Future Toyota 4x4s for the US Market
- Thread starter Joash
- Start date
Clutch
<---Pass
When is it going to be finished?
All and all the first gen Tacoma/Tundra isn't too bad for base platform to build upon, it doesn't take too much to make it a decent off roader. Can be had under $20K too, including mods if you do your homework. Maybe toss under a 80 front suspension, diesel engine, and beef up the rear portion of the frame, and call it done, still be pretty stealthy, wouldn't stick out like a FJ45/55...or even a 70 series. No worries about being swarmed at the gas stops by gawkers.
If you think about it, all of these vehicles mentioned aren't going to be vastly different, pretty much handle most off-road situations more or less the same....some just look cooler than others. I would have one of those ICON FJ's in heartbeat if I could afford it....of course with no ICON badges, and have them build it so it looks old and beat, but all modern underneath. Like what they did on this FJ45V.http://www.chromatographyonline.com/lcgc/article/articleDetail.jsp?id=395670
Last edited:
Clutch
<---Pass
Much more reliable too....my dad had 3 engines in his 1976 F250 (which he bought new) before it even reached 100,000 miles, and I snapped a rod in the last engine at 120K miles, sold it after that. And started buying Toyotas.
Modern vehicles are nicer to drive as well. Real evident when I jump from my '73 VW Westy to my Tacoma or our Trooper.
Last edited:
thedjjack
Dream it build it
Better for going to the mall...that is about it...
Fortunately for work I get to go where AAA will not come tow you... I take anything Pre-1996...
I can bump start my truck and drive home...no battery, no wires, just fuel...
Clutch
<---Pass
Better for going to the mall...that is about it...
Fortunately for work I get to go where AAA will not come tow you... I take anything Pre-1996...
I can bump start my truck and drive home...no battery, no wires, just fuel...
I also go to places AAA can't go, and actually I do not belong to AAA.
Can bump start my '99, and have...it has computers, no distributor, plenty of wires and sensors.
Today's vehicles are built better because most of the human element has been removed and
replaced by robots and computers, we don't have a bunch of drunkards slapping things together
anymore.
The engines are being manufactured with better tolerances, plus the computers can make those fine air/fuel mixture adjustments
to keep the engine alive longer, which is especially nice for us that live out West, I can go from sea level to 10,000 ft in a couple hours, without a hiccup. Going to sound like a broken record here, I have yet to have an electrical or computer problem with my Tacoma with 265,000 miles on the odo. Any failure that I have had, has been mechanical, like timing belt, CV boots (you would think after all this time, there would be a better designed CV boot), out of balanced drive shaft, which cause the 3rd member carrier bearings to fail, and that is about it, other than batteries dying. It is possible to make an Optima battery leak...Ha Ha.
I sure do like the look of old iron, I sure don't miss fiddling with it to get them down the road, don't miss setting points at all...
There are a couple things I do not like with the modern vehicles, but all and all they are leaps and bounds better.
thedjjack
Dream it build it
new stuff is over complicated on purpose and things like the headlights, bumpers, and airbags are only added so small accidents sell new cars or $$$$ parts.
Difference in motors would most likely be oil. I have seen motors like OM617 and Ford300 (industrial or light duty) go into the millions with noting done...aluminum heads and cast blocks make more power but expansion rates will limited life (3.0L Toyota, overheat a 22r) ...I would argue OIL is the biggest difference.
If I went gas I would have a simple fuel injector setup. My last 2 trucks: 1964 Jeep FC170 with trillium on deck and Om617 under seats and currently raised room DelicaL300 (early model with standard lights). Want a nice motor to go surf to snow in the mountains Turbo-Diesel.
new stuff is designed to fail...ball joints every 40,000km on work trucks please give me king pins again...sorry. over robot installed ball joints..
I am sure we will not agree, please enjoy your newer ride (99 not that new and manual truck transmissions are disappearing, thank you Toyota for still offering). Like I say I drive new pool trucks from all manufactures and they suck compared to just 5 years ago)....
Difference in motors would most likely be oil. I have seen motors like OM617 and Ford300 (industrial or light duty) go into the millions with noting done...aluminum heads and cast blocks make more power but expansion rates will limited life (3.0L Toyota, overheat a 22r) ...I would argue OIL is the biggest difference.
