1973 Wagoneer - Full Size Camping Goodness

[Dr. Marneaus]

So in preparation for HEI and to make up for this EFI and potentially for future electric fans, I went ahead and picked up a powermaster 100amp alternator that is supposedly "bolt in" according to the manufacturer.

Well, long story short, it was not. And i was upset. Supposedly a bolt in replacement for a motorola alternator, in reality it is just a 10SI with a 1" ear at the top....and still presented all the issues of fitting a 10SI.

However, after a an evening of work I achieved a satisfactory result by simply widening the tension slot on the bracket, then switching back to my AC belt which resulted in the alternator needing less movement for proper tension. The biggest issue with this is that I need to remove the upper bolt in order to get the belt on and off because its that tight.

I placed a few strategic washers to eat up the bracket space, and to help better align the pulley. I'm not 100.00000% pleased with the alignment but its very minimally off and im not sure if the old one was like this or not. I could always add a washer behind the pulley.

Got it all in and wired. everything runs smooth with no visible issues.

On both cold and hot starts the truck hits a high enough RPM for the alternator to self excite and kick on.

The good news is now i have double the available amperage. This alternator bench tested at 83 idle amps, 95 cruise amps, and 115 amps top end.

The other good news is massive voltage increase even over the last round of improvements when i did the ammeter bypass. At idle i have 14.5v at the battery, 14.6 at the alt.My downstream (after fuse box) idle voltage is 14.0-14.2 depending on idle conditions.

I kicked on my AC compressor, AC blower, heater blower, and high beams. Still have 14.2 or 14.3v at the battery and 13.9v down stream according to my EFI handheld unit.. I've never seen my interior voltage gauge hit 14v before today, and often it would register as low as 11v or less when the blinker was on.

 

[lumpskie]

Wow, that sounds like a big improvement! Congratulations!

 

[Dr. Marneaus]

So a few minor changes recently that relate to the EFI.

First things first, Soon as i had everything up and running I dropped in a 100 amp 1 wire alternator. I went 1 wire because it likely wouldnt act or perform any different than my 1973 setup. This also included all new battery cables as seen above and a fancy pants alternator to starter cable that is fine strand.

Next, I finally got my hand held display extension cord and routed everything into the cab so I can have real time display on most of the vitals. It took forever to find the right grommet to fit the 1 1/4" hole i was going to drill. I found one, and drilled a hole just above of the existing firewall hole where all my crap was routed to begin with. That hole had wires for my tach, CB, a tube for my temp sensor, for my oil pressure, and a few others running through it, it was unprotected and looked like at some point in history a wire had shorted out on the metal. I added a grommet here too. Now its just ttach, CB, PA wire, and oil pressure tube. (dont mind the other wiring, i still havent done anything to clean it up since installing the EFI, waiting until my HEI is finished to tidy everything up)


Removed some crappy wiring, removed the 2 unnecessary gauges (voltmeter and engine temp) since both of these are displayed on my hand held now. I do intend to eventually do the voltmeter mod to my cluster, and it would be fantastic if i could get the temp gauge and oil pressure gauge running again...)


Until i get my "new" radio in and the glovebox insert from MSD, here's where it'll live. Once i have the glovebox I'll drill another hole and do another grommet so it'll permanently live within the glovebox. I have enough slack to comfortably be able to handle and use the unit while sitting in the jeep. Right now, I like having it right where I can see it.


next stop is HEI!

 

[Zeiderman]

So how does the display work, as in how does it receive the readings, and what else is it capable of reading? Very cool piece of tech.

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[Dr. Marneaus]

So how does the display work, as in how does it receive the readings, and what else is it capable of reading? Very cool piece of tech.

Sent from my SM-T230NU using Tapatalk

It's the handheld unit for the EFI. Its used for programming and adjusting the EFI but it does have readouts. RPM, AFR, Voltage, Coolant temp, timing control advance, and fuel pressure are the "gauges" it shows. However the detailed info includes a ton more like IAC count, injector duty, all kinds of little detailed info.

So, what sucks is that my fancy new alternator went out. Not sure if its because of the jeep or because its a POS alternator. Only putting out 12v at the back of the alt. Powermaster wants me to mail it to them on their dime. I dont think I want to do that. Will probably just return it replace it and see if it happens again.

 

[lumpskie]

Bummer on the alternator failure. Keep us posted!

 

[jeepdreamer]

So Dr M,
Yours is essentially a 4bbl tbi, right? I saw a 2bbl Holley for sale and wondered if you thought that would be enough for a bone stock 91 grand waggy? If not, how different/difficult to get the 4bbl unit and would it run off the same 2bbl harness, computer, etc??
Basically, is it worth it??

Sent from my K010 using Tapatalk

 

[lumpskie]

So Dr M,
Yours is essentially a 4bbl tbi, right? I saw a 2bbl Holley for sale and wondered if you thought that would be enough for a bone stock 91 grand waggy? If not, how different/difficult to get the 4bbl unit and would it run off the same 2bbl harness, computer, etc??
Basically, is it worth it??

Sent from my K010 using Tapatalk

I can't answer your exact question but I can say this: My stock 2 barrel carb give my '89 a lot of "Get up and go". So, I'd guess that a stock replacement 2 barrel EFI unit would do the same. Plus, if you need more fuel, you can always go with a bigger injector. (Aren't the 90s GM conversions based off of 2 injectors?)

