Looking for a Jeep Wrangler

[BIGdaddy]

oh, and it should be said, that the difference in ride quality between a TJ and an LJ is remarkable.

TJ = covered wagon ---simple, stout, rugged, bouncy

LJ =cadillac. ---velvety smooth, stable in turns, a bit squishy when loaded.


Old man emu solves all problems though. makes both very nice, and adds a ton of cargo-carrying ability to both.


last thing

soft top = ability to go topless, yet very, very noisy, lets weather in

hard top = protection from elements, nice and quiet, adds a lot of weight.

i picked a hard top cuz we're not the topless kind...though i'm still considering cutting side panel openings and making a hybrid hard/soft top...not sure if i'm ready to let the noise/weather in, though!

 

[SeaRubi]

child, dog, swmbo - it all adds up, in a hurry! Even the LJ was a little cramped for all of us. Without the dog it was very reasonable, but adding in 75lbs of animal pretty much blew out any storage space.

LJ with seat folded up:

 

[Haggis]

soft top = ability to go topless, yet very, very noisy, lets weather in

hard top = protection from elements, nice and quiet, adds a lot of weight.

i picked a hard top cuz we're not the topless kind...though i'm still considering cutting side panel openings and making a hybrid hard/soft top...not sure if i'm ready to let the noise/weather in, though!

I just switched from the softtop to a hardtop, because I use my LJ as my daily driver and getting tools and buckets of stain and such out of the rear softtop panel was a a pain in the batuccuss. especially during the winter when the salt encrustes the rear zippers.

I've seen no difference in handling or gas mileage as far as the weight of the hardtop. Really the hardtop doesn't way more than a ten year old so I think the weight is a non issue.

Other benefits of the hardtop that folks in the SW and West coast might not have considered:
*Being able to brush the snow of the windows without scratching them.
*No window scratches as you have trees hugging your vehicle on a forested trail.
*Again during the winter months being able to use the automatic carwash to wash off the salt . Not a good idea in a soft top.

 

[nwoods]

Graham, not sure what you meant by "...just the 4.1 transfer case would likely make the whole vehicle less useful to me than the other goodies put together would improve it."

Around here, for the kind of SoCal wheeling, it seems about perfect, unless you are planning on heading to Barstow and doing the JeepSpeed sort of thing, wide open full throttle through the whoops.

As we are neighbors now, I'll let you drive my 05 Rubicon LJ on the trail next month (per my email to you), and you can decide if that transfer box ratio is right for you or not.

 

[grahamfitter]

Graham, not sure what you meant by "...just the 4.1 transfer case would likely make the whole vehicle less useful to me than the other goodies put together would improve it."

Around here, for the kind of SoCal wheeling, it seems about perfect, unless you are planning on heading to Barstow and doing the JeepSpeed sort of thing, wide open full throttle through the whoops.

As we are neighbors now, I'll let you drive my 05 Rubicon LJ on the trail next month (per my email to you), and you can decide if that transfer box ratio is right for you or not.

Mostly it means that being able to get up a reasonable speed in 4-low has been handy to get up some speed after outrunning whatever sludge was chasing me. If I had to find 4-hi at walking pace there's a good chance the sludge would laugh while sucking me back in.

Note other than getting stuck on the bottom of the transfer case, I haven't found the limitations of my current TJ with 31 inch tires and no lift so I'm not exactly the most adventurous/knowledgeable/experienced/etc driver in the Northeast. Paraphrased: I don't know what I don't know so I appreciate all words of wisdom that come my way.

On the topic of not knowing what I don't know but carrying on anyway, if my stock TJ can just about squeeze over something, an LJ with the same clearance probably won't fare as well. So intuitively, to go the same places, an unlimited will need more spent on it.

Having said all that, I'm going to get thoroughly schooled by Nathan (who's email has got lost in the ether) and will probably end up with a wish list of expensive things I never knew existed.

The only universal truth I know is this: It will end in beers

Cheers,
Graham

 

[CA-RJ]

The wife and I talked about the hard top vs. soft top issue. I had a hard top on my 99 TJ and it was a pain to get the hard top off. I always needed a second person to get the darned thing off. Weather isn't really a concern here in southern California so having the convenience of taking the top down or unzipping the side and rear windows is really nice.

There has been mention that the TJ will offroad better than a LJ in stock form. I don't really see it as an issue. For me and Old Man Emu lift and a set of 32's and a rear ARB will take me everywhere I want to go.

 

[nwoods]

Mostly it means that being able to get up a reasonable speed in 4-low has been handy to get up some speed after outrunning whatever sludge was chasing me. If I had to find 4-hi at walking pace there's a good chance the sludge would laugh while sucking me back in.

Note other than getting stuck on the bottom of the transfer case, I haven't found the limitations of my current TJ with 31 inch tires and no lift so I'm not exactly the most adventurous/knowledgeable/experienced/etc driver in the Northeast. Paraphrased: I don't know what I don't know so I appreciate all words of wisdom that come my way.

LOL, sludge, as in... mud? Never heard of it man. Doesn't exist around here. Now rocks, we got plenty of. Big ones, little ones, sharp ones, smooth ones, but make no mistake there are rocks and there is bone dry dust, but nary a trace of mud on the vast majority of trails here in SoCal.

