Running the truck in idle? for power

[codename607]

I don't have an elaborate dual battery or solar system on my truck, just a basic Goal Zero Yeti to power things in the back of my camper. On trips that are longer than 2 days(which is rare) I tend to run the Goal Zero down to it's lowest wattage and need to turn the truck on to charge it.

How long should I run the truck at idle before it could cause unusual damage? 1-2 hours?

 

[DaveInDenver]

I don't think this is an electrical question technically. From an alternator standpoint you can run it at idle forever if you want with the expectation that it's producing less than ideal power. If it's enough to recharge your battery/batteries then let 'er idle all day. However doing this may be either fine or bad. A diesel can usually do this without hurting anything. A gasoline engine can idle for a few minutes here and there no problem. You could in a pinch probably idle it for a while. But doing it regularly may range from just mildly reducing its life all the way up to ruining it in a few hours, just depends. Gasoline engines at idle tend to have low oil pressure, run hot or inefficiently leading to carbon build up. Too many variables to say yes/no. Personally being a Toyota owner, I wouldn't idle a Tacoma or 4Runner for that long regularly but I doubt letting it idle for an hour is acutely going to kill it. Mitsubishi maybe, I dunno.

 

[codename607]

Carbon build up was something that I was worried about. Seems like that is a major concern from other places that I've read. My last truck was idled for about 30 mins each day and sometimes a lot longer. I traded it in around 70,000 miles so I never had it long enough to see any affects.

I tried researching this topic on big rig forms but most of those trucks are diesel, and as you mentioned can handle large amounts of idle.

I'm just trying to think of functional solutions to power while out on the trail. Instead of buying a generator I'll just use my engine. Obviously it's not that easy.

 

[DaveInDenver]

A small gasoline generator is a great comparison. They run at their peak point normally or idle back to a lower RPM. In both cases the engine is designed to work at those RPMs and the cooling is with that expectation. Our trucks are designed with different criteria, which is they aren't parked and left to idle for long periods so they don't necessarily work well doing that. But if you follow idling one morning during a trip with 8 hours on the Interstate later it may be just fine ultimately. It's just my $0.02 that it's safer to supplement your 3.5L with a solar panel in camp instead as a standard procedure. I think any advice you get will be anecdotal rather than substantial. We've all gotten away with it but at the same time Toyota isn't going to cover the cost if it does have issues with carbon build up.

 

[ITTOG]

I had a generator die on day one of a nine day camping trip. I ran my 07 Tundra about six hours per day. This was around 2012. Truck is still going strong and has 176,000 miles on it.

 

[john61ct]

Get some solar, folding blanket style if not mounted

 

[762X39]

My 2004 F150XL work truck had to idle for 17 hours a day at the side of the highway for 6 months while we were terminating fiber optic cable where the AC power wasn't yet up and running (Sarnia, the 15 km run to the Bluewater Bridge). I ran a 1kw inverter for power to run the fiber optic fusion splicer and lighting (yeah, a lot of double shifts because I was in charge). I simply followed the severe duty service regimen in the owners manual. The engine was in perfect condition when I retired my beloved truck. For its entire life it was serviced using the Severe Duty guidelines. I gave the truck away after 350,000 km to a farmer.

 

[luthj]

Post 2006 diesels do not like idling for long periods. The dpf can saturate, and egr soot can build up in places. As long as you drive 20min on the highway afterwards, it's okay occasionally. Gasoline power plants can idle for extended periods with fewer issues. Just change oil sooner if done frequently.

 

[DaveInDenver]

I suppose another data point is cop cars and taxis, which sit idling a whole lot. Do their engines experience early wear? I honestly don't know but if anyone's done qualitative analysis of it I bet Ford has with those fleets in mind. Since that bit of "duh" flashed through my head I've been thinking about it and I bet it's not a problem but following the severe duty schedule when you do makes sense. Would certainly have to follow an hours or time based oil change interval over strictly miles at least.

 

[rayra]

Not a valid data point. Emergency vehicles have a terrible usage cycle for comparison to regular vehicles.
Also bad comparison for anothe rreason, which Im surprised nobody has mentioned yet - emergency vehicles are typically equipped with alternators which have a higher energy output at 'idle'. If the OP intends the discharge / charging he describes, he needs to either hold a higher idle speed for more power output or get such an aftermarket alternator solution. Or Solar. Or a mini generator. Or not run his battery down so far before recharging. Going to cost money whichever course is taken.
The competitive car audio market has a lot of high demand power generation options worth considering / that can 'crossover' to glamping.

here, read this - https://www.ecotechalternators.com/low-rpm-alternators/

 

[luthj]

I strongly doubt a stock GZ unit would pull more than 30A, which is no problem for any modern vehicle at idle. The charge rates depend on the hardware used, wire sizes, alternator voltage for direct charge etc.

As a data point, in the New Zealand cloudy winters, I would idle my sprinter for 15 minutes twice a day, suppling 100A to charge and run my induction cooktop. This avoided low state of charge abuse, as solar charging was next to zero for weeks at a time.


Personally I think a 1000W generator would make more sense for the OPs case (or a few hundred watts of solar).

 

[DaveInDenver]

Not a valid data point. Emergency vehicles have a terrible usage cycle for comparison to regular vehicles

Personally I think a 1000W generator would make more sense for the OPs case (or a few hundred watts of solar).

The biggest 3kW Yeti can do 360 W maximum (30 amps) charging. The Yeti 1250 will accept up to 240 watts on its Powerpole input and the regular charging input tops at 10 A / 160 watts. So depends on which he has, but even the biggest one will be well within a Tacoma or 4Runner alternator profile at idle unless you bypass the built-in electronics and charge the battery directly. I have a stock 130 A Denso on mine and it does ~60 A at idle. The use comparison I'm referring to is w.r.t. carbon build up and how relatively hard on the engine is idling, which a cop car will do the majority of it's life. Whether that prematurely wears them out or not is my question.

 

[luthj]

A modern gasoline engine does not get carbon buildup. The emissions controls keep the mixture good, and the engine warm, even at idle. The oil needs changed earlier, and the hours will affect things like the water pump, belt drive, and engine wear. But this will be slower than under way, so the impact will be pretty minor.

Gas engines also have fairly high EGTs even at idle (due to strict mixture control required by the engine type). Diesels have a lot more air, even at idle. So at idle they have low egts (less than 400F in some cases). Combined with high EGR flow needed for Nox supression, and low coolant temps (some won't even stay warm in cold weather at idle!), there is a lot more to go wrong with long idle times. The fix here is a high idle option. 1200-1500rpm reduces the risks substantially.

Diesels are a whole different ball game. The wear has little to do with the engine hard parts. Mostly affects the DPF, EGR passages, EGR cooler, and intake carbon build up.

 

[dreadlocks]

A modern gasoline engine does not get carbon buildup.

oh yeah the do, well at least the direct injection ones surely do with no fuel to clean the valve-train and an EGR.. Ive got a gas direct injection thats on its 2nd intake manifold, it has 50k on it and was driven gingerly/lightly most of its life.. now its my work beater and I WOT it every chance I get so I dont have to put a 3rd one on before I get rid of it.

diesel or gas dont matter, its the DI and EGR that will build up a ton of carbon if its not given an Italian tune up regularly.

 

[ITTOG]

Dreadlocks is correct. There is an industry built around pecan shell blasting intakes and heads due to carbon build up. I just saw pictures of a 2017 f150 3.5 EcoBoost with about 20000 miles that looked like it had 300,000 miles.