 

[jeepdreamer]

I can't answer your exact question but I can say this: My stock 2 barrel carb give my '89 a lot of "Get up and go". So, I'd guess that a stock replacement 2 barrel EFI unit would do the same. Plus, if you need more fuel, you can always go with a bigger injector. (Aren't the 90s GM conversions based off of 2 injectors?)

Yup, as far as I know howell and holley use basically the 2bbl design. Wife's 91 "field find" has been sitting for 10+years. Fuel pump diaphragm had dry rotted (not surprising) and I believe the carbs accelerator pump has too. I'd love to go fi via a 2bbl tbi for ease of starting etc since it will be her winter ride. I'll do some more research and see if what I found is a deal or not. Here's her waggy..."Walter". Haha.

 

[lumpskie]

Yup, as far as I know howell and holley use basically the 2bbl design. Wife's 91 "field find" has been sitting for 10+years. Fuel pump diaphragm had dry rotted (not surprising) and I believe the carbs accelerator pump has too. I'd love to go fi via a 2bbl tbi for ease of starting etc since it will be her winter ride. I'll do some more research and see if what I found is a deal or not. Here's her waggy..."Walter". Haha.

Dude, that's a good looking rig! Looks like it's almost rust free! I'm so worried about rust out east that I'm thinking about buying another vehicle and garaging the Waggy all winter. If you've got ideas on how you're going to deal with rust, post up on my thread! (Sorry for a bit of a threadjack there, Doc!)

 

[Comanche Scott]

It's the handheld unit for the EFI. Its used for programming and adjusting the EFI but it does have readouts. RPM, AFR, Voltage, Coolant temp, timing control advance, and fuel pressure are the "gauges" it shows. However the detailed info includes a ton more like IAC count, injector duty, all kinds of little detailed info.

So, what sucks is that my fancy new alternator went out. Not sure if its because of the jeep or because its a POS alternator. Only putting out 12v at the back of the alt. Powermaster wants me to mail it to them on their dime. I dont think I want to do that. Will probably just return it replace it and see if it happens again.

It's not uncommon for these alternators to have an internal regulator failure. When you put the new one on, just ensure the case has a clean metal to metal contact for the ground.
Also make sure there is a good clean ground from battery to engine, and engine to chassis.

 

[Dr. Marneaus]

So Dr M,
Yours is essentially a 4bbl tbi, right? I saw a 2bbl Holley for sale and wondered if you thought that would be enough for a bone stock 91 grand waggy? If not, how different/difficult to get the 4bbl unit and would it run off the same 2bbl harness, computer, etc??
Basically, is it worth it??

Sent from my K010 using Tapatalk

there seem to be alot of folks running 2bbl EFI setups. anything that is more or less a chevy TBI system (Hamilton, Howell, Holley, TBI junk yard swap) will be a two barrel setup, which you can run an either a 2bbl or 4bbl intake.

Considering 350's and 454's and al lthat jazz ran on this system....the answer is yes.

However, the new systems such as the MSD atomic, Holley Sniper, FiTech, and a few others are more or less self contained, self learning, user adjustable, dont require burning in chips, have no big computer box to mount, dont need massive holes drilled in the firewall, etc. They are alot more user friendly, alot more clean.

If you dont have a factory 4bbl intake....a 2bbl is fine. I dont know if you can go 4bbl carb to 2bbl intake, or if it just works the other way around. I've always had a 4bbl intake. Your 91 will be 2bbl.

The "worth it" part has nothing to do with power from my standpoint, b ut to do with reliability, drivability, and efficiency to an extent.

 

[Dr. Marneaus]

Dude, that's a good looking rig! Looks like it's almost rust free! I'm so worried about rust out east that I'm thinking about buying another vehicle and garaging the Waggy all winter. If you've got ideas on how you're going to deal with rust, post up on my thread! (Sorry for a bit of a threadjack there, Doc!)

get it oiled/under coated. But yeah, i'd probably park it.

Wanna take a look under my 2004 dakota that lived in NH from new until 2015? Not pretty, not fun to work on. boddy was rotted out pretty bad. My brother cut out most of the rust, put in new metal and painted the whole thing more or less.

Here's the bumper when it got to me:



month or two before i got it:




yaaaaaay rusty.


muffler was rotted out and broke about a week after i got it, lol. all new exhaust now though


S'all good though....

 

[Dr. Marneaus]

It's not uncommon for these alternators to have an internal regulator failure. When you put the new one on, just ensure the case has a clean metal to metal contact for the ground.
Also make sure there is a good clean ground from battery to engine, and engine to chassis.

Thanks Scott! The mor eI searched and read the more crap I saw about powermaster. Seems like a ton of people have them DOA or crap out within a year or two. Great.

I have a brand new battery to block ground (neg terminal goes to the AC compressor, which is factory), 2 grounding straps that bridge from the engine side of the motor mount to the frame horn side of the motor mount (one strap on each side of engine), I have a ground from battery to body, and I'm actually going to be adding a grounding strap from the intake to the firewall since I dont have one.

I also plan to "clean" the paint off the alternator bracket in the areas where the bolts touch and the mounting ear goes, just to make sure.

My new alt should be here today.

 

[BajaDent]

Dr. M

We use to have one of those as a tiver house vehicle. The funny thing is that it had a toggle switch on the dash that didnt go to anything. I was maybe 6 or 7 and ask my dad what it was... i was told that it was the turbo. So there i was riding front center (no seat belt) and i would flip that toggle up. Not knowing at the time my dad would mash the gas and would not let up until either i or my dad flipped it back down. Man my dad had some fun with that switch...

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