Moab on 31's?

[K2ZJ]

Is this a consideration solely for one trip to Moab? What type of wheeling do you do/plan to do in SC?

I just got back from Moab on Sunday. This year was the first time I had 33s, I have run 31s for 10 years there (once with 32" Super Swampers). You can do a lot more and easier with 33s than with 31s. Can you do a lot of Moab with 31s? Yes, but 33s add more options, and make other runs nicer. You can take the hard line or an easy line on most obstacles there, but with 31s many easy lines are the hard lines for 31s. I noticed a huge difference between 31s and 33s.

For the tires, I found a set of 33 MT/R Kevlars and I love them! They did awesome in Moab. I will also NEVER EVER EVER NEVER buy another set of BFG A/ts. I hated them. I loved my BFG M/Ts but the A/Ts were crap. They sucked in snow and were just slightly better than the M/Ts for snow which everyone said they would be crappy. I wheeled them (both at and mt old style) in Moab as well as Colorado and the road noise from the M/T over the A/T was well worth the improved performance. My list for tires would be Duratracs, MT/R Kevlars, and BFG M/Ts. I love rock crawling and since my Jeep is modded I dont mind the added road noise.

 

[Brandon Libby]

I have spent several thousand dollars getting from that first stage to this point, and I'm really not recouping that huge expense with increased enjoyment.
So in short, I really wish I would have just stayed with 31's and saved a LOT of money over the years, plus my Jeep was out of commission for almost 3 years when I did the larger lift myself in my garage and had a couple of different shops do other work on it as well.

This is my concern as well. I can't justify spending the money to properly take it to the next level. I didn't build this rig, so I have to make changes that reflect my needs. I love the looks of the 35's that I have on it now, but there are many things to consider when running any tire over 33's. I don't have any interest in performing the required modifications to achieve this...yet. If I decide to go bigger, I will swap in full size axles. Until I reach that point, I would like to keep it simple in order to reduce the stress on the remaining stock components. Last weekend, the upper control arm mount, on the passenger side of the axle, ripped off. I believe this is due to added stress from the increased articulation that the long arms allow in combination with the 35's. This is an example of the types breakages that can be avoided by installing the correct parts for each upgrade.

Also specifically on the tires - the BFG's "may" get you a bit more life, but the Duratracs are going to give you better grip in every condition compared to the BF's.

The biggest concern I have with the Duratracs is the ambiguity regarding tire wear and road noise. Noise appears to have become "subjective" as reviews are based on the tire customer's opinion of what is acceptable. I have read a ton of contradicting reviews. Some say that the road noise is acceptable for the type of tire, others say they are dead quiet. Some say they are quieter than BFG T/A KOs, others say they are much louder. I found the same types of answers regarding tire wear as well. Some say that they got 40k out of a new set, others said that they got about half that. I wish there was an independent testing company that would provide this info. Though, this guy does a pretty good review. I like that he actually drives down the road to allow the audience to experience how quiet they are. Of course, this is when they are brand new. Who knows, once they have 20k or so on them.

Is this a consideration solely for one trip to Moab? What type of wheeling do you do/plan to do in SC?

I just got back from Moab on Sunday. This year was the first time I had 33s, I have run 31s for 10 years there (once with 32" Super Swampers). You can do a lot more and easier with 33s than with 31s. Can you do a lot of Moab with 31s? Yes, but 33s add more options, and make other runs nicer. You can take the hard line or an easy line on most obstacles there, but with 31s many easy lines are the hard lines for 31s. I noticed a huge difference between 31s and 33s.

For the tires, I found a set of 33 MT/R Kevlars and I love them! They did awesome in Moab. I will also NEVER EVER EVER NEVER buy another set of BFG A/ts. I hated them. I loved my BFG M/Ts but the A/Ts were crap. They sucked in snow and were just slightly better than the M/Ts for snow which everyone said they would be crappy. I wheeled them (both at and mt old style) in Moab as well as Colorado and the road noise from the M/T over the A/T was well worth the improved performance. My list for tires would be Duratracs, MT/R Kevlars, and BFG M/Ts. I love rock crawling and since my Jeep is modded I dont mind the added road noise.

