ujoint
Supporting Sponsor
Departure angle shouldn't be a worry on these rigs. I have customers with 4x4 vans that put them places they probably shouldn't be and they're just fine.
Ditto!
Ditto!
What would you buy for $40k?
- Thread starter markley
- Start date
luthj
Engineer In Residence
Expect to spend close to 1000 hours for a full featured build out with plumbing, electrical and cabinetry. More money tossed at the van will cut this number down. If you don't mind rough but functional, you can get a usable van with most of your needs in 500 hours, but that's pushing it. You will also need to do lots of research for components etc which I am not counting. My build is quite complicated, so I am looking at 1.5k hours between my wife and I. But I made almost everything myself. Basically I have spent most every weekend for the last 2 years on my van.
So far I agree the 5.4 is a strong engine, we have Dana 60 rear axle just checked the mileage on some two lane with very little stopping and running 55-58 mph 16.1mpg, the 1st trip out on x-way running 68-74 with the gas that came in her (Don't know how old it was) little hilly she ran a strong 13.7 mpg.
Wow..at first I thought 1000 hours was crazy high...then I looked at your build thread. Very Impressive!! My goal is to have one that is functional in about 6 months (working evenings/weekends) for an inaugural month long trek throughout the northwester US and Canada, then get into the finer details.
luthj
Engineer In Residence
Definitely doable. But it will depend heavily on your level of complexity. Every custom thing that needs to be made will take 2-3x longer compared to a design you can borrow/buy/steal from another source. Depending on the vehicle you choose, there may be aftermarket cabinetry available from places like RB components, sportsmobile van specialties etc.
The issue with doing half a build, then doing the finish work later is that you will add a decent amount of labor. Plenty of stuff will need disassembled and reworked to complete the finish process. The plus side is that you will have a much better idea of what you need. In fact, I suggest you throw some gear and a bed in your van and use it some. Do this before your build out. You would be surprised on the changes you will make. Good luck.
Bikersmurf
Expedition Leader
If I lived next door to Ujoint I'd not spend the extra money on a Quigley.
Just for example, this https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inven...=false&filtersModified=true#listing=141395450
is way lower mileage and likely closer to your needs. The 5k less would have you well on your way to 4x4 or what not. Personally, 4x4 so I can say I've got it isn't worth it to me. Especially given that my 8'3" (high) x 88" (wide) Ambo won't fit any of the places I take my 4x4 that I can't go in 2wd. It needs a road not a skidder trail so there's no point for me.
I love the 7.3... Wouldn't want it any other way... Wouldn't risk a 6.0 for any reason... V10 is too thirsty in my books. Just did a road trip... Forget 10 mpg... 18 mpg(US)+ at 60-70 mph. If I was lighter on the pedal I'm sure it would do even better. However I feel that's pretty good for a large 8500+ lb brick.
I'd build out an Ambo if I was I your shoes... It's only 5'6" inside which wouldn't be ideal for you, but I'm 6'4" so I'm sure you could also manage.
Just for example, this https://www.cargurus.com/Cars/inven...=false&filtersModified=true#listing=141395450
is way lower mileage and likely closer to your needs. The 5k less would have you well on your way to 4x4 or what not. Personally, 4x4 so I can say I've got it isn't worth it to me. Especially given that my 8'3" (high) x 88" (wide) Ambo won't fit any of the places I take my 4x4 that I can't go in 2wd. It needs a road not a skidder trail so there's no point for me.
I love the 7.3... Wouldn't want it any other way... Wouldn't risk a 6.0 for any reason... V10 is too thirsty in my books. Just did a road trip... Forget 10 mpg... 18 mpg(US)+ at 60-70 mph. If I was lighter on the pedal I'm sure it would do even better. However I feel that's pretty good for a large 8500+ lb brick.
I'd build out an Ambo if I was I your shoes... It's only 5'6" inside which wouldn't be ideal for you, but I'm 6'4" so I'm sure you could also manage.
bknudtsen
Expedition Leader
OP,
If I lived that close to UJOR, I'd be there everyday at 5pm...
