Looking for suggestions on front or back or both lockers

[atm76039]

Hey guys, this is my first thread, I’ve had a few post here and there, but I guess this is my official “Hello!”

I have a 2002 TJ 4.0 5speed, d44 rear, Currie lift with 3” AEV springs, 33x12.5 goodyear Kevlar’s. I’ll be re-gearing soon from 3.75 to 4.10 (although still on the fence about 4.56).

I’m not a rock crawler and “try” to avoid mud, mostly riding trails and backroads to explore, but I like to be prepared for anything reasonable that might get tough. I have a nice set of recovery gear, winch – straps – shackles – etc and know how to use them. I could probably get by without lockers, but I’m thinking if I’m re-gearing, it’s a good time to install them. I’m not made of money, but this is within my budget.

My question:
My plan was to add front and back Eaton E-Lockers when re-gearing, but I’m not sure I need them both. If you had to pick front OR back, which would you pick and why? (I’m looking at the Eaton E-Lockers, so they are selectable without having to maintaining air lines.)

Thanks!

Andy

 

[Mr. Leary]

My opinion is that the rear locker is much more important, and the one you should pick if you were to get only one.

A thread about it:

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=34562

 

[PolarXJ]

I'd say the rear as well. Though if you can, I'd do both. So you don't have to pay for the axle set up again down the road. The Eaton locker is a great locker, I'm running it in my rear D44 and plan on putting a Eaton in a front D44 as soon as I cut it down to fit my XJ.

 

[Black Dog]

Any locker is better than no lockers at all.

 

[Metcalf]

I'm going to go against the grain and say front locker Especially if the D44 rear has the trac-lock. If you can, do both ends.

Some things to think about....

-A locked rear and open front CAN have a bad tendency to let your rear end slide sideways since the front axle is not doing its share of the work. We see this A LOT on our snow trips. Even if you have a rear locker, it works really well a lot of times to keep the rear unlocked when trying a slick sidehill.

-When your climbing, a lot of the weight transfers to the rear. Sometimes this helps keep the rear end keep traction more than the front. I have seen a LOT of situations where the front unloads and spins one tire when open. A front locker can help solve this issue and give you some front end control.

-In snow ( and other loose surfaces ) you can lock the front and leave the rear open to allow the vehicle to drag the front end around quicker. Its a way to cheat and do a sudo-front dig. Very handy sometimes.


-The front end is weaker than the rear, but with a decent driver and responsible use the TJ D30 front holds up really well, even with a locker.

Just some thoughts....

 

[atm76039]

My opinion is that the rear locker is much more important, and the one you should pick if you were to get only one.

A thread about it:

http://www.expeditionportal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=34562

That is a good thread. Exactly what I was looking for but was searching in the wrong place.

Thanks for the input guys!

 

[Robert Bills]

I have heard many good things about the Eaton, and watched it perform. Based upon your intended use it should be a good choice.

If you can lock only one axle, lock the rear.

Lockers on steering axles often make it very difficult to turn, which adds tremendous stress to your steering system and to your axles and axle u-joints. Sometimes you will be required to disengage the front locker to maneuver around or through an obstacle, or if not a "switchable" locker, disengage one or both front hubs (if so equipped) or disengage the front axle entirely. Also, the D30 front axle is more prone to failure if locked without also upgrading the axle shafts, u-joints, etc.

I currently use a Detroit Locker (rear) and Lock-Right (front) in my CJ-7. Both axle assemblies have upgraded chromoly axles, and my D30 uses oversize u-joints and hubs from a 1-ton jeep truck. [IMO, the D30 axle is a trail repair waiting to happen if locked without upgrading the axles and u-joints.]

In my experience, which does include a lot of rockcrawling, I can handle about 75% of what I encounter in 2WD with the Detroit in the rear axle. When I am required to use 4WD, I sometimes must disengage one front hub to maintain steering in the tight stuff, which effectively gives me the same "3-wheel-drive" I would have had if I ran in 4WD without having the locker in the front.

All that being said, if you live in the snow belt you will find definite advantages to having switchable lockers in both axles.

 

[Piet]

If you can only afford to lock one, put a selectable locker for the rear.
Put something cheap up front if you want.. like a lunchbox locker. (Automatic locker).

 

[Maximus Ram]

If you can afford it, get both. Less cost now than deciding later.
But if only one now, I would probably say front. If you have a LSD in now, go with the front. LSD is good on the street and the front locker would be helpful off road.

 

[getlost4x4]

rear axle. its usually stronger then the front, and it makes it much easier to steer.

 

[alosix]

If you can afford it, get both. Less cost now than deciding later.
But if only one now, I would probably say front. If you have a LSD in now, go with the front. LSD is good on the street and the front locker would be helpful off road.

I ran this combination for very long time with good success. Front locked via rubi D44, rear lsd in the 8.8, 33s and 4.10s.

