An Electric Unimog...

[erstwild]

Hello All-

I have a hypothetical for a somewhat crazy project I have been mulling over and would appreciate it if any of the great folks on this site might be good enough to share their deep and obscure vehicle knowledge with me on something.

Generally (or specifically) speaking, what would it take to re-engine a Mercedes Unimog to utilize an electric motor?

This is for a pleasure project/publicity stunt I have been dying to undertake for a while now. There are some novel non-lithium ion battery chemistries that I have felt deserve way more recognition of their current capabilities, and I would like to build a vehicle to showcase what they are currently capable of delivering in the most extreme conditions imaginable and would like to publicize the companies currently trying to commercialize them if I can.

It would be great to get all your thoughts.

Cheers,
John

 

[Photomike]

I have thought about the same thing, my dream is to have a vehicle that runs without buying fuel. World travels would be a lot more affordable if all you needed was sun

From the research I have done a big part of the equation is aerodynamics. The more aerodynamic the unit is the less power you need, the less power the lighter the battery weight, the lighter battery weight the further the unit will travel with the power that you have onboard.

The problem with most RV type units is that the aerodynamics resemble a brick and a Unimog even more so. Don't get me wrong I would LOVE to see someone do this. Even a hybrid mog would be so much better than we have now. Imagine getting 50 or 100 mpg.... oh to dream!! In fact even a true hybrid van or truck RV type that could get 100mpg would allow me to travel so much further!!!

 

[billiebob]

There is a company in San Diego thats been converting VWs and Porsches to pure electric for decades now. The process is real simple. Likely easier than swapping in an LS. The challenge will be getting enough power to move something as heavy, inefficient as a Unimog.

But simple yes. Pull the rad, engine, tranny. Make a plate to mate the electric motor to transfer case. Trade the gas tanks for batteries, done.

https://www.zelectricmotors.com

 

[billiebob]

 

[greg.potter]

Retrofitting an electric motor in place of the Diesel engine still leaves all the mechanical losses associated with the transmission, transfer case, differentials and portal gear sets. To fully leverage the advantages of using an electric motor it should be direct mounted on the drive axle. This of course means a complete re-design of the suspension, but for off-road applications has the advantage of eliminating the axles and the associated terrain clearance limitations - like Timbren axle less trailer suspension systems.

 

[Tennmogger]

Better have a long extension cord! Even a low hp rated and rather efficient OM352, one of the higher fuel mileage Unimog engines, is rated at 68kW. That 80 hp is barely adequate for road speeds. Equate 68kW to solar cells and batteries. Weight is the enemy, IMHO, as Unimogs are not fast enough to have aerodynamics become significant.

 

[RiderBloke]

I like the idea of a hybrid system at this stage of the electric vehicle development. They have less limitations on distance. (I thought the Volt was a good idea but obviously Chevrolet doesn’t think so any more.The Prius is a proven system.)
Ford has been doing this recently with its pickup, apparently as a first toe in the water idea. See https://www.xlfleet.com/content/technology/
If my Tundra could have that I’d be happy, but not at the price. If my dream ambulance could have that I’d be even happier.


Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

 

[luthj]

Converting to electric is not very complicated. Remove engine, and possibly transmission. Bolt motor (and possibly a reduction gearbox) to the Tcase. Install batteries, motor controller (charger if desired). Then install an air compressor to run your brakes, CTIFS, etc. If you need heat/AC you will need to work out some method of supplying those.

The issue of course is range. You will need a lot of batteries. Think 3 tesla model S worth... Now if you have the space, you could install a 30kw generator. That could provide significant range, but to some extent defeats the electric concept.

These vehicles are VERY inefficient. Portal axles, transfer case, air brakes, big tires, poor aero, big mirrors. All combine to reduce range.

 

[shade]

The Volt was a typical GM cluster. Good riddance.

Toyota and Honda have a good handle on hybrid cars. The Prius is a reliable car, but drives like a refrigerator. The new Insight handles as well as the typical Honda, and doesn't scream, "Look at me! I'm driving a hybrid!" After a few weak attempts, Honda finally has a real competitor to the Prius, and I hope they capitalize on it.

Electric trucks & buses have an advantage over EV cars due to their superior cargo space & load capacities. An electric Mog could be done, but the major disadvantage would be recharging it away from home base. If you look at how heavy EV fleets are used, they require significant electrical infrastructure to recharge their large batteries during downtime at a central hub. As the OP mentioned, creating one as a showcase for new tech wouldn't be a problem, but stringing together a lengthy trip would mean significant delays waiting for it to charge. The best way to access power would be to utilize the Tesla Supercharger network, but I don't think Tesla allows non-Tesla vehicles to access the stations.

 

[erstwild]

Thanks all for indulging me on this and for all the great feedback right out of the gate! Indeed, a Unimog in particular would be a particularly ridiculous vehicle to attempt this with...which is part of the intrigue and appeal to me!