As far as mpg's go, my experience with a lifted E350 is that there is a line at 68-70 mph that when you push past, it doesn't matter what motor you have, wind resistance is what affects your mileage. The first trip in my van (several thousand miles) netted 15ish mpg with a 6.0 diesel, with the lowest (13mpg) in Montana going 75mph. I spent several thousand $$$$ on the motor first though, and I still never fully trusted it not to leave us stranded. That would have paid for a lot of gas in a 5.4 or V-10 van and the final mpg's wouldn't have been too different. Unless your talking 2wd 7.3 PSD, it all comes out in the wash.
If I were to do it again, I'd go 5.4 for a lightweight RB explorer rig, or V-10 for a EB camper. Reliability is way more valuable than mpg's in my book. Biggest thing is get out there and use it!
And go hang out at UJOR sooner than later.
Brad
If I lived that close to UJOR, I'd be there everyday at 5pm...
As far as mpg's go, my experience with a lifted E350 is that there is a line at 68-70 mph that when you push past, it doesn't matter what motor you have, wind resistance is what affects your mileage. The first trip in my van (several thousand miles) netted 15ish mpg with a 6.0 diesel, with the lowest (13mpg) in Montana going 75mph. I spent several thousand $$$$ on the motor first though, and I still never fully trusted it not to leave us stranded. That would have paid for a lot of gas in a 5.4 or V-10 van and the final mpg's wouldn't have been too different. Unless your talking 2wd 7.3 PSD, it all comes out in the wash.
If I were to do it again, I'd go 5.4 for a lightweight RB explorer rig, or V-10 for a EB camper. Reliability is way more valuable than mpg's in my book. Biggest thing is get out there and use it!
And go hang out at UJOR sooner than later.
Brad
This looks like a possibility! I'm not familiar with high tops on these vans, but what would you guess to be the inside height on this one?
45Kevin
Adventurer
A locker in the rear of a 2wd is a powerful thing.
If you are only doing forestry roads and light wheeling, a selectable locker in the rear will get you as far as a 4wd with open diffs and save you thousands of $$$.
The fords have better clearance stock than the others so that might be a good choice, although if you are jonesing for a diesel, the 2500 and 3500 chevs with duramax might be a good choice.
With your budget and careful planning you should be able to get what you need. Decisions, decisions.
If you are only doing forestry roads and light wheeling, a selectable locker in the rear will get you as far as a 4wd with open diffs and save you thousands of $$$.
The fords have better clearance stock than the others so that might be a good choice, although if you are jonesing for a diesel, the 2500 and 3500 chevs with duramax might be a good choice.
With your budget and careful planning you should be able to get what you need. Decisions, decisions.
Toolman
Explorer
10-12 MPG no matter what you do, tow a tug boat or coast down a hill with a tail wind. The system creates the criteria, from what I have found there's nothing that improves fuel economy better than being parked.
That being said, I wouldn't trade it for a diesel, unless it was in a Coach getting pushed along
That being said, I wouldn't trade it for a diesel, unless it was in a Coach getting pushed along
Accrete
Explorer
Greetings, and best wishes on the hunt for the rig/project. I enjoyed reading through the replies and thought i'd share from a slightly different perspective.
We were Volvo AWD peeps due to the nearly year round poor road conditions on the Oregon Coast. We also had a 1980 WESTY for a bit < fell in luv with the simplicity of a rolling-dry-cabin light build. And when it came time to upgrade from a 4x4 TACO to a rig with more living space we settled on the idea of building on the 1/2 ton Chevy AWD van platform.
We purchased the stripped cargo van in October of 2010 (then and now image link), spent ~3~ evenings per week for the first two months installing the insulation (this is a high top fiberine mod so we have ~5'10"~ headroom inside), the soft walls (marine grade hull liner fabric. still looks new after 6 seasons), and bed platform draft out of wood (we planned to have our upfitter -vanspecialties- remake in their manner once we settled on a config.). We went out on our first adventure in February of 2011. We tweaked the interior ideas to the point that in winter 2013 we took the van to VS and they built the upgraded bed/closets, BUT to us the van was totally useable before the VS rework, we just wanted to finish off the bed platform and closets with a pro-feel.