I think there was only 1 climb where it felt like it really needed the rear to be locked, but.. I wouldn't have gotten as far up as I did without the front being locked. There's also the fact that i probably could have bumped it up the ledge and gotten it up the rest of the trail. Its called Pucker for a reason though, and staring at the hood of my friends rubi left on the side of the trail from rolling down it sideways wasn't helping the nerve to bump it

Do both if you can, really no reason not to. i'm running an eaton in the rear now and really like it. The one thing you do have to watch with some of the eatons is that they take about a 1/2 of revolution to lock and about the same when switching directions. So, if you want it to have a nice long life, be easy on it changing directions or when just locking it.

They are A TON easier to install than an arb though. Not just the outside airline either. The inside of the diff just needs a short wire run and a hole drilled. No bending the copper tube just right to stay out of trouble, no drilling the bearing cap for the line, no tapping the pumping. That said, once locked you can probably beat on an arb a little more.

 

[mbuckner]

Hey guys, this is my first thread, I’ve had a few post here and there, but I guess this is my official “Hello!”

I have a 2002 TJ 4.0 5speed, d44 rear, Currie lift with 3” AEV springs, 33x12.5 goodyear Kevlar’s. I’ll be re-gearing soon from 3.75 to 4.10 (although still on the fence about 4.56).

I’m not a rock crawler and “try” to avoid mud, mostly riding trails and backroads to explore, but I like to be prepared for anything reasonable that might get tough. I have a nice set of recovery gear, winch – straps – shackles – etc and know how to use them. I could probably get by without lockers, but I’m thinking if I’m re-gearing, it’s a good time to install them. I’m not made of money, but this is within my budget.

My question:
My plan was to add front and back Eaton E-Lockers when re-gearing, but I’m not sure I need them both. If you had to pick front OR back, which would you pick and why? (I’m looking at the Eaton E-Lockers, so they are selectable without having to maintaining air lines.)

Thanks!

Andy

I can speak only from experience:

I have a 2001 TJ, w/3spd auto, 4.56 gears... front and rear diff
have a Detroit TruTrac LSD (poor man's locker) .... were installed in 2002

Done the Rubicon, Moab, Morrison Jeep trail and numerous other trails
in Arizona .....

No pushing buttons, no clutch packs, no special oil, etc .....

You may want to check them out .... it sounds like you do the
same type of wheeling I do .....

Good luck .....

 

[JPK]

I would vote front e-locker first and a relatively cheap non-selective locker for the rear.

In my experience the rear takes care of itself for the most part, its the front end you need to count on having some grab.

Lock the front only as long as you need to.

Here are a couple of examples of why I think front lockers fist:
1. Tires stuck in tire or errosion ruts - need the fronts to climb out, no amount of rear traction is going to help.
2. Slick trail - rear locked leads to rear slide with the front, ie steering, having little influence on which way your pointing or traveling, front locked leads to dragging the rear around, as someone already mentioned. Not too much stress on the front end since the slick road allows for slippage of one of the fronts.
3. Mud. You don't like it, neither do I though I used to enjoy playing in it 30 years ago... To steer in mud requires both tires in the front to spin, or the one spinning can't drag the other along. With just the rears locked you will be pushing your Jeep through the mud rather than pulling it. And if your fronts are turned you'll be pushing the tires sideways. Great way to get stuck or damage the front end.
4. Snow as mentioned previously. With the front locked you can power steer and drag the rear around. With the rears locked you may end up pushing the front end through the turn with the front tires sideways, not actually making the turn.

Go with the 4.56's. I have an LJ Rubicon auto with 33's and 4.10's and if it wasn't a "spare" Jeep since I have a JK it would be re-geared to at least 4.56, maybe 4.88's. The auto O/D is steeper than the manual but 4.10's and 33's isn't enough for either, imo. As far as off road, 4.10's would be fine for 4H. I have the 4:1 Xfer case so no comparable info on 4L.

JPK

 

[vaulter09]

Put your first locker in the rear. The D44 is stronger and will not break as easily since the ring and pinion will be significantly larger.

Don't worry about maintaining airlines. It seriously is not an issue. ARB Lockers are the best available on the market. If you are going to make the step, do it right. Go with a cheap option, and you will regret it. E-lockers and lunchboxes sacrifice strength and drivability, respectfully.

There is a reason why ARBs are the most trusted and sought after. Maintaining airline is a non-issue. And the lockers do not leak if installed properly.

Watch this video if you do not understand how lockers will help you.

 

[dp7197]

I'd say the rear as well. Though if you can, I'd do both. So you don't have to pay for the axle set up again down the road. The Eaton locker is a great locker, I'm running it in my rear D44 and plan on putting a Eaton in a front D44 as soon as I cut it down to fit my XJ.

Good advice. I can't remember where the gear "split" is for a Dana 30, but I believe 4.10s and lower will not require a new carrier and gears lower would require a new carrier. Dana 44s have the split ending at 3.73s, so 4.10s would require a new carrier (it has been 20 years since I went through this so please correct me if I am wrong). So you would put the locker in the rear if only doing one and going with 4.10s.

If you go with 4.56s you would change both carriers and I would just get the Eatons for both and be done with it.