The terrain here in SC mostly consists of rocks and mud. And, the Outer Banks, of course, provides a sandy retreat. Excursions to these places are the extent of what I want. I don't plan on climbing giant scary boulders with my DD. :^)

I do want 33's, but as I said, axle shafts and gears are not in the budget. If I go bigger than 31's (anything >33's) I will most likely go with full size axles. But, this is years away. First I have to graduate from college, and tackle these loans. :^)

How loud are your BFG MT's, and what kind of wear are you getting out of them? My wife won't go wheeling anymore if my tires are too loud. I can't blame her either, I'm not a big fan of shouting over my worn out Baja Claws. They are so loud that I don't enjoy driving the XJ on trips longer than 45 minutes or so.

I guess I should specify what I consider good tire wear. I think that rotating 5 tires should yield a bare minimum of 40k miles. I know the BFG T/A KO's will surpass this substantially.

 

[K2ZJ]

The terrain here in SC mostly consists of rocks and mud. And, the Outer Banks, of course, provides a sandy retreat. Excursions to these places are the extent of what I want. I don't plan on climbing giant scary boulders with my DD. :^)

I do want 33's, but as I said, axle shafts and gears are not in the budget. If I go bigger than 31's (anything >33's) I will most likely go with full size axles. But, this is years away. First I have to graduate from college, and tackle these loans. :^)

How loud are your BFG MT's, and what kind of wear are you getting out of them? My wife won't go wheeling anymore if my tires are too loud. I can't blame her either, I'm not a big fan of shouting over my worn out Baja Claws. They are so loud that I don't enjoy driving the XJ on trips longer than 45 minutes or so.

I guess I should specify what I consider good tire wear. I think that rotating 5 tires should yield a bare minimum of 40k miles. I know the BFG T/A KO's will surpass this substantially.

Don't go to Moab if you don't want to climb scary boulders in your rig!

Your axles have held up to 35s, dropping to 33s shouldn't be a problem. A 35C out back would make me nervous but an 8.25 is fine.

My M/Ts were not bad for noise, but like you said it is subjective. They were quieter than my Swampers and smoother for sure, a little noisier than the A/Ts. I am driving a lifted Jeep so I am a little more more lenient towards noise and handling. I have driven my Jeep for the last year with no sway bars. I am not saying I am hardcore, I lost the bushings in the links and didn't replace them. I say it so you may get a better idea of what I might consider to much noise. My Jeep was my DD up until April when we got a 3rd car. My wife drove the Jeep with muds and no sway bars and never said anything about the tires. She likes sway bars though.

I bought the M/Ts used and ran them for ~25K before I traded them and my friend ran them for at least another ~10K I am sure they had ~10-20 on them when I got them. I would get them again in a heartbeat!

 

[Dr. Jones]

Is Moab the main destination for this trip, or just one of the stops? If it's mainly a road trip with a little wheeling mixed in for a couple days, get the 31s. If you're bombing out here to spend as much time as possible playing on the rocks, you may want 33s. Or, what about a skinny 33? Maybe a 285 75r16. That gives you the height of a 33 to make the big rocks seem smaller, but less rolling resistance (better gas mileage) than a 12.50. Still not going to be as good on gas as a 31 with the stock gearing, but not bad.

A rear locker is nice, but in Moab a little driving skill is more important. I have a selectable rear and only use it when I'm playing around on hard lines. Short of Pritchett Canyon, I wouldn't hesitate to do any of the standard "safari" trails in Moab with open diffs.

 

[The Adam Blaster]

I ran the old style BFG M/T's in 31" size on my XJ for a number of years and they definitely got louder as they wore down.

 

[Brandon Libby]

I looked at the 33/9.5/15's as a possibility. These may be what I pursue when I am ready to move up. I love tall skinny tires!

 

[sp4mike]

I didn't vote as I have no experience with the duratracs or moab. What I can tell you is that 32x11.50x15 BFG A/T's are a quiet good performing (off and on-road) tire for an XJ. I have a 6.5" RE long arm on mine with an 8.8 out back and a D30 up front. From what I understand, the 8.25 is good to 35" tires, and there are plenty of guys running 35's on the D30 without problems, even with a locker. Stay out of the skinny pedal and you should be fine. Also keep in mind that spare axles can be had very cheap from a junkyard and don't take up much room. I would have no problem pointing my XJ at any trail without fear of breaking anything. It really depends on how you wheel. You could break 2.5 ton axles on 35's, or you could hold a D35 together on 35's depending on how you drive.