If I went gas I would have a simple fuel injector setup. My last 2 trucks: 1964 Jeep FC170 with trillium on deck and Om617 under seats and currently raised room DelicaL300 (early model with standard lights). Want a nice motor to go surf to snow in the mountains Turbo-Diesel.
new stuff is designed to fail...ball joints every 40,000km on work trucks please give me king pins again...sorry. over robot installed ball joints..
I am sure we will not agree, please enjoy your newer ride (99 not that new and manual truck transmissions are disappearing, thank you Toyota for still offering). Like I say I drive new pool trucks from all manufactures and they suck compared to just 5 years ago)....
Clutch
<---Pass
When I was in the construction business. All of our equipment was from the 70's and 80's...it was always breaking down. I rented a brand new mini-ex recently
damn, they are super nice...really like the "new" joystick controls...and the power, oh man the power...really blew me away.
Yeah, my biggest gripe is the disappearing manual trans, however I do not miss those long throw 4 speeds we had in our F250/350's...
I dunno, quite a few of my buddies have new diesel 3/4-1 tons....they are impressive, waaay powerful, quiet, sure beats the crap I used in the past.
damn, they are super nice...really like the "new" joystick controls...and the power, oh man the power...really blew me away.
Yeah, my biggest gripe is the disappearing manual trans, however I do not miss those long throw 4 speeds we had in our F250/350's...
I dunno, quite a few of my buddies have new diesel 3/4-1 tons....they are impressive, waaay powerful, quiet, sure beats the crap I used in the past.
Last edited:
Clutch
<---Pass
265K miles on mine
Yep I do not like dials either.
Walking away from an accident is good
Yeah never a fan of ABS
Oh, it is for loads, can't have the front of the vehicle nosing up skywards, bad for steering, not to mention blinds people at night with the vehicles headlights. If it started level then load it down, not good. My aftermarket springs has mine sitting a little higher, I keep some ballast in the back so it sits level for Daily Driving activities.
mine are still fine, and that is with 6 months of AZ heat out of the year, over the past 13 years.
Yeah that kinda sucks...I do not listen to the radio anyway, ipod, amp, and speakers is easy way to by pass it, plus if you keep it stock looking,
less chance of it getting stolen. How I have mine, I can replace the stock head-unit, but choose not to. Stealth is good.
That is BS I agree...there is a kit out there to fix that.
That can be by-passed, but limp mode may prevent severe damage.
Ideally I would like old iron body on a modern chassis, like what ICON is doing, but keep a couple things manually operated, like the tranny, hubs, and transfer case...I just can't afford an ICON. I may not like the styling of the FJCrusier, it is specced pretty nice tho', manny trans & transfer case, electric lockers, DI engine, rubber flooring....now only if they styled it a bit better. Or at least put that drivetrain in the Tacoma, I can rip out the carpet, and install manual hubs on my own.
I dunno, when my Tacoma was stock, it had no problem off road. Actually put some dude's highly modified 70's Blazer to shame at one of our rock crawling areas, he ate crow that day.
what are you driving anyway? a stock F250/350, Dodge 2500/3500 4X4 (even a puny Tacoma) should have very little problem.
Last edited:
Viggen
Just here...
Better for going to the mall...that is about it...
Yeah, sure. You keep thinking that.
cruiser guy
Explorer
I am chuckling a little about the debate of old vs. new. For the U.S. market the new vehicles may be better but this is an overlanding and expedition website where some of us get outside of the lower 48. Take you're shiny new computer controlled vehicle to a mechanic in Latin America and chances are it will "loose" come of it's computer control (Latin America is light years ahead of Africa). I've lived in Guatemala for five years and I've seen this repeatedly.
In an expedition setting where you will get off the beaten path and out of the lower 48 I think your best bet is a vehicle which is not computer controlled if possible. A mechanical injection diesel makes much more sense than a fuel injected gasoline engine.
