Newb questions - apologies in advance!!

[60Dan]

OK guys, so ive got my Landcruiser diesel up for sale in the classifieds section and am seriously thinking about moving over to a Land Rover. Would love a Defender diesel but I think a Disco is more in the budget!

Which brings me to my first newb question ...

Vehicles in general here in the US seem to hold their value considerably compared to that of the UK. So how is it the Discoverys seem to be such good value?
I was looking on eBay and such and I can pick up a 2000-2003 Disco with low miles for less than 10k!
Is the servicing and parts expensive or something?

Second question ...

Who here in the states aside from eastcoastrovers does the TDI swaps and what would cost on average?

Thanks, go easy

 

[Colorado David]

The Defender was last imported in 1997. There are a finite number from which to choose. They are also a hand-made vehicle. The Discovery, an assembly line truck, is a very capable vehicle and I think they are very good value for the money. The Discovery has been imported continuously since they were introduced in the U.S. market. The law of supply and demand is very much at work.

As for repairs, they are Land Rovers so they are costly to repair and maintain. You have to want to be a Land Rover owner and in most cases be willing to learn to do as much of your own wrench bending as you can. I am new to Land Rover ownership and am learning the ins and outs of maintenance. However I have always wanted one and finally tipped over the edge. Good luck with your decision.

 

[crusader]

Vehicles in general here in the US seem to hold their value considerably compared to that of the UK. So how is it the Discoverys seem to be such good value?

Apologies in advance to you Disco owners out there, but as a former Discovery owner here's my take on it:

First off, These were/are marketed as hi-class luxury vehicles here in the US, when the reality is that they are nothing more than Rover's plastic-y equivalent of the Ford explorer in the UK, so they started off overvalued in the first place.

Add to that the ease at which they are willing to rust out (at least in the Northeastern USA) and the fact that a "service engine" light is equivalent to a "spend $2000" light, and you begin to see why these things are regularly dumped on the used car auction market.

Having said that, I'd still consider using a (modified) Disco chassis and drivetrain (minus ECU-dependent engine) under my Series Rover bodyshell if I could find a decent Disco in the scrapyard at an appropriate price.

I was looking on eBay and such and I can pick up a 2000-2003 Disco with low miles for less than 10k!

Probably less than 5K if you look around. The late 90's Discos are about $2500.

Is the servicing and parts expensive or something?

Swing by the dealer some time and ask them how much the fake burlwood trim piece that surrounds the window switches on a '98 Disco is.

Second question ...

Who here in the states aside from eastcoastrovers does the TDI swaps?

I think that Britannica Restorations in Quebec does them, however, I'm sure you've spotted that this isn't, strictly speaking, in the states. In southern Maine, Matt Browne of Overland Engineering does them as well, I think. Lousy website, but the contact info is there.

You don't list a location--Any particular part of the country you have in mind?


EDIT: Nice Land Cruiser you're selling. Just an opinion here...I'm keeping an open mind as much as possible, but it seems to me that you'd be trading down if you got rid of that trubo-diesel FJ60 for an early 21st century Discovery. Especially if you were going to pay the $5-10k for a 200/300Tdi installation. A 90 or 110 might be a trade up if you can find an early one with a Tdi swapped in. A couple of members import them and have a few reasonably-priced 90s listed on their websites.

 

[KevinNY]

Don't do it.

 

[60Dan]

Thanks for the detailed response, that makes alot of sense.

Im actually located in Nashville, Tennessee.
Originally from the UK where diesels are abundant from the factory, trying to find one over here that isnt going to cost an arm and a leg can be quite frustrating.

Would love a 110 or Defender or Discovery with a 300TDI swap but the prices are crazy!
If you asked those kind of prices in the UK they would laugh at you!

Unfortunately though this is the nature of the beast. I may end up with an 80 series landcruiser with a diesel, but would like to keep my options open towards the land rovers.

So you think the diesel swaps are around 10K huh?
Wouldnt be so bad if I could pick up a gas disco for 5K. In saying that, im sure if it was that easy more people would be doing it ... right?!?

 

[discodisco]

Knowing is half the battle

Yes Defenders are very expensive and if you want a 4 door version diesel you are going to pay even more. Fortunately that is all changing because the first defenders are now available for import from england so they are starting to populate ebay. For overlanding I would personally recommend a 200 or 300 tdi defender as they are the best.

