The Jeep Wrangler Rubicon versus the Land Rover Defender

[Omar Brannstrom]

Extending the wheel base, and upping the payload would no longer be a Wrangler. Better to buy a Commander or some other large SUV.
Keep the Wrangler as is. Convertible, compact 2 door & 4 door short overhang, exceptionally capable trail rig.
There is only one truly capable trail rig left. Lets not ruin it.

For people who want bigger, higher payload vehicles, there are a plethora of choices which include diesel engines.

The payload for a Rubicon unlimited here in sweden is about 545kg a Landrover Defender 110 have about 1000kg in payload. I really doubt that a Defender that would be american made and had american engine with lots of power would have that payload for safety reasons.

The Jeep Wrangler unlimited have longer wheel base than a Landrover Defender 110 and the Jeep wrangler unlimited have wider tracks, probably more sure footed. If the measurements are correct it shows that bigger cargo room have som penalty that gives less leeg room for booth front and rear passengers compared to the Wrangler. The overall length of the vehicles are rather similar, the defender is slightly longer.

The Defender have bigger axles, my understanding is that is like a Dana 60 axel or so. The frame is more stout on the Defender.

The Defender is a rather slow vehicle compared to a Jeep Wrangler pentastar and lacks airbags.

 

[Comanche Scott]

I didn't say anything about extending the wheel base.

We know the D44's have a higher load rating than the Rubicon Unlimited allows, so they need to upgrade the brakes, shocks and maybe reinforce the frame a little and we'll have a higher payload with exactly the same size vehicle we have today.

-Dan

Hi Dan,

Sorry the quote you quoted had the extended wheel base, I was responding to both.
The issue with a higher payload capacity is C.G.
In order to counteract C.G. Suspension travel has to be limited, and controlled with heavier springs. So we lose articulation, and increase the aggressiveness for every monitored system of the Wrangler. This would dramatically diminish it's trail competence. Might as well go IFS then, because at that point there is no use for solid axles.

Dealers press Jeep to make the Wrangler bigger, and add more comfort / options so they can make greater profits. If customers ply the same things, because they don't understand the downside, eventually Jeep engineers cave in to demands, and so ends the greatest off road capable machine of all time.
Sometimes we need to be careful of what we wish for, as we may just get it.
Would certainly be easier for Jeep engineers not to have to fight dealers, & Government mandates to design a vehicle for the small base of real users.

 

[Dan Grec]

Hi Dan,

The issue with a higher payload capacity is C.G.
In order to counteract C.G. Suspension travel has to be limited, and controlled with heavier springs. So we lose articulation, and increase the aggressiveness for every monitored system of the Wrangler. This would dramatically diminish it's trail competence. Might as well go IFS then, because at that point there is no use for solid axles.

Hey Scott,

Ah, I never thought about C.G. and the suspension travel the Wrangler has. That's a very good point you make.

-Dan

 

[Omar Brannstrom]

A Jeep Wrangler unlimited auto diesel have a 85 liters fueltank and fuel economy is combined mpg (L/100km) 34.0 (8.3) http://www.jeep.co.uk/wrangler-unlimited/specifications/

A Landrover Defender 110 manual stick have 75 liters fueltank and fuel economy is combined mpg (L/100km) 25.5 (11.1) http://www.landrover.co.uk/vehicles/defender/pricing-and-specifications.html

 

[OCD Overland]

Extending the wheel base, and upping the payload would no longer be a Wrangler.

So? If it meets my needs, they can call it the Jeep ******tBox for all I care.

 

[Lucky j]

A Jeep Wrangler unlimited auto diesel have a 85 liters fueltank and fuel economy is combined mpg (L/100km) 34.0 (8.3) http://www.jeep.co.uk/wrangler-unlimited/specifications/

A Landrover Defender 110 manual stick have 75 liters fueltank and fuel economy is combined mpg (L/100km) 25.5 (11.1) http://www.landrover.co.uk/vehicles/defender/pricing-and-specifications.html

Ok, I guess that technicaly in that configuration, that is one more point for range in the overland target.

As for load and capacity, with everything titanium as it should be in the overlqnding business, I guess that it should not be a problem, specialy since that the extra space and load capacity of the D110 is now needed to keep up with the wrangler.

Now, I can go pretty much anywhere I want with my Unlimited TJ (LJ), unless we now need to specifiy how many lbs of material we need to carry to call it overlanding. Remember that some guys and galls do it with a motorcycle for years at a time. i think all that equipment can guet in my wrangler and then some.

Just a tough. :/

But don't get me wrong, Those D110 are really nice! But not ready to get one at all cost on this side of the puddle.

 

[Comanche Scott]

So? If it meets my needs, they can call it the Jeep ******tBox for all I care.

Exactly! :beer:

Just don't ruin the Wrangler to build the ******tBox. Make it a separate vehicle. Like a solid axle Commander.
Now that would be a great overland vehicle.

 

[AllAmericanInfidel]

Although I have never owned a Defender, I have owned both Land Rovers and Jeep Wranglers. The wife and I love different things about both. In my experience, although we had mechanical issues with both, the Jeeps have been more reliable. The Land Rovers had mechanical issues more frequently, both new and used. With the used ones, they were far more costly to repair as well. We both liked the interior of the Land Rovers better, but the Exterior looks of the JKU better. As far as aftermarket support, its hard to beat the Wrangler. You can find stuff for it at all price points, which I could not say fr our Land Rovers. I cant wait to see what Land Rover does with the new Defender. A new LR 110 truck would be a dream come true for me (and I still don't believe Jeep will ever produce a damn 4 door truck)!

