OverlandRockwell
Observer
Agreed. AEDs are great but you need ACLS as well, and even under ideal conditions ACLS is less than 15% effective, and that is a very generous number.
AED for expedition use?
- Thread starter pugslyyy
- Start date
redneckdan
New member
Yeah the odds are not good, some times it works, mostly it doesn't. I'm 0 for 11, but most of my calls are back country. First one was a lightning strike at a beach when I was 14.
Look at it this way. You need to triage your money/time. OP, do you already have EMT level training, with lots of experience and a full basic medical kit with all the bells and whistles? Then yeah, maybe an AED would be the cherry on top. If you don't even have basic red cross first aid, maybe a couple moldy bandaids in the glove box and get weak knees at the sight of a paper cut...you have better, more effective places to spend your money and time than on an AED. A tourinquet costs $20 and the latest Mayo research shows a 98% success rate when properly applied, just a comparison. I would spend that $1000 towards WFR (or next level if you already have WFR) rather than an AED.
pugslyyy
Expedition Vehicle Engineer Guy
Other than the Army buddy-aid experience I have BLS/CPR and am doing the NOLS WFA class in a few weeks.
I see lots of groups deciding to carry AEDs without all the experience you mention which was why I asked.
redneckdan
New member
I gave it as an analogy not a shopping list. Two extremes where most people fall somewhere in the middle.
Good to hear that you are pursuing more medical training. Not enough people do that.
Good to hear that you are pursuing more medical training. Not enough people do that.
Hilldweller
SE Expedition Society
I carry a Phillips Heart Start and a blow-out kit.
Drove an ambulance back in the 80's and maintain my first aid/CPR/AED certs.
I've used the blow-kit to save accident victims several times (commuting) but have never needed the AED. Hope I never do...
Drove an ambulance back in the 80's and maintain my first aid/CPR/AED certs.
I've used the blow-kit to save accident victims several times (commuting) but have never needed the AED. Hope I never do...
Oscar Mike Gulf Yankee
Well-known member
I just carry this:
calicamper
Expedition Leader
Not a bad idea
My dad is 76 and in College his summers he ran pack outfits into the back country. Talking long hours in a saddle. One of his crazy stories was a guy that had a heart attack way out 8hrs out from the end of the road. My dad was pre med at the time. He got the guy back via CPR. Loaded him on the best horse and hauled ass for the end of the road. 4 times my dad pulled that guy down and worked on him. No joke got him out alive and to the ER. Absolutely my dad would say AED is a great idea. I think many professional outfits pack them today.
My dad is 76 and in College his summers he ran pack outfits into the back country. Talking long hours in a saddle. One of his crazy stories was a guy that had a heart attack way out 8hrs out from the end of the road. My dad was pre med at the time. He got the guy back via CPR. Loaded him on the best horse and hauled ass for the end of the road. 4 times my dad pulled that guy down and worked on him. No joke got him out alive and to the ER. Absolutely my dad would say AED is a great idea. I think many professional outfits pack them today.
craig333
Expedition Leader
I don't carry it when I'm solo but I have a Phillips Heartstart I carry for group trips. My certs are expired. I need to fix that. I also carry a basic trauma kit. I watched a guy roll five times. All the other guys had these tiny first aid kits. Good thing he only got a bump on the head. I wish I'd kept my EMT cert up to date but it was a fair amount of work and after leaving CDF it didn't seem worth it.
I carry a Zoll in my rig most of the time, I've been fortunate/unfortunate enough to use it early one Sunday morning on a local golf course. That gentleman is doing fine granted we had him loaded an ALS bus inside 6 minutes from his initial collapse. Your outcome may vary, this particularly fortunate gentleman was golfing one group in front of a cardiac surgeon, cardiologist, and a former paramedic... quite the spot to suffer a cardiac event indeed. I do carry it in the backcountry on vehicle based trips though I don't expect a miracle
As a former WEMT, I think having an AED would still be helpful. CPR rarely works and AED's are everywhere in the front country and easy to use. At minimum, it could get a persons heart back beating and possibly allow time for survival until the advanced care folks arrive.