Discoveries can be hell on the pocket book if you don't do the work yourself, but I think you can say that about any car. Parts for all land rovers are actually decent to get a hold of if you do your homework. I used to own triumphs as a hobby and parts were a pain. Land rovers are shipped all over the world and if you don't go the the stealership then you can get things for a decent price. Interior luxury items are more expensive then most cars but that is because the land rover is a luxury car.

When Ford bought Land rover they messed up the late the first batch of the 2003 engines and it has caused many of them to drop their liners.... which means they are going up for cheap right now and you can replace the useless engine with a TDI. I believe it is the 300TDI that bolts right in but you have to do your homework on what your state will allow for engine swaps.

Drive train: Most of the 99-01 DIIs have a CDL "nipple" that will engage the Center Diff Lock, but they lack the device to engage it. This is a simple fix so don't let that hold you back. Front drive shaft is always a problem too you will need to buy a drive shaft that can be regularly oiled. If you put more then a two inch suspension lift you would probably want to buy one anyways.

Personally If I had to do it over again I would buy a 2004 because all the kinks had been worked out and it came standard with a CDL shifter in it.

PM me if you want to talk in details
Oh and there are a couple of people who will switch out the engines for you

Contact your local club and they will be your strongest lead to a good mechanic who will give you a ton of advice if he is good

 

[KevinNY]

No shop can do a professional job of a TDI swap with proper transmission and ancillaries for 10k, you're dreaming. You can't just bolt a 300tdi in and expect everything alse to work, including the gearbox, which really should be a manual.

 

[Rovertrader]

Kevin is correct, and a D-II Tdi is near impossible!! A D-I to Tdi is a great truck, but not fast- at all. The best Discos in the US are '95 for simple home maintenance kinda truck, or '04 D-II, last year, CDL, 4.6, etc- a nice truck. The D-II is 10" longer, all aft of the rear axle- adds a little more room at the expense of reduced departure angle. Take a look at our site, www.theroverbarn.com to see some Tdis we've done, and feel free to contact for more info. And, by the way, you are in the middle of one of the best enthusiast Rover clubs in the States- stop by the dealership and talk to Kelly Graham( and oogle over his Tdi110 which is one of the finest I have ever seen). Cheers

 

[Antichrist]

This is coming from someone who's been driving only Land Rovers for over 35 years.

Pigs would fly above a frozen over hell before I sold a diesel Land Cruiser and bought a DII.

 

[AxeAngel]

This is coming from someone who's been driving only Land Rovers for over 35 years.

Pigs would fly above a frozen over hell before I sold a diesel Land Cruiser and bought a DII.

I have a fully built 2003 D2, new engine, tcase both with under 10k on them. Fully built truck. I will echo what Tom said.

If I was starting out from your position I would stick with a diesel land cruiser. With that being said, I bought my rig 3yrs ago for under 15k and have done almost everything myself. I've been fortunate and only had one or two issues with mine (knock on wood). Taking it to the dealer can get very costly.

However you are lucky being in Tennessee as one of the large parts suppliers is in Virginia and there are a lot of knowlegable shops in VA/NC.

If you are eve in NC feel free to drop me a line and take my rig for a spin.

-Sam

 

[David Harris]

Apologies in advance to you Disco owners out there, but as a former Discovery owner here's my take on it:

First off, These were/are marketed as hi-class luxury vehicles here in the US, when the reality is that they are nothing more than Rover's plastic-y equivalent of the Ford explorer in the UK, so they started off overvalued in the first place.

Add to that the ease at which they are willing to rust out (at least in the Northeastern USA) and the fact that a "service engine" light is equivalent to a "spend $2000" light, and you begin to see why these things are regularly dumped on the used car auction market.

Having said that, I'd still consider using a (modified) Disco chassis and drivetrain (minus ECU-dependent engine) under my Series Rover bodyshell if I could find a decent Disco in the scrapyard at an appropriate price.



Probably less than 5K if you look around. The late 90's Discos are about $2500.



Swing by the dealer some time and ask them how much the fake burlwood trim piece that surrounds the window switches on a '98 Disco is.



I think that Britannica Restorations in Quebec does them, however, I'm sure you've spotted that this isn't, strictly speaking, in the states. In southern Maine, Matt Browne of Overland Engineering does them as well, I think. Lousy website, but the contact info is there.

You don't list a location--Any particular part of the country you have in mind?


EDIT: Nice Land Cruiser you're selling. Just an opinion here...I'm keeping an open mind as much as possible, but it seems to me that you'd be trading down if you got rid of that trubo-diesel FJ60 for an early 21st century Discovery. Especially if you were going to pay the $5-10k for a 200/300Tdi installation. A 90 or 110 might be a trade up if you can find an early one with a Tdi swapped in. A couple of members import them and have a few reasonably-priced 90s listed on their websites.