On Philosophy of Use: The idea was to do most of the work ourselves and in the end have a sort of rolling dry cabin without all the fuss/expense/maintenance of traditional on-board RV systems. It is just my wife and I (she is 5'3" I'm 5'8") so just two seats in a cargo van, with a permanent bed and storage for a high quality ice chest and camp gear, simple dry-cabin style cooking (no plumbing and we cook outside _image link_), DIY/WagBag style potty, manual shower -details link- (again no plumbing to deal with).
So that sort of sounds to many like going back to the covered wagon days, and there is some truth to that view! BUT, for us, the simplicity of "systems" in a build like this can enhance/promote ease of mind and maintenance.
That's a quick reply, in summary... ~3 months of ~3~ nights a week~ for us to feel like we had a cozy, useable rig.
Oh, a thought on cutting the roof? You can see in the image below there is a shelf in the rear (there is a matching one above cab). Shelves were created by leaving the rear and front ~3~ft of stock roof in place cut to include the adjoining pillar/roof-beams. They make excellent areas to store light items like clothes/etc...with the added bonus of some of the original roof/rigidity/integrity in design.
This van is also my wife's daily driver on her big ~10 mile round trip commute. SHE LUVS IT...
We get ~15/17~ and even saw 19mpg with a tail wind driving up i84 on the Columbia River to Hood Canal ; ) Oh to pray for a tailwind!!
PS....Your OP? If I had 40K and was doing this all over? As others have stated sometimes used is a nice solution and there are rigs out there that would be a nice platform to build on. If buying new? I would, and have looked at, the LWB EB HR Transit. Those nearly vertical walls would make a build so much easier!
: ) Thom
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86scotty
Cynic
Ha! Best quote ever for a V10.
Markley, if the Chevy AWD like Accrete's is big enough it would be an awesome all-arounder for you probably. I'd love to find one too.
On the V10, I recently bought a small (25') class B motorhome with the V10. It gets 11 mpg and weighs 12,500 so keep in mind it's mostly the more modified 4x4's that get worse mileage. Higher profile, higher ground clearance and bigger tires (including different gearing) costs you mileage.
Anyway, I'm curious to see what you decide to do.
86cj
Explorer
Hard to argue with this advice it is truly a van to be admired, very reliable and tough. The V10 provides a quieter and cleaner smelling camping experience, we see alot of sensitive wildlife on the two track and around camp when dispersed camping so we try to keep a low profile. I did consider just such a van when we bought our AWD Van and still can't say I don't want one.
I have to admit from a Jeep world perspective the E350 straight axle 4x4 with 35's is like a "REAL JEEP" and the AWD 1500 Van is like a Cherokee with a 2" lift and 31" tires. So you have your built Real Jeep that you wrench on and think about all the time and one day a family keeps passing you driving a near stock super reliable Cherokee on the same trails having the greatest time of their life. They are on all the same trails and only thinking about the fun they are having and I am thinking about more work I could do to the Real Jeep instead of actually camping, yes I have been there. Are they naive to the calamity coming their way or are you just overbuilding for the real world conditions? What they get around 20MPG and I get around 12MPG with the same 4.0 litre six?
Most places open to some great camping don't require that much capability and an AWD conversion van would get you out in the back country simply by writing the check. We mostly just enjoy our van after spending a little over a month of free time putting together a basic interior on a passenger van. The reliability of the GM Van is really hard to beat and parts are everywhere somewhat due to GM's habit of sharing parts across models, the frame is AWD Van only but alot other parts swap. If you live by endless rugged trails get the E350 4x4, if you have to drive a thousand miles to the trailhead maybe the easy to live with 18mpg AWD Van can make you happy.