I'll send that email.

Cheers,

NW

 

[BIGdaddy]

The wife and I talked about the hard top vs. soft top issue. I had a hard top on my 99 TJ and it was a pain to get the hard top off. I always needed a second person to get the darned thing off. Weather isn't really a concern here in southern California so having the convenience of taking the top down or unzipping the side and rear windows is really nice.

There has been mention that the TJ will offroad better than a LJ in stock form.

I said that...

I don't really see it as an issue. For me and Old Man Emu lift and a set of 32's and a rear ARB will take me everywhere I want to go.and then i said that...

you said what i said, amigo...lol.

 

[bmonday]

There has been mention that the TJ will offroad better than a LJ in stock form.

Not sure why anyone thinks that. It's pretty much an accepted truth in the Jeeping community that the extra wheelbase of the LJ outperforms the TJ in nearly every scenario. Owners with sufficient cash actually stretch the wheelbase of their TJs to gain the same advantage.

You start off with better axles in the LJ versus what you often find in TJs too.

 

[BIGdaddy]

Not sure why anyone thinks that. It's pretty much an accepted truth in the Jeeping community that the extra wheelbase of the LJ outperforms the TJ in nearly every scenario. Owners with sufficient cash actually stretch the wheelbase of their TJs to gain the same advantage.

You start off with better axles in the LJ versus what you often find in TJs too.

the only thing that the tj has on the LJ (which i mentioned earlier) is the breakover angle.

being at basically the same ride height, and being 6-8 inches longer in the wheelbase, is a detriment.

to which i posted, that one could do a 1" body lift, motor mount lift, install a high clearance skid plate and run 31's-32's, and totally mitigate that issue.

i'm going to go one step further and add a 2" OME lift or spacer lift, just cuz it doesn't hurt anything at all to do so. (and the fact that the OME setup will handle the loads i saddle my LJ with)

 

[TCM]

After owning two short wheelbase TJs, a 97 and a 03 Rubicon, I purchased an 06 Rubicon Unlimited in April. The difference in ride quality is remarkable, a much smoother ride with vastly improved stability. It is also much more quiet than a TJ in that it has much more sound deadening material under the carpet and behind the firewall. As for size, while 15" of extra length does not sound like much the increase in usable storage space seems more like 30". The space behind the rear seat of a TJ is well, mostly non-existent, but with the Unlimited I can easily pack the full allotment of gear for my family of three with room to spare. Yes I am a frugal packer from my days in the TJ, but unless you plan to pack a full gourmet kitchen it is more than enough. The question of Rubicon or non-rubicon, it really depends on whether you drive in the rocks or in mud. In rocks the 4:1 transfer case of the Rubicon is ideal. In mud it definitely produces gearing that is too low. My travels never involve mud and I much prefer having the control that 4:1 provides in the rocks. I also highly recommend an Old Man Emu suspension setup for the Unlimited. I run the OME suspension with 255/85R16 tires. It is a big improvement over stock and provides plenty of clearance for anything short of full on rock crawling. The only real down side to the TJ Unlimited is cumbersome entry and egress for the back seat. I love the look of two doors, but no one can deny that four doors are better for rear passengers, especially children that require assistance. I almost bought a new 4 door JK for this reason, but I found the TJ Unlimited for $20k with 11,000 miles (highway only) on the odometer and could not pass it up. Oh, and for mileage I get 17 mpg on the highway if averaging 65 mph. On the trail this can drop to 10 mpg (ouch) with deflated tires at 18psi and aggressive driving. With inflated tires at 36 psi and conservative driving it is around 13-14 mpg off road.

 

[CA-RJ]

So I've narrowed my choices down to two--

2006 Unlimited, Auto, 17k miles for $17

2005 Unlimited Rubicon, 2k miles for $20k

I'm really having a hard time here. I've never used a 4:1 T-case and am wondering what it would be like with the auto. I don't do mud, but the idea of going to Glamis once in a while leaves me wondering if the 4:1 will really hurt me. I like that the Rubicon has the lockers and MT/R's already too. In the end, it's really about the 4:1. I'm not sure that I want/need it.

Any more advice?

 

[BIGdaddy]

wow, 2 thousand miles, huh?...lol. definitely get THAT one.

i assume 12 thousand miles? or 20 thousand?


i think that if i could go back, i'd probably choose a rubicon...though i am perfectly content with my regular LJ...

I like the idea that all the parts that i have added/will add on my own, would be covered under warranty if i had a rubicon.

I'm at the point in my life, just in the last few year, where I like having a professional do the job ONCE and have it be done right.

in the case of the rubicon, the shop was JEEP, and the workers we're engineers way smarter than i am. They're pretty good at making things work right.

probably doesn't help any.

 

[CA-RJ]

No it shows 1499 on the odo. Crazy huh? I'm thinking pretty hard about it. It's practically brand new!

 

[nwoods]

Rubicon would be my vote. The more I read about mine, the more things seem different, upgraded, better, etc.. on the Rubicon than the other models. Seems like every off road upgrade will say something like, "needs sye adaptor * Except Rubicon models" or words to that effect.

There are LOTS of little differences. Most of which I am still ignorant of, but I keep reading....