Comparing a Land Rover Discovery to a Ford Explorer makes it evident that you either never actually looked at the technical differences between the two vehicles or failed to appreciate them. First of all, yes the Discovery was marketed as a luxury vehicle. After that look at that facts. The Discovery's chassis and drivetrain design is actually nearly identical to the Defender, so why shouldn't it be nearly as expensive as the Defender? This means that the Explorer is nowhere near the Discovery in technical specs. The Discovery has stock long arm suspension with long travel coils all around, full-floating axles front and rear, gear driven transfer case with 3.32:1 low range stock, and permanent four wheel drive with massively built fully boxed ladder frame which makes the Explorer's look like it was put together with toothpicks. All of this quality costs a lot to build and you are paying for that in the sticker price. The basic body and electrics has its problems for sure, but you would have to put major dollars into the Explorer, as you would a Jeep to get it anywhere near the stock specifications and capability of the Land Rover. Yes, if you take the Rover to the dealer for service, you better have deep pockets, but that's with any dealer, not just Rover. If you do the service yourself, then it is quite reasonable, and you build the capability of repairing it in the field if necessary. The low resale value is a factor of American owners who aren't prepared to maintain the vehicles properly and the generally poor resale values of vehicles in general. Are they reliable? I bought my current Discovery 1 for 500.00 with 155000 miles on the clock. I replaced the fuel pump and just drove it back and forth across the US including some heavy off-roading. I didn't have a single problem. The vehicle drove like new. There are many other Disco owners with over 200K on their engines and drivetrains without major problems. More of the problems come with the newer models and their complex electronics which are much less user serviceable. Having said that, for expedition use it is hard to beat a diesel LC. However, it is not a Land Rover either, which has a better suspension set up, and of course a certain adventure cache which goes with it. The LC lacks much of the personality of the LR in my opinion. So, my advice would be to keep the LC and buy yourself an inexpensive Disco I (stay away from the D2's due to their compromises), then you'll have first hand experience to see whether you are the LR type and judge its capabilities for yourself.

 

[Antichrist]

The Discovery's chassis and drivetrain design is actually nearly identical to the Defender, so why shouldn't it be nearly as expensive as the Defender? This means that the Explorer is nowhere near the Discovery in technical specs. The Discovery has stock long arm suspension with long travel coils all around, full-floating axles front and rear, gear driven transfer case with 3.32:1 low range stock, and permanent four wheel drive with massively built fully boxed ladder frame

This only applies to the Discovery 1, and somewhat to the Discovery II. Not hardly at all to the Discovery 3 or Discovery 4,

 

[David Harris]

Indeed, but in their own high-tech way, the Disco 3 and 4 also blow the Ford Explorer out of the water in technical spec and off-road capability. Nor can the FJ60 or 80 match these specs. The only LC to come close is the 70 series, which is a rare beast in the US. The LC really only has build quality and reliability in its favor, which are important things, of course. Off-road in stock form it is no match for the LR. Not trying to start a war with LC people here, as I have a healthy respect for them. They are first rate in their own ways.

 

[ersatzknarf]

Hi Dan,
That is a very nice car you have for sale and if you want a Discovery, I think you might enjoy it, especially if you don't mind to tinker on your own. I used a 2.8 TGV Powerstroke conversion kit from Motor & Diesel Engineering in the UK and was very pleased with the results. Considering your location, you might be able to find a very nice, clean and relatively rust free car and make a project of it. I don't know what the rules are in TN about going diesel, but for where I am, it was no problem. If I can answer any questions, please feel free to send a PM.

OK guys, so ive got my Landcruiser diesel up for sale in the classifieds section and am seriously thinking about moving over to a Land Rover. Would love a Defender diesel but I think a Disco is more in the budget!

Which brings me to my first newb question ...

Vehicles in general here in the US seem to hold their value considerably compared to that of the UK. So how is it the Discoverys seem to be such good value?
I was looking on eBay and such and I can pick up a 2000-2003 Disco with low miles for less than 10k!
Is the servicing and parts expensive or something?

Second question ...

Who here in the states aside from eastcoastrovers does the TDI swaps and what would cost on average?

Thanks, go easy

 

[Green96D1]

Comparing a Land Rover Discovery to a Ford Explorer

My only take on this statement is that The Discovery is the best selling 4x4 in the UK like the Ford Explorer is the best selling 4x4 in the US other than that the two trucks are completely different 4wd's