I'm trying to negotiate with the battery makers or would even build my own large metal/air battery to power this test mule vehicle:

Aluminium–air battery - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Negative? How a Navy veteran refused to accept a 'no' to his battery invention | TechCrunch

The journey for Trevor Jackson started, as many things do in tech, with research. He’d become fascinated by the experiments done not with lithium

techcrunch.com

Metalectrique Off-Grid Battery Systems | High Energy Batteries

Discover Metalectrique, a UK-based innovator in zero CO₂, high-energy Aluminium-Air technology. Since 2002, we have developed safe, recyclable, and affordable power solutions for road, sea, and air transport. Our cutting-edge technology offers long-range energy without the environmental impact...

www.metalectrique.com

Home - PHINERGY

DELIVERING CLEAN ENERGY ANYTIME, ANYWHERE Phinergy is a leading pioneer in metal-air technology, turning metals into a new way to store, transport and generate clean and safe energy Phinergy’s aluminum-air and zinc-air technology provide clean energy generation and storage solutions for a...

www.phinergy.com

Basically, picture 1000+ mile range from light, cheap, and easily recyclable materials. I understand why lithium ion commercialization has taken off the way it has, but I am also convinced it has been sucking the air and investment out of room for other compelling alternatives.

So it sounds like the best option would be to find something like a 404 406 or U1000 (or any other models that might be particularly suitable)?

What would folks think about this electric motor? :

AC-50 / AC-51 AC Induction Motor Drive Kit

<p><span style="font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">These custom-wound AC induction motors can produce an amazing amount of power and torque at excellent levels of efficiency. Some of the benefits of an AC induction motor are a longer power band,

www.electricmotorsport.com

The AC-51 has 88 hp and 108 ft/lb of torque. This vehicle doesn't need to be any faster than a standard mog.

As a sidebar, it has been interesting to find companies rebuilding land cruisers as electric vehicles for underground mining applications:

Tembo 4x4 e-LV, the New Standard in mining mobility based on Toyota Land Cruiser & Hilux

The Electric Cruiser & Electric HLX for the future in underground mining mobility based on the Toyota Land Cruiser 70 series and Toyota Hilux

www.tembo4x4-elv.com

 

[greg.potter]

Thanks all for indulging me on this and for all the great feedback right out of the gate! Indeed, a Unimog in particular would be a particularly ridiculous vehicle to attempt this with...which is part of the intrigue and appeal to me!

I'm trying to negotiate with the battery makers or would even build my own large metal/air battery to power this test mule vehicle:

Aluminium–air battery - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

Negative? How a Navy veteran refused to accept a 'no' to his battery invention | TechCrunch

The journey for Trevor Jackson started, as many things do in tech, with research. He’d become fascinated by the experiments done not with lithium

techcrunch.com

Metalectrique Off-Grid Battery Systems | High Energy Batteries

Discover Metalectrique, a UK-based innovator in zero CO₂, high-energy Aluminium-Air technology. Since 2002, we have developed safe, recyclable, and affordable power solutions for road, sea, and air transport. Our cutting-edge technology offers long-range energy without the environmental impact...

www.metalectrique.com

Home - PHINERGY

DELIVERING CLEAN ENERGY ANYTIME, ANYWHERE Phinergy is a leading pioneer in metal-air technology, turning metals into a new way to store, transport and generate clean and safe energy Phinergy’s aluminum-air and zinc-air technology provide clean energy generation and storage solutions for a...

www.phinergy.com

Basically, picture 1000+ mile range from light, cheap, and easily recyclable materials. I understand why lithium ion commercialization has taken off the way it has, but I am also convinced it has been sucking the air and investment out of room for other compelling alternatives.

So it sounds like the best option would be to find something like a 406 or U1000 (or any other models that might be particularly suitable)?

What would folks think about this electric motor? :

AC-50 / AC-51 AC Induction Motor Drive Kit

<p><span style="font-family: Arial, Helvetica, sans-serif;">These custom-wound AC induction motors can produce an amazing amount of power and torque at excellent levels of efficiency. Some of the benefits of an AC induction motor are a longer power band,

www.electricmotorsport.com

The AC-51 has 88 hp and 108 ft/lb of torque. This vehicle doesn't need to be any faster than a standard mog.

As a sidebar, it has been interesting to find companies rebuilding land cruisers as electric vehicles for underground mining applications:

Tembo 4x4 e-LV, the New Standard in mining mobility based on Toyota Land Cruiser & Hilux

The Electric Cruiser & Electric HLX for the future in underground mining mobility based on the Toyota Land Cruiser 70 series and Toyota Hilux

www.tembo4x4-elv.com

70 series Landcruisers have been use in underground potash mining applications in Canada for many years.

 

[NatersXJ6]

You can choose your own level of difficulty depending on the number of features you want. My grandfather built a fully electric truck by doing a conversion almost 25 years ago. It can be very simple. The lions share of cost is in batteries.

There is an electric vehicle builders association out there. Should be easy to google. I think there newsletter is called Current EVents.

 

[pairospam]

erstwild:

I would have been pretty happy too if my rig was moved by electric motors, one per axle, powered only by father Sun around the globe.

I did the maths a few years ago with the batteries and the engines available at that moment and more recently, including all the progresses there have been on that matter. Unfortunately the counts don't turn. For something that big and heavy and with the aerodynamics of a wall electrics is not the answer.

Would love to see if you end up with something interesting, though.

Good luck.


Pairoa