 

[Alphonse]

Been following this thread and oddly enough had a chance to compare in person today when this D90 parked next to me. One thing I noticed is that defender is on 32" tires and we have the same exact roof height at the windshield frame, and his roof was taller in the rear. Our ground clearance was fairly similar despite his being stock on 32" tires and my JKUR being 3" lift on 37's. I know the Defenders use aluminum body panels so he probably also has a nice low cog.

I realize this may not be the best comparison cause this is an early 90's D90 but that's all we get here, lol

 

[Septu]

Defender ownership in North America is fetish-driven.

And Wrangler ownership is not?

My win the lotto fantasy? I'd have a jeep built with something close to the body of a rover (nice and boxy, wheels inside the body, just wider - like the jeep) with all the modern conveniences that my jeep has. I love my jeep - but honestly even with my mods I'm far from in love with the look of it. I love the look of the rover and love a lot of things about it inside (the space in the rear and the head room). But I hate how narrow it is. I have a 2012 JKUR while my buddy has a 1990s Rover. Slow and awkward and honestly, I found it a PITA to drive (I don't think I put more than 30km (19 miles?) on it). I really didn't like it, and was overjoyed to get my jeep back. Him and his wife (who drive 100km/60mi) daily, love the rover over the JKUR they had. So go figure.

I think the guy summed it up perfectly. Jeep is better off road, while the Rover is better at overlanding. Without a doubt with enough money mods can be done to make both very equal, but as the guy said... it's very hard to beat the interior room that the rover has.

 

[OCD Overland]

I don't know that you can categorically say the Defender is a better overlanding machine, at least for use here in the US. For me, and I'm sure for many others, our trips involve a lot of highway miles, so road manners and comfort are pretty important. I've done two road trips in a Defender, and that was enough to make me not want one - despite the fact that I really, really like them. But their appeal for me is entirely emotional - for all practical purposes, a Wrangler, at least one that could tow, would be better.

I've slowly - slowly - had to come to terms that a full size pickup is really the best choice for what we do/want to do. Next time ASPW comes to the US, someone should put him behind the wheel of a well built full size something for a week to see what he thinks. He's been driving a mid-size in his latest videos and seems to like it; and he also didn't mind the size of the big Sportmobile he drove last year for a week.

 

[Comanche Scott]

I don't know that you can categorically say the Defender is a better overlanding machine, at least for use here in the US. For me, and I'm sure for many others, our trips involve a lot of highway miles, so road manners and comfort are pretty important. I've done two road trips in a Defender, and that was enough to make me not want one - despite the fact that I really, really like them. But their appeal for me is entirely emotional - for all practical purposes, a Wrangler, at least one that could tow, would be better.

I've slowly - slowly - had to come to terms that a full size pickup is really the best choice for what we do/want to do. Next time ASPW comes to the US, someone should put him behind the wheel of a well built full size something for a week to see what he thinks. He's been driving a mid-size in his latest videos and seems to like it; and he also didn't mind the size of the big Sportmobile he drove last year for a week.

I agree the LR products are more of an emotional draw for me as well.

I'm really digging dropping the top down on the JKU and enjoying more of the outdoors during the day, then putting it back up like a tent, and sleeping in it at night. No roof on a forest trail is a remarkably different experience, than a steel roof on the same trail.
Configured as it is now, the dog and I can easily go a week in comfort without resupply with the soft top.
I'm going to try pushing that to 14 or more days here soon. Just to find our limit.

Scott Brady wrote in a post on the "Ultimate Overlander" thread, that a big thing for him is not having to turn back from an obstacle. That resonated with me, as I've had all kinds of capable, and non-capable rigs over the years.
There aren't many trails that will stop a lifted JKU on 35" tires, so that limits back tracking when connecting trail sections together into a long trip.
Two up, or solo it's just hard to beat the total exploring experience in a Wrangler.

 

[Omar Brannstrom]

Range again to be fair A manual box diesel Jeep Wrangler unlimited have a combined of 7.4 L/100km (US mpg 31.78) and a fueltank of 85 liters http://www.jeep.de/preisliste/665.pdf

A Landrover Defender 110 manual stick have 75 liters fueltank and fuel economy is combined 11.1 (L/100km) (US mpg 21.19) http://www.landrover.co.uk/vehicles/defender/pricing-and-specifications.html and http://www.landrover.de/vehicles/defender/specifications.html

 

[Omar Brannstrom]

We have to think of the cost. Here in Sweden a Landrover Defender 110 cost about 10 000 us dollars more than my fully equipt Rubicon unlimited. If the Landrover defender would have all the stuff a Wrangler has like airbags, auto rear windows, three 12v outlets, navigation, music system, air condition system etc it would offcourse be much more expensive.

So you want your Wrangler to be bigger, have better payload, have diesel like a Defender, but it comes to a cost. The wrangler have to be buildt bigger, needs a sturdier frame, needs axels like Dana 60 or more, would need a big turbodiesel, bigger brakes etc.

A hardrock Rubicon starts from 40 000 US dollars, maybe the example above would start from 60 000 US dollars or more ??

But it could be a intresting special option for thoose how can afford it and it has offcourse be some economic in it for Jeep. Then we have the fuel consumption???

Just speculating

 

[OCD Overland]

I'm confident that we're going to see a larger Wrangler alongside what we have now. We know that they are adding an additional production line, and we also know that the new line will be tooled for Ram pickups for the initial year. It makes a lot of sense that when they move the pickup production after that first year that they maintain most of the tooling and build a line of larger Wrangler branded pickups and SUVs on the Ram chassis.