My biggest concern is that you plan on lowering your rig. Have you put any thought into your driveline angle? As my XJ started to sag in the rear I was getting a small vibration during acceleration from the rear diff not pointing at the transfer case anymore. I can only imagine how bad it would be going from 7.5" down to a 3".

To be completely honest with you though, run it with the tires and lift that are on it. The amount of cash you will lay down for new meats and lower springs/shocks will get you a pile of new axle shafts, and the difference in gas mileage will be negligible. Gearing may be an issue, but I don't think it's something that will be trip ending.

 

[K2ZJ]

My biggest concern is that you plan on lowering your rig. Have you put any thought into your driveline angle? As my XJ started to sag in the rear I was getting a small vibration during acceleration from the rear diff not pointing at the transfer case anymore. I can only imagine how bad it would be going from 7.5" down to a 3".

The same amount of thought goes into going from stock to 3.5" or 7.5". Just in reverse. Shim your axles accordingly.

To be completely honest with you though, run it with the tires and lift that are on it. The amount of cash you will lay down for new meats and lower springs/shocks will get you a pile of new axle shafts, and the difference in gas mileage will be negligible. Gearing may be an issue, but I don't think it's something that will be trip ending.

Buy used stuff and sell your old stuff, should work out close to the same, or trade someone who wants to go taller. Have a wrench fest in the driveway. Remove parts and swap them together. I doubt he is buying a brand new lift and throwing out the old stuff. Not that he can't buy new, just buying new and throwing out the old would make least financial sense. Used 35s and a 7.5" lift are worth some cash to someone.

 

[Dr. Jones]

I looked at the 33/9.5/15's as a possibility. These may be what I pursue when I am ready to move up. I love tall skinny tires!

So, since you've already made up your mind on going with 31s, is this thread just about which brand to choose?

 

[jeep-N-montero]

If you need any help finding spare axle shafts PM me, they are cheap and plentiful at the salvage yard I frequent. Then you have to worry less if you break one, but you have to be pretty careless or aggressive to break a 30 or 8.25 on slickrock trails. I ran my 30/35 setup for the first 10 years of wheeling my ZJ, 2 years of which were on 33's and never had a breakage. I currently am running an hp30 front and upgraded rear 44a with 4.56 gears and love it, still open and debating if I even need to Aussie the rear. With the amount of traction available between the trail surface and tons of articulation, there hasn't been many situations where the locker would have made a difference. I currently have a set of 33x10.50 BFG A/T's I run for street/winter tires and light trail duty, and will be going to a set of 33x10.50 BFG M/T's for my Moab trips once my current set of 33x12.50 MT/R's wear out.

And for those complaining about noise, it's a freaking Jeep, not a Lexus!!

 

[sp4mike]

Buy used stuff and sell your old stuff, should work out close to the same, or trade someone who wants to go taller. Have a wrench fest in the driveway. Remove parts and swap them together. I doubt he is buying a brand new lift and throwing out the old stuff. Not that he can't buy new, just buying new and throwing out the old would make least financial sense. Used 35s and a 7.5" lift are worth some cash to someone.

It's just springs and shocks for the RE, not a lot of value there. But I suppose you are right, it could be done as a straight up trade with someone wanting to go taller. I hadn't thought about that.

 

[jeep-N-montero]

One thing to keep in mind when you start looking for parts is that a 3in ZJ front lift coil is the same as an XJ 4.5 front lift coil.

 

[K2ZJ]

It's just springs and shocks for the RE, not a lot of value there. But I suppose you are right, it could be done as a straight up trade with someone wanting to go taller. I hadn't thought about that.

Not a lot but some, and the same could be said for a used set of 4.5" springs and shocks...

Just for reference, I have a ZJ with 6cyl, and 4.5" 33s 4.10s, was 3.55s 31s and 3" for years! Black ZJ has had his rig only 1 year longer than I have had mine, I just passed the 11year mark. :Wow1:

I am glad I gave you the trade idea. Good luck.

 

[Brandon Libby]

Well, thanks to everyone for all of the info. Based on all of the input, I think that 31/10.5/15 BFG T/A KO's are what I am going to purchase.

Hope to see you on the trail.

 

[Dr. Jones]

Have you looked at Goodyear Silent Armors? I didn't notice if someone already mentioned those in this thread. Great all around tire, and a friend of mine runs them on his TJ in Moab.