I suck at long term plans

[BIGdaddy]

So I talked to Melissa this weekend, and basically we both
think the Cherokee is a great truck and very comfy. This
is huge cuz she's big on comfort when driving. (after 3 kids, back trouble)

We decided that we want to fully upgrade the cherokee with
the best suspension we can buy, and do it once so that
we don't waste money.

I get a company bonus as a part of my benefits package, for
the first time in my life...lol. This happens in march. We thought
it'd be a good investment to use some of that to cover the cost.

This would give us all wheeling/camping season this fall/winter
to decide what the cherokee needs. We like the increased capacity
of the OME, but also dig XXXexpeditions use of a lift/33's and airbags
in the back to increase capacity.

She wants me to fully test it out this winter and drop the truck
off at a shop this coming march to have it done quickly and correctly with
a shop warranty, which is fine by me. I've done my share of suspensions and its something I'm fine never doing again..haha!

What's hard is being patient and keeping my mindset focused on having fun and gathering data this winter to make an educated decision.

I'll probably add bolt-ons this season like a full length roof rack and a winch bumper/winch mount to support our travels, so I'll have to be content with that amount of bolt-on wrenching..haha.

p.s. I'll likely go with a kit from DPG so I get the best of each companies parts, and pay less to have it shipped from one source, to my mechanic.

-Brian

p.s. I think I forget sometimes that I'm so blessed with a great job and time to enjoy my family. Setting a date to get this done, even if it is the future, DOES actually help me not forget to enjoy the now, and focus on my priorities. God is good!

 

[Root Moose]

Yep, a good employer is great to have.

So what are you thinking about in terms of suspension? I'm guessing DPGs 5" Hybrid...

To me ride quality is paramount. The geometry makes the ride. Springs and dampers are tuning.

I like the drop brackets that Rubicon Express makes.

I like long arms. If I had my time over again I'd take a real long hard look at Full-Traction and Clayton setups. I like the TNT well enough but there is something more bling about a four link setup that attracts me. That said, I picked up a rusted out XJ with another TNT kit on it a few weeks ago and just picked up a rust free Colorado MJ yesterday (was brought here to Ontario by current owner). See where I'm going? There is enough TNT stuff out there that lifts seem to come up used occasionally.

I'm not a fan of three links - especially on an overlanding style vehicle. ON a rock buggy, go nuts - it's really doesn't matter. LOL

 

[BIGdaddy]

haha...this is why I'm going to let a shop do it.

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=31528

17 year old stock suspension. Good thing is that it lived in AZ and CA its whole life. No rust whatsoever.

Yeah, not sure on the lift yet. I like DPG's prices and how they lay out exactly what comes with the kit. They have a good rep, too, so I'd like
to support them.

 

[Root Moose]

I've bought from Dirk (5" Hybrid). It was a "thumbs up" experience.

 

[BIGdaddy]

I've bought from Dirk (5" Hybrid). It was a "thumbs up" experience.

excellent. thats the resounding noise I hear about his outfit.

remind me what tires you choose to run?

 

[Momrocks]

I also went with Dirk at DPG for my 3" OME. He put together a pretty good deal on shocks, springs, quicker discos and JKS adjustable track bar. I was fortunante to already have a set of RE adj LCAs or I'd have picked them up through him too. Very knowlegable on OME Jeep products, nice guy to deal with. If I was a hardcore I wouldn't hesitate to get the 5" hybrid from DPG like RootMoose but the 3" heavy is fine for my mall expeditions.

 

[BIGdaddy]

I also went with Dirk at DPG for my 3" OME. He put together a pretty good deal on shocks, springs, quicker discos and JKS adjustable track bar. I was fortunante to already have a set of RE adj LCAs or I'd have picked them up through him too. Very knowlegable on OME Jeep products, nice guy to deal with. If I was a hardcore I wouldn't hesitate to get the 5" hybrid from DPG like RootMoose but the 3" heavy is fine for my mall expeditions.

what would you say is needed if I went with the 5" kit. Definitely sye kit and CV rear shaft?

what about the 3"? I'd really like to run a front d-shaft in the rear to keep my spares kit as small as possible, but I also, again, don't want to suffer inchitis, and do my lift twice. (I value my marriage..haha)

 

[Root Moose]

remind me what tires you choose to run?

