Superduty V10 vs 6.0

[greasyfingers]

Good info, thanks.

My 6.0 seem louder than most and has been since new. The exhaust is very quiet coming from the tailpipe - the noise is engine compartment, I don't think a 7.3 has anything on it as far as diesel clatter and general din. Inside the cabin engine noise is OK with the windows up, overall it is reasonably quiet on the freeway. I have to shut off the engine at any park entrance (a problem if the engine is smoking hot from driving up a mountain) or any drive thru to be able to communicate with someone outside the truck. It detracts from idyllic natural areas to hear the noise with the windows open, definitely detracts from the experience on a otherwise quiet scenic drive with the windows open and knowing that anyone around me has to listen to it too.

Gas mileage would be acceptable since I wouldn't be using it as a daily driver, except that the gas tank on these trucks is pretty small, 29 gallon on my truck, unless they have a larger tank '05.

Just so you know the FTE resonator drastically reduces in cab drone, so even if the sound from your tail pipe is fairly quiet a lot of the noise people complain about with diesels is the drone while driving. Yes the engine it's self is noisy due to compression ignition and injector clatter but that nearly disappears with the other mods I explained earlier. Also I coated the exterior of my valve covers with spray on bed liner too which cuts injector noise in half.

I used to drive 6.0s daily and I can tell you they are fairly quiet compaired to my 7.3 which didn't have the sound deadening at the time.

Im in the same boat but looking at an Excursion next year. I like the V10 for the gas simplicity but the diesel for the power and better economy.

I want as new a truck as possible and the 5 speed trans so that leaves with a 6.0 if going diesel.

Our mechanic at work has owned a V10 Ex and currently has a 7.3. He's also had a couple 6.0 trucks along with turning wrenches on all of them at work.

It looks like V10 Ex's all get low teens on the highway for mileage and when towing it goes into single digits. The diesels seem to do high teens empty and low teens when towing. That to me is appealing.

Our mechanic's advice has been to find a low mileage 6.0 with a good history and no current issues; do the EGR delete and Bulletproof oil cooler and enjoy it.

Personally Im still torn. I like the gas motor for quietness and simplicity but the diesel will do better fuel wise and the power.

What is complicated about a diesel?

I agree, an EGR delete or aftermarket and head studs and 6.0 problems are gone. It is unfortunate thats what you have to do make it relyable but alot of cars have their problems.

I went from a 7.3l to a V-10 (not voluntarily, a bone head rolled my crew cab in Mexico). That V-10 was a pig I could not wait to off load. Very poor mileage. Towing a flat bed trailer with two dirt bikes up Hwy 395, I was mocked and heckled by my cousin in his diesel. I could only pull about 40 mph up the grades. In fact, once I sold the V-10, I towed the same load with wife's V-6 Tacoma and went faster up the grade and better gas mileage. My V-10 was a 2001 F250 Supercab with shell. Mileage was closer to 10-11 mpg even without towing dirt bikes.

Ever since losing my 7.3l, I longed for the return of having to turn the motor off to order from the drive-thru window.

I'm with you the v10 is guttless! and even if you don't care if you're paying 70% more for fuel cost, your range on the stock tank goes from 475/550(diesel) to 300/350(gasser)

Recently I made a trip from GA to ND and I averaged 21mpg hand calculated and I had over 500lbs of gear in the bed. I also moved from Anchorage, AK to GA pulling a goose neck and a GCVWR of 21,000lbs and I averaged 13mpg. Usually i get 16-17mpg in the city.

I'm just saying that the 6.0 can be made quiet and with a couple mods it can be relyable and have good milage. And you'll likely save the amount in EGR/studs in your first year of fuel expence.

 

[homemade]

So it looks like an ‘05 V10 has issues too, I wasn’t looking at anything newer because of price and I don‘t want to trade one set of problems for another.
Has anyone here actually installed an EGR delete kit like the Sinister product? They list 6-8 hours to install so that probably means at least a weekend for me.

 

[proper4wd]

I like my 6.0 but I have owned Land Rovers forever so "quirky" is normal. I really think they get a bad reputation undeservedly... There are a handful of things that go wrong and nearly all of them show signs of failure beforehand and will not leave you stranded.

Yes, mine has broken on me. FICM failed, that was $400. No big deal really. I have an EGR delete and head stud kit waiting to be installed as soon as i get a free weekend to tear the motor apart. This doesn't bother me like it seems to bother so many other people. But, like I said... I'm coming from a long history of Land Rovers....

 

[bfdiesel]

I like my 6.0 but I have owned Land Rovers forever so "quirky" is normal. I really think they get a bad reputation undeservedly... There are a handful of things that go wrong and nearly all of them show signs of failure beforehand and will not leave you stranded.