Here in Sierra Leone we have a 2001 F350 with the 5.4l Triton V8. I'm sure it's a great vehicle for the Interstate but out here in the 2-3 years it has been here we've had the fuel tank out 3-4 times because the in tank fuel pump filter gets clogged (don't have one of those on the older vehicles, they put filters in serviceable locations back then) and it runs terrible when that happens since there is no fuel pressure. The fuel tank needs to come out again since the last time I drove it. We've had to replace one set of ball joints. One side of the wheel bearings (yes, the cute sealed unit ones) is going out. Front axle "U" joints on both sides. Brake pads all around. The best part is all the new parts have to come from the US or Canada because no one out here in Africa would ever consider buying one of these because of the fuel it sucks back. Yes, the OBDII is nice because it tells me what is wrong with it (most times, but not on the ABS system which now apparently also has a problem) but I'd rather have something where things don't go wrong! We've put on maybe 20,000 miles.
Folks may like driving the newer vehicle back home where the roads are all paved and the fuel is clean and mechanics have diagnostic computers but here in Africa and much of the rest of the developing world I'm MUCH happier in my 30 year old solid axle, manual tranny, computerless, dial less, push button less, diesel Land Cruiser. The ride is better, the vehicle is easier to service and needs service much less frequently, parts are much more readily available and it sips fuel compared to the Ford.
Lest folks with newer Land Cruisers get too smug, the local dealer routinely has a few '200 series trucks in that the mechanics out in the country have "fixed". Boy, can the local bush mechanic ever fix a '200 series, NOT!! Try finding the special synthetic engine oil for the new close tolerance engines, no SAE grade SA 30 weight is not good enough. It might be fine for my 30 year old Land Cruiser but not the new ones.
Having said all that, do I think we'll ever get a "back to basics" vehicle available new again anywhere? NO!! If you want one previous posters have said how to do it, make it or restore it yourself!
In an expedition setting where you will get off the beaten path and out of the lower 48 I think your best bet is a vehicle which is not computer controlled if possible. A mechanical injection diesel makes much more sense than a fuel injected gasoline engine.
Here in Sierra Leone we have a 2001 F350 with the 5.4l Triton V8. I'm sure it's a great vehicle for the Interstate but out here in the 2-3 years it has been here we've had the fuel tank out 3-4 times because the in tank fuel pump filter gets clogged (don't have one of those on the older vehicles, they put filters in serviceable locations back then) and it runs terrible when that happens since there is no fuel pressure. The fuel tank needs to come out again since the last time I drove it. We've had to replace one set of ball joints. One side of the wheel bearings (yes, the cute sealed unit ones) is going out. Front axle "U" joints on both sides. Brake pads all around. The best part is all the new parts have to come from the US or Canada because no one out here in Africa would ever consider buying one of these because of the fuel it sucks back. Yes, the OBDII is nice because it tells me what is wrong with it (most times, but not on the ABS system which now apparently also has a problem) but I'd rather have something where things don't go wrong! We've put on maybe 20,000 miles.
Folks may like driving the newer vehicle back home where the roads are all paved and the fuel is clean and mechanics have diagnostic computers but here in Africa and much of the rest of the developing world I'm MUCH happier in my 30 year old solid axle, manual tranny, computerless, dial less, push button less, diesel Land Cruiser. The ride is better, the vehicle is easier to service and needs service much less frequently, parts are much more readily available and it sips fuel compared to the Ford.
Lest folks with newer Land Cruisers get too smug, the local dealer routinely has a few '200 series trucks in that the mechanics out in the country have "fixed". Boy, can the local bush mechanic ever fix a '200 series, NOT!! Try finding the special synthetic engine oil for the new close tolerance engines, no SAE grade SA 30 weight is not good enough. It might be fine for my 30 year old Land Cruiser but not the new ones.
Having said all that, do I think we'll ever get a "back to basics" vehicle available new again anywhere? NO!! If you want one previous posters have said how to do it, make it or restore it yourself!
cruiser guy
Explorer
Yeah, sure. You keep thinking that.
I'd like to see just how offset that collision is and I'd like to see it from the other side. It's not a direct frontal crash. If it's set for the 2009 to miss the frame rails of the 1959, (remember the frame rails are probably 18" or more in from the side of the vehicle) then the '2009 will come out the winner otherwise I'd bet on the 1959. Crash tests are only a guesstimate anyways.
Viggen
Just here...
Bwahaha, yeah. Okay.