Proper Technique?

[madizell]

When I was doing a lot of location photography for WARN, we would go on a lot of group trail runs. There is a corporate mentality there that is pretty interesting.

If you were on a group run and were the one that had to use the winch, you were basically ridiculed for the rest of the trip.

Trust me, it was all about learning how to drive correctly and negotiate the obstacle with driver skill and technique. Using the winch was *always* the last resort when nothing else would work.

Going to the winch first is lazy and generally a bad idea IMO. You are right, 'seat-time' will cure most of your driving education needs.

Operative concept here is "mind set." Any group who ridicules another member of the group for any behavior other than running around with their pants down or getting drunk and popping off a hand gun has their heads in the wrong place, and I don't care how much they make on the job or who they work for. Cars run on gasoline or diesel, not testosterone. Hopefully you found another group to run with.

The other possibility is that, although these folks worked for Warn, they didn't actually know how to use their own product. I would not be surprised. Certainly good driving technique will take you farther down the trail than sloppy driving, and there are a few folks who seem able to get most anyone's vehicle farther down the trail than other folks can. Talent accounts for a lot on the trail. But if winching is routinely seen as a "last resort" or is rarely done, you have to have been on relatively tame trails.

Nor was I suggesting that a learning driver should "go to the winch first." Read carefully. I was suggesting that if the vehicle was wedged in rocks and the tires were at risk, use a winch to recover instead of smoking the tires on sharp rocks. It is difficult to learn driving techniques or practice driving style while repairing tires on the trail.

 

[Michael Slade]

You make a lot of assumptions about a group of people you've never met.

 

[Alaska Mike]

When I lived in drier climes, I didn't own a winch. Rarely saw the need for one. However, now I tell people it's one of the first mods they should do to their vehicle. I also use mine- a lot. I rather someone take a couple tries at an obstacle and then pull cable, rather than dig a huge hole. If someone gave me grief for properly using a winch, I would probably not wheel with them again.

 

[TeriAnn]

You make a lot of assumptions about a group of people you've never met.

That's why I hit delete instead of send to a reply I wrote to your previous message. I first got huffy then decided I didn't know the people nor the circumstances that lead to your story and therefore could not make a legitimate meaningful comment. It is too easy to come down on others without knowing the people nor the circumstances.

 

[bigreen505]

Cars run on gasoline or diesel, not testosterone.

Classic.

 

[david despain]

That was my next question!

I've been meaning to ask that here. I've heard that about the floating axles, then I've also heard my D2 no longer has floating axles? What exactly does floating axles mean?

I get the part about removing the offending driveshaft, and locking the center diff to go in 2wd. But I don't know if/how you have to remove the broken axle shaft.

the answer is kinda sorta yes but not really for the intents and purposes of this thread or line of thinking. yes the weight is supported on a pair of bearings out at the wheel like a traditional full floater. but no, the axle is what retains the bearings into the hub assembly. and they are what seal the axle from the elements and keep you from leaking all the diff oil out. so they are not like full floaters and you cant treat them like all other LR axles like terri ann suggests here http://expeditionportal.com/forum/showpost.php?p=223829&postcount=25 in the other rovers (DI RRC series D90 etc) the drive flange cap is what seals the axle tube front and rear. both ends are all sealed; thats why some guys remove the seals and run 90 wt. from end to end in the front. but on a DII in the rear the axle and an o-ring seals the hub from 90wt. in the front of a DI its a closed knuckle, in a DII there is a seal assy that seals the front axle/axle tube. its just inbd of the CV joint. if you pull the axle on a DII the wheel/hub assy will probably just fall off in a few miles. the only thing holding the hub assy together is the interferance/press fit of the bearings into the hub. also the physical shape of the axles prevent you from removing them they in the same fashion as you could on the older closed knuckle trucks. so what is a 15 minute or less trail repair and drive out in 3 wheel drive on an older truck is simply not possible w/ a DII

http://www.discoweb.org/forums/showthread.php?t=27540&highlight=hubs

most excellent thread w/ pictures and all.

 

[R_Lefebvre]

Great thread, thanks! The good ones are really hard to find.

Yeah, so, we can't just pull the axles like the old trucks can. Anybody cutting down axle shafts to make stub axles for emergency repairs? Or are people just carrying axles? One could probably make some kind of large bolt-like contraption that bolts in, you don't need the splines.

Also depressing to see the cost of those bearings, but that's the way it is these days with all cars. I'm just glad my Dad has a fleet account and I can get jobber pricing on car parts.

 

[david despain]

if it aint broke dont over-engineer a fix for it

Great thread, thanks! The good ones are really hard to find.

Yeah, so, we can't just pull the axles like the old trucks can. Anybody cutting down axle shafts to make stub axles for emergency repairs? Or are people just carrying axles? One could probably make some kind of large bolt-like contraption that bolts in, you don't need the splines.

Also depressing to see the cost of those bearings, but that's the way it is these days with all cars. I'm just glad my Dad has a fleet account and I can get jobber pricing on car parts.

there are lots of good threads you just have to skip over the questions about tire size and 2" lift questions.

cut down axles wouldnt do you any good. to get the old broken parts out you would still need to pull the hub and remove to broken parts from the hub. might as well put in a new axle at that point. it would be much faster to just replace the axle than rig up some temporary repair, at that point you would still need to pull the hub again anyway to put in the replacement axle. the splines are the ultimate sealing surface for axle tube in the rear. in the front how would u keep the oil in the axle tube?

sounds like an overly complicated solution to a simple problem. if you are concerned about it just run HD axle shafts. of course those may be cost prohibitive if they even exist for sale anywhere(fronts). sounds like you should just sell it and get a DI. I'll give u five grand for it if you can get it shipped to salt lake.

i cant think off the top of my head where i have ever read about someone needing to change the hub because of an actual bearing problem. oil seal or grease seal leakage is the common complaint. o-ring is really cheap. hub unit while not cheap are not that bad if you look around. i guess what im saying is the price is not a big deal, its not like they get replaced once a year. at least not since they started selling the abs sensor seperate from the hub a few years ago.