The ICP sensor went out on my brothers 05 with no warning and it did leave him stranded. Also the 6.0 is prone to blowing a line off the high pressure oil pump which will leave you stranded.

A side note; we had a cold spell last year (-40's F) and one of the fuel stops here in town wasn't selling a good winter blend of diesel. The Chevy's and Dodge's did fine on the clouded fuel, but the Ford's mostly 6.0's were parked along the road. They had just enough fuel to make it a 1/2 mile to mile down the road before the primary filter plugged.

The Ford's parked inside did fine, but the ones parked outside and just plugged in were the troubled ones. Those of us with Chevy's and Dodge's had fun towing them to a shop or garage to warm up.

 

[greasyfingers]

You can also go with an aftermarket EGR if you have inspections in your area. Check this place out http://shop.strictlydiesel.com/store.php/categories/0307_60L_Engine_Parts I have ran 6.0s in Alaska in some extremely cold temps running regular #2 and the truck start just fine as long as the glow plug system is properly funtioning, -35* with out plugging in.

 

[lllateralus]

Just for the record, the same 6.0 liter that has a (yes.. DESERVEDLY) bad reputation is/was used in school buses and other commercial vehicles and enjoys a solid reputation. The same motor. The difference is in the smog equipment, from what I understand. EGR, etc.. like others have said.

International made the DT444E, (7.3 liter) and they also made the 6.0. The 6.0 in the pickup trucks has new stringent smog requirements of 2003+. (commercial vehicles didn't)

Not making excuses, but if Ford wasn't forced to slap tons of complicated, crappy smog equipment on the 6 liter, it might enjoy have half the good reputation the good old 7.3 does. The 4 smaller valves instead of 2 big ones, variable vane turbocharger, etc.. well, those don't help.

Simplicity is reliability. (5.9 Cummins anyone?)

And yes, I own a mint condition, 7.3 Power Stroke truck. The newer, complicated, complex, sensitive diesel engines suck. (in my opinion)

 

[bjm206]

The VT365 (commercial 6.0PS) is a reliable engine when maintained. OE folks told me once the Ford version was running to much power (approx. 325 hp) compared to the VT365 (approx. 230 hp max). This caused EGT and under hood ambient temp issues that led to other failures. The DT444E and 6BT/4BT were real reliable.

 

[19psi]

I drove a brand new v10 truck and it was ok around town but on the highway it was horrible. No power to pass, struggled up minor grades and got 10mpg. Of course I wouldn't buy a 6.0 either unless you do the reliability mods as mentioned above. At least then you'll have some power and mileage.

 

[brut4s]

My '06 6.0 had the FICM and 1 injector go bad covered under warranty. Now at 140k as of this week. I still love my truck!

 

[Buliwyf]

I went from a 7.3l to a V-10 (not voluntarily, a bone head rolled my crew cab in Mexico). That V-10 was a pig I could not wait to off load. Very poor mileage. Towing a flat bed trailer with two dirt bikes up Hwy 395, I was mocked and heckled by my cousin in his diesel. I could only pull about 40 mph up the grades. In fact, once I sold the V-10, I towed the same load with wife's V-6 Tacoma and went faster up the grade and better gas mileage. My V-10 was a 2001 F250 Supercab with shell. Mileage was closer to 10-11 mpg even without towing dirt bikes.

Ever since losing my 7.3l, I longed for the return of having to turn the motor off to order from the drive-thru window.

If a Toyota could outpull your F250.......then your F250 (or your right foot) was broken. A E350 Ford van, with a measly 4.6L and pitiful 3.55 gears, out tows any Toyota Taco I've ever had, or barrowed.

Gears are important. The V10 should have nothing worse than 4.10.
3.55 and 3.73 stink. But the ones I've driven with 4.30 gears (stock to 33" tires) or 4.56 gears (35"+ tires) were excellent. It's a solid 350HP. I don't see how that could ever be called a dog?

I'm sure most of the dogs, were that way for a reason, and I doubt it's completely the engines fault.

IME the 5.4 and 6.8 are some of the best truck engines ever made. Zerosert the heads and there really isn't much left to complain about.



OP:
I also agree that the 6.0 is remarkably more reliable in HD applications. Larger radiators, no emmisions BS. It makes sense. The Ford trucks with the 6.0L drink coolant from the EGR, coolant gets low, heads vapor lock and warp.

Get rid of the EGR and the only 6.0 problems are a few bad turbos and that wiring harness rub.

