2nd gen taco All Pro vs. Dakar...

[battleaxe]

I have AllPro Expos on my truck. Garbage springs, and Tracy @ All Pro is a lying, scumbag, piece of trash. (And that's a compliment.)

Read this thread: https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/all-pro-your-customer-service-is-terrible.530306/. They were banned as a vendor from Tacoma World as a result of that.

And there are many more, like this one: https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/allpro-offroad-screwed-me.426645/ and this one: https://www.tacomaworld.com/threads/allpro-offroad-teamed-up-with-trail-gear.537341/

I've recently received OME Dakar springs, which will be going on the truck in the next few months.

Dear LORD... I never was a big fan of AllPro to begin with, but that's just 58 pages of rage.

 

[tacollie]

I can't even remember 10+ years ago??? It may of not of been India...maybe another country. I'll have to check when I toss on my other set of wheels.


So are the "suspension manufactures" all using Chinese steel stock and different spring shops?


Those Deavers I broke were the 5 leafs I bought from Wheelers, at the time I was looking for minimal lift, really don't like the look of lifted trucks. Ideally would do custom under axle springs with zero lift and 31" tires. But I am cheap SOB and went with OME...which have too much lift for my liking.

If I remember correctly they used to be OME springs and when they started outsourcing they became the Dakar springs. I also wanted less lift. I tried the HD wheelers springs and even added an OME aal but after only 10 months the springs were completely useless. This is my third truck with Dakar springs and I've been happy with them every time.

Allpro has grown a lot over years and moved across states. There are bound to be issue.

 

[Clutch]

Meh, stick with SOA so that you're not relying on u-bolts to hold the axle on. Plus, losing clearance is kind of the antithesis of driving off highway. It's not usually about 4x4, it's about dragging low hanging stuff.

Me, the reason I lift is so I can fit under the truck on a creeper without needing to pull out the jack and stands. It's about safety and not smacking my melon on the danged frame rails.

Landcruisers seem to do awfully dang well with SUA...

 

[DaveInDenver]

Landcruisers seem to do awfully dang well with SUA...

I'm aware of that. Toyota learned from their early mistakes when they built the Hilux, the most perfectly balanced piece of machinery man has or will ever know.

 

[Clutch]

If I remember correctly they used to be OME springs and when they started outsourcing they became the Dakar springs. I also wanted less lift. I tried the HD wheelers springs and even added an OME aal but after only 10 months the springs were completely useless. This is my third truck with Dakar springs and I've been happy with them every time.

Allpro has grown a lot over years and moved across states. There are bound to be issue.

I broke the stock, had it repaired...broke the repair...went with the 5 leaf Deavers...since I wanted minimal lift...broke those. Ok...ok...I am done breaking springs...what is the heaviest spring I can get? The OME HD's fit the bill. Couple 100 thousand miles on those and still haven't broke them.

 

[Clutch]

I'm aware of that. Toyota learned from their early mistakes when they built the Hilux, the most perfectly balanced piece of machinery man has or will ever know.

As you know 2WD's had SUA. Much much better payload too. Yeah yeah...no heavy 4WD bits...but could be had as a 1 Ton.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Why exactly do you keep your truck? There is almost nothing you seem to like about it. You forum name should be Goldilocks. This one's too expensive. This one's too tall. This one needs more payload. This one's got an automatic. Man, life's too short.

 

[Clutch]

Why exactly do you keep your truck? There is almost nothing you seem to like about it. You forum name should be Goldilocks. This one's too expensive. This one's too tall. This one needs more payload. This one's got an automatic. Man, life's too short.

What are you talking about? I love my truck...why I refuse to get another. It is about perfect. All the complaints are that I can't get a brand new version of it. Which what all that Goldilocks complaining about the new stuff is....man, just give me a brand new one of what I already have! Cause I am tired of fixing this one!

Would of been nice to replace the clapped out stock suspension with a kit that doesn't lift it, but you can't do that with the rear. You can with the front with adjustable coil-overs.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Finding zero lift springs with a higher rate that don't ride like you've bolted on I-beams will be difficult since springs don't work that way and it's made tougher since Tacoma rear springs don't start with much arch. The Northwest Offroad HD replacement springs I had on the '91 first were very HD and gave just a little lift. They rated for +700 lbs, which I think was on the diving board overload that was as thick as the rest of the pack itself.

With the topper off the truck had definite rake. It wasn't quite stinkbug obvious but their static height with a light load was definitely parabolic. And, man, stiff didn't fully describe the ride without the 'Nest on there. In comparison I absolutely loved my OME + one AAL, which squatted just a little more but the extra arch in 2" of lift made a difference in ride quality.

