 

[shortbus4x4]

THIS ^^^^

GVWRs and towing capacities are based on best case senarios.... ie freeway driving.
Dodge 2500s are rated to carry WAY more payload than Dodge 2500 Powerwagons because the trucks are built, designed and intended for different uses in much different terrain. Anyone on this forum should not be maxxing out their overlanding rigs.

When I was a young man and driving 5 tons for Uncle Sam the on road rating was twice what the off road rating was.

 

[ThundahBeagle]

It's very easy to know the truck's rating, take it and get it weighed, then subtract that from the gvw.
Maybe people should weigh their trucks before they buy them if they think they are going to be close on payload. Go on a test drive, pay 20 bucks at a scale.I'm sure the dealer would compensate you on an $80,000 purchase.

Conversely, if you can spend 80 grand on a truck, you can fork over 20 bucks for scale

 

[ThundahBeagle]

⬆️ From above article…

“(The trucks owners says) I knew the payload capacity on the truck was about 7,800 pounds and the camper dry weight was close to 5,000 pounds, but fully loaded, probably about 6,500 pounds."

If you Google the max payload capacity for a 2020 Ram 3500, you'll see a figure close to what Pavel quoted there: 7,680 pounds. However, that's only the case for a regular-cab, long-bed model with two-wheel drive and the 6.4-liter Hemi V8. The truck in question here is a crew-cab, short-bed with four-wheel drive and the 6.7-liter Cummins diesel, meaning its payload capacity is significantly lower. It's impossible to know the exact rating of Pavel's truck without having all the details regarding the trim and options, but Ram's spec sheet shows the payload capacity for a similar dually as maxing out at 4,190 pounds.” ???

I once knew a know-it-all who purchased a brand new RAM 1500 crew cab short bed 4x4 expecting that it had the 13,000 lb. Tow capacity that he had seen in the TV ads. The voice-over says top in class tow capacity while showing exactly his truck towing a trailer. Quick cuts.

So he bought one to tow a 35 footer up through the Adirondacks. I told him a regular cab, big engine, long bed 4x2 is what they reference when quoting to numbers but he didnt want to hear me say it wasnt for the best.

After his first trip he came back and said he had had a white-knuckle drive and fairly soon went and got a New RAM 2500.

People who buy trucks need to understand payload, tow capacity a d weight distribution if they are going to seriously haul or tow. The guy selling the trailer sure as hell didnt care, and RAM had no idea what the guy intended to tow. But as others have said, the info is out there. Perhaps people who SELL trucks should be beholden to make these numbers clear before one is able to drive off the lot, I dont know

 

[Mike W.]

I believe it's a frame defect, not caused by general overloading. A frame doesn't fail by overloading per se, it's the bending moment. As rear heavy as that camper is, it's no where close to this:

1 ton chassis are designed to lift 3000 lbs 6' behind the rear axle, day in day out.

That's way more bending stress than a 6000 lbs camper with a CG slightly behind the rear axle.

All the weight is forward of the lift and the wrecker was designed to do this work. The weight is distributed proportional. There is no way of knowing how much weight was in the end of the camper behind the axles..What type of roads he was on or how the driver was driving. It's clear who ever loaded the ridiculous beast on the truck was at fault.

 

[AbleGuy]

Ultimately if you are stupid enough to think bigger is better Darwanism and Karma will collide.

Definitely a bad Twilight Zone-ish place to find yourself:

 

[retiredruralmailman]

Don't expect a RAM or SUPER DUTY to work when the application requires a PETERBUILT

 

[shortbus4x4]

Don't expect a RAM or SUPER DUTY to work when the application requires an INTERNATIONAL.

Fixed it for you. You almost had it right.

But yes, you are correct. It's better to have a bigger truck and not need it than a too small truck and break it from overloading it.

 

[AbleGuy]

And don’t expect to be able to drive that big rig ⬆ in California if it’s an older diesel burning truck (with weight >14,000 lbs).

And that big ER you own? Yeah, that not gonna fly in California any more either if it’s earlier than a 2010 model…

Own a 2010 or Older Big Rig or Bus In California? It's Now Banned

California is the first state banning all semi-trucks and buses made before 2010 starting January 1, 2023.

www.motorbiscuit.com

 

[lucilius]

And don’t expect to be able to drive that big rig ⬆ in California if it’s an older diesel burning truck (with weight >14,000 lbs).

And that big ER you own? Yeah, that not gonna fly in California any more either if it’s earlier than a 2010 model…

Own a 2010 or Older Big Rig or Bus In California? It's Now Banned

California is the first state banning all semi-trucks and buses made before 2010 starting January 1, 2023.

www.motorbiscuit.com

Any CA residents/others familiar with this rule? It appears to apply to CA truck&fleet owners with a truck(s) over 14k lbs that are older than 2011 model year? I foresee some extra space in the National Parks and other tourist locations if they enforce this on all campers traveling into CA.