Ugh, don't remind me. Truxus MTs. Pick something else, anything else.

I'm happy with the size (265/75R16) but these f-ing things are stupid heavy and won't balance worth a damn.

Adam is effectively running my hybrid lift now but with 6" springs. He just got the beast on the road the last week or so. He is really happy with the ride quality. He is using BFG 33x12.5 MTs

Iron Rock Off-Road sells a fairly cheap SYE and shaft setup. Adam had problems with it because of the NV242 case in his Jeep but he sourced a local 5 speed front prop shaft and is running that setup now. The IRO setup is only good for NV231 Jeeps (I think - PM Adam for the details).

 

[AFSOC]

SYE for 5" is a must. I have been happy with a 3" lift on my DD on 245s. Inchitis is a real affliction, many suffer from it. With an XJ it's a fairly easy itch to scratch as long as you have a solid foundation. Coil spacers and extended shackles will take you from 31" tires to 33s as long as you have a proper full leaf pack 3ish inch suspension and an adjustable track bar to start with.

The desire to go from 3" to 5" is usually driven by desire for taller tires. This is the territory where you start to spend real money. Steering becomes max'd, gearing should be changed to salvage performance, geometry requires corrective measure and some body trimming to make room. You will also see diminished braking performance. Pitching those 31s in favor of 33s is a pretty expensive one inch of differential clearance. That said, inchitis is highly contagious. Unless preventive measures are taken, you could be victimized by it too.

 

[Root Moose]

Oh, on the tire thing... I'm not 100% set on what I'm going to do for rubber for a long distance travel setup. Thinking about Toyo MTs because of the discount I get.

Those Goodyear Duratechs that were posted earlier are intriguing.

There's always BFG ATs but I want to try something different. They kinda suck for the wheeling that is around here too. It's too wet and sticky and they don't clear.

 

[Root Moose]

SYE for 5" is a must. I have been happy with a 3" lift on my DD on 245s. Inchitis is a real affliction, many suffer from it. With an XJ it's a fairly easy itch to scratch as long as you have a solid foundation. Coil spacers and extended shackles will take you from 31" tires to 33s as long as you have a proper full leaf pack 3ish inch suspension and an adjustable track bar to start with.

The desire to go from 3" to 5" is usually driven by desire for taller tires. This is the territory where you start to spend real money. Steering becomes max'd, gearing should be changed to salvage performance, geometry requires corrective measure and some body trimming to make room. You will also see diminished braking performance. Pitching those 31s in favor of 33s is a pretty expensive one inch of differential clearance. That said, inchitis is highly contagious. Unless preventive measures are taken, you could be victimized by it too.

Quoted for truth on all counts.

FWIW, I'm happy with my setup.

Ad's truck is bigger than mine and I like in on a "reptilian brain stem" kind of level but my truck has that "military contractor" look to it that I really like.

I'm content at 5" and can't see the need to go bigger given the way I intend to use the Jeep. Even in spite of the deep spring time water we get around here.

 

[Purple People Eater]

Just FYI, OME parts are on way backorder for XJ's. I ordered my parts in July and they just got off the boat in Washington yesterday. Maybe I'll get my suspension next week. OME is the way to go, but order early!

 

[adambro]

Quoted for truth on all counts.

FWIW, I'm happy with my setup.

Ad's truck is bigger than mine and I like in on a "reptilian brain stem" kind of level but my truck has that "military contractor" look to it that I really like.

I'm content at 5" and can't see the need to go bigger given the way I intend to use the Jeep. Even in spite of the deep spring time water we get around here.

Yup - mine is big...one of those back it out of the garage and say "holy :yikes:" moments.

Some of the details with mine:

- basically the 5.5" Rubicon Express lift
- drop brackets and support braces, with fixed arms
- 5.5" front coils
- 4.5" rear leaves with Rubicon Express shackles
- NV242 transfer case
- rear Dana44 from an '87 XJ
- Iron Rock SYE

The SYE kit comes with a yoke to "hack 'n' tap" onto the output shaft and a refurbished XJ front driveshaft. As Chris mentioned, the front driveshaft came with the kit was too long for me. It was from a 4.0L with auto. Because I have a NV242 (output is longer than a NV231) and a D44 (pinion longer than a D35), the distance between the t-case and pinion was shorter.