 

[Clutch]

Finding zero lift springs with a higher rate that don't ride like you've bolted on I-beams will be difficult since springs don't work that way and it's made tougher since Tacoma rear springs don't start with much arch. The Northwest Offroad HD replacement springs I had on the '91 first were very HD and gave just a little lift. They rated for +700 lbs, which I think was on the diving board overload that was as thick as the rest of the pack itself.

With the topper off the truck had definite rake. It wasn't quite stinkbug obvious but their static height with a light load was definitely parabolic. And, man, stiff didn't fully describe the ride without the 'Nest on there. In comparison I absolutely loved my OME + one AAL, which squatted just a little more but the extra arch in 2" of lift made a difference in ride quality.

Yeah next to impossible, instead of getting custom under springs made (even looked into using LC packs) my cheap solution was to have 20 gallons of water "ballast" by the tailgate when it was unloaded for daily duties. When I took the 1st Wildernest off and tossed back on my SnugTop...rake and ride was horrible. Tried taking out the add-a-leaf...made it too soft, put that back in and took out one of the overloads...which made it about perfect. Bought the 2nd Nest...needed to throw the secondary overload back in. It does have a slight bit of rake now (which is what you want unloaded, even though it looks goofy)...but when loaded they do seem about perfect now since they have a couple hundred thousand miles of settling on them.

They were awful when they were new though.

Total Chaos does have a spring under kit for the 2nd gens. Nothing for my 1st gen though.

Better up travel and articulation than SOA.

http://www.chaosfab.com/2005-2015-Tacoma-Mid-Travel-Rear-Suspension-Kit-86450HD

 

[DaveInDenver]

Archive Garage also has SUA kits for 2nd-3rd gen Tacos. You could reach out to them and see if they can whip something up for the 1st gens?

The compression vs tension shackle arrangement makes it impractical. The rear suspensions aren't really that similar. The 2nd/3rd gen is actually better for carrying loads than articulation because the shackle travel gives you a rising rate, so a SUA helps make it more like a shackle flip to a 1st gen style without as much body roll and axle wrap. Also you lose a lot of clearance, which I gather isn't something desert racers worry about.

Doing a SUA on a 1st gen would result in a really soft rear suspension, like an FJ40, unless you lower the whole ride height to take some arch out of the leafs like the 2WD truck have. An FJ40 I can tell you can get *really* tippy if you load them with lift springs. It's not a small reason why I sold mine for the pickup. I could never really find a good balance, either it rode like a buckboard wagon with stiff springs or it squatted and wobbled. Some of that was wheelbase of course, though.

BTW, I don't buy the articulation argument because since forever Cruiser guys have been doing SOA to get more articulation. I think it's a mix of things, in their cases they can get lift and run softer springs while on Tacomas the SUA lets you run longer springs that aren't so flat.

 

[DaveInDenver]

Unrelated question, but you posted the photo so it's your own fault...

How much of a pain in the butt was it securing bicycles on the roof of a tall vehicle? Considering ditching my hitch rack in favour of carrying bikes on the roof...

Well, I ditched roof racks for hitch racks because it was a PITA getting bikes on the roof. The final straw was when my wife ran her bike into the garage door and ripped the factory roof rack of her Jetta. We run 1Up racks now, which I absolutely love.

 

[Clutch]

Archive Garage also has SUA kits for 2nd-3rd gen Tacos. You could reach out to them and see if they can whip something up for the 1st gens?

Probably could.

Giant Off-road sells a link killer spring set.


https://giantmotorsports.com/index.php/product-category/long-travel-kits/


I am just not that into it anymore. It was back when I was hot for prerunners and whatnot. Now stock is perfectly fine. Throwing a bunch of money at a truck that is only going to be marginally good at off-road doesn’t make sense. When the money is better spent on a dirt bike or UTV. That will smoke any prerunnered out truck.

It is one of those things...where does it stop??? It starts with a spacer lift...then maybe mid-travel...well might as well do long travel...well...better hack off the rear of the frame and link it...and beam the front. It gets to the point where you pretty much ruin the truck part of the vehicle...might as well just buy something like UTV that was built from the factory for offroad.

I also liked the look of stadium trucks...low slung but with killer suspension. Like many of my ramblings it is one of those "what-ifs" that will never happen with my bank account. The old stadium trucks had some crazy suspension....canitlever torsion bar.

http://offroadaction.ca/2011/07/27/ivan-stewart-toyota-stadium-off-road-race-truck-restoration/

 

[Clutch]

Well, I ditched roof racks for hitch racks because it was a PITA getting bikes on the roof. The final straw was when my wife ran her bike into the garage door and ripped the factory roof rack of her Jetta. We run 1Up racks now, which I absolutely love.

Same here, ditched the roof rack...and now do a hitch rack.

 

[bkg]

I'm aware of that. Toyota learned from their early mistakes when they built the Hilux, the most perfectly balanced piece of machinery man has or will ever know.

Getting very deep in here....