I didn't have any problems with overheating with my (long gone) 6.0L Ford . It was a 13,000lb truck with a 10,000 trailer in Florida heat. If I did stay at full throttle for too long on a very hot day, the temp needle would climb quickly. But that was mostly driver error. And that isn't really the engines fault at all. When engines work, they make heat, if you exceed the amount of heat your radiator can cool off, then you overheat. Not so much the engines fault, but more the cooling systems and drivers fault. People forget that the 6.0 can put out a bit more power than the truck is really designed for. I've had similar complaints with Dodge and Duramax customers.

That truck died due to a bad EGR, and I think eventually a warped head. No idea who's driving that thing today.

 

[conifers4]

The 6.0 was the biggest mistake of my life to date lol. 60,000 miles, 3 fuel injectors @ $1500 and $2000 for a high pressure oil pump. In 6 months!!!
Never again

X2...In just over a year I was $2700.00 in the hole on repairs, luckily another $1300 was covered by my extended warranty. Might I add that my truck only had 42k miles and never towed more that a 4x8 trailer. One of the biggest mistakes of my life...so far. Very happy I traded it in, but not so happy that the repairs went on my Amex card.

Shame on me though, I was warned about the 6.0 (even by someone who worked at a Ford dealership) but I didn't listen....

 

[BlackWidow]

I see allot of negative talk about the power of the V10. I must have got lucky or something. I purchased a used 2000 F350 with a V-10 originally from Nevada / Arizona (cant recall which state) I have towed my 65 mustang up some pretty good climbs (Grapevine outside of Bakersfield) and had no issues with power. I recently switched jobs but I used to haul my welding skid around and that skid easily weighed 2500 lbs and never seemed to be under powered. I have never even heard of the V10s having issues with the spark plugs I guess because I was not looking. I hope that is not an issue for me down the road. Anyway this is a good topic.

Mike G

 

[jagular7]

I just traded my 05 F350 C&C Crew in. I didn't get cr@$ for it. But alas, I owned it for under 30k miles (112 to 141). I had to add the EGR delete kit as the cooler blew out on my 2 states south 8 months into owning it. Added a SCT tuner with tow/brake tunes to remove the CEL (missing EGR). I didn't do the head bolts as I didn't put a lot of turbo pressure in the engine, didn't tow near maximum rating, didn't push the rpms, etc. I did add by-pass oil and coolant systems. The coolant should use a filter as the 'sand' pebbles run through the coolant. You'll be surprised after cutting the filter open. The oil is a micro filter down to 3 microns whereas the stock is 17 microns. Its in addition and doesn't replace the stock system. But it does add mileage between oil change intervals. On my 3rd filter change, I almost doubled the mileage (13k miles). I used Ford's dino oil as well. Synthetic will probably do even better.
Due to having a C&C, there are no side saddle plastic tanks, but a single steel tank in the back middle of the frame. Its inner coating caused me other issues, new frame fuel pump, 2 injectors and recoating.
That and the effect that I couldn't get better than 13/14 around town/highway and only 10 for towing 7k Jeep/trailer for over 2 yrs sucked. I traded for a heavy-half Ram 1500 Mega cab with a hemi. I'm not getting what I'd hope for in mileage as well with a hemi. 12.4-.6. I was looking for 16-18mpg. I'll be pulling my Jeep/trailer this weekend so I'll see what I do with the setup. Its completely stock. 3.73s on 3/4 axles, 5-sp trans and the hemi.

I've just sold the SCT controller (unmarried returning the truck back to stock before trade) to another 6.0l owner. He's getting 17 around town/highway and 13 towing a 2 horse trailer. I was able to remove the oil by-pass system as well. I'll list it in the for sale section. The coolant stayed with the truck. Looking back, I should have removed my trailer brake controller as well as the truck went to the auction 2 days ago.

 

[homemade]

EGR delete kit installation

Mike,

Did you do the EGR delete yourself, if so how hard was it and about how long did it take? If you had it installed do you recall the labor cost? I read the install instructions for the Sinister delete kit, it doesn’t look horrible but not a fun way to spend a weekend day or two either.

My understanding of the EGR delete is that it won’t affect emissions testing which only checks EGR function as relayed by the computer, you can leave the EGR valve in so the computer can continue to flip it open and closed but there is no exhaust gas routed to it.

 

[ujoint]

Mike,

My understanding of the EGR delete is that it won't affect emissions testing which only checks EGR function as relayed by the computer, you can leave the EGR valve in so the computer can continue to flip it open and closed but there is no exhaust gas routed to it.

If you do that, it will trip the CEL (no flow) I did my own EGR cooler delete on my van, it was quite the job! Glad I did it though, I now have piece of mind that I won't have a failure. I also cleaned the turbo, installed an EGT gauge & custom tuner from DP tuner. Runs great, I be @ 100K really soon.