I did some investigation and discovered a front driveshaft from an XJ with a 5spd manual transmission (with 4.0L) was the correct length. Since the 5spd manual is shorter than the auto, the t-case ends up closer to the front axle, so a shorter front shaft is required.

It's not as good as having one spare driveshaft for both ends, but I will be able to use/source stock spares as required.

As for the ride quality of the drop brackets...I've very impressed: Stock feel and highway bumps are soaked up nicely. My truck is much higher than I expected, must be ~7" currently. I'm hoping this will settle at least an inch or so.

Cheers,
Adam

 

[ExpoMike]

Yup - mine is big...one of those back it out of the garage and say "holy :yikes:" moments.

Some of the details with mine:

- basically the 5.5" Rubicon Express lift
- drop brackets and support braces, with fixed arms
- 5.5" front coils
- 4.5" rear leaves with Rubicon Express shackles
- NV242 transfer case
- rear Dana44 from an '87 XJ
- Iron Rock SYE

The SYE kit comes with a yoke to "hack 'n' tap" onto the output shaft and a refurbished XJ front driveshaft. As Chris mentioned, the front driveshaft came with the kit was too long for me. It was from a 4.0L with auto. Because I have a NV242 (output is longer than a NV231) and a D44 (pinion longer than a D35), the distance between the t-case and pinion was shorter.

I did some investigation and discovered a front driveshaft from an XJ with a 5spd manual transmission (with 4.0L) was the correct length. Since the 5spd manual is shorter than the auto, the t-case ends up closer to the front axle, so a shorter front shaft is required.

It's not as good as having one spare driveshaft for both ends, but I will be able to use/source stock spares as required.

As for the ride quality of the drop brackets...I've very impressed: Stock feel and highway bumps are soaked up nicely. My truck is much higher than I expected, much be ~7" currently. I'm hoping this will settle at least an inch or so.

Cheers,
Adam

Yep, there is the exact reason I would not go with RE or most other lift companies. They seem to end up much higher then advertised. If I get a 5.5" lift, I want a 5.5" lift, not a 7" that "might" settle in years. I like the OME stuff because you typically get what is advertised. The higher you go (even if you thought you bought a lower lift), the more problems and issues you will run into.

As for the SYE, if you have a 231 case, it makes NO sense to go hack 'n tap. They are a bandaid fix and doesn't increase the strength of the output shaft. PORC and others have gotten the prices down below $200. If you have a 242, then you are basically stuck with either the Tom Woods SYE or HnT setup. Though the Tom Woods setup is really the way to go, they do cost much more than what you can get for a 231 case.

As for lift, personally, unless you are planning rock crawling, 3" on 31" tires really is a good setup. It keep the CG low, climb in height reasonable (Lisa can just get into it without too much problems. Higher and it would be a problem). With some rocker and transfer case protection, it will get you 90% of the places you most likely will want to go. Proper line selection is really more important as I have seen stock rigs get to places I would never imagine but it was all the driver.

When you start getting into 4.5"+ lifts and 33"+ tires, you will start finding the week points. Steering issues (and wearing out much quicker), gearing, higher CG and climb in issues, fender clearance, axle failures, etc., etc. If you don't mind wrenching on your rig a lot, these issues become less but if you rely on it to get you to and from work and weekend wheeling duties, you are asking for a lot of issues and will become very frustrated and poor because of it.

Here are a couple videos (none with our XJ but some in XJ footage ) but we went the same places they did. In the dropoff video, we took the line the second XJ did.

The Squeeze http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ueUchT7Uids

Diablo Dropoff http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DBal1at-B3E

Unless you are planning more extreme wheeling than this, 3" on 31"s will get you any place you want to go.

That's my .02 worth.

 

[Root Moose]

My truck is much higher than I expected, much be ~7" currently. I'm hoping this will settle at least an inch or so.

I figure you'll lose at least an inch by the time you add your armour and kit in the rear.