Antishanty Carrying Capacity

[chuckburt28]

I'm wondering if any owners or anyone else on here might have a good explanation as to why it seems The Antishanty RR-1 has a carrying capacity higher than their GVWR? They claim both on their website and in their newest RR1 video that their limited model has a dry weight of about 2800 lbs, and a "gear" carrying capacity of 1,000 lbs, but the GVWR is only 3500 lbs. Is there something I don't understand about GVWR? This is an honest question, not meant for criticism, as these trailers have a lot going for them, I just don't understand how the gear capacity is more than the GVWR. If you only look at the website, it's logical they are saying that if you get a lower trim level, the dry weight is lower so you'll have more carrying capacity (but still not 1,000 lbs on the limited). Their video seems to go against that though, as he states 2800 lb dry weight plus 1,000 lb gear capacity at the 6:25 mark. I'd appreciate anyone's thoughts.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

Your understanding of GVWR is correct. They're providing ranges, which makes this (potentially intentionally) confusing, and yes, their numbers do not add up.

With GVWR of 3500lbs, the total weight of the trailer cannot exceed 3500lbs.

If their trailer comes in at 1900lbs dry (given the trim/options selected), then you have 3500-1900 = 1600lbs. They're claiming up to 1500lbs of gear capacity, likely because that 1900lb weight is not exact.

If their trailer comes in at 3000lbs dry, then the gear capacity will be 500lbs.

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

Most small craft builders often post inaccurate dementions and weights on there websites. Don't forget gwr is actual weight so 3,500 plus deverted tounge weight so 3,500 is more like 3,800 if the trailer has a 300 pound tongue weight

 

[chuckburt28]

Most small craft builders often post inaccurate dementions and weights on there websites. Don't forget gwr is actual weight so 3,500 plus deverted tounge weight so 3,500 is more like 3,800 if the trailer has a 300 pound tongue weight

I did forget about this. Essentially the theory is that you're supporting some of the trailer weight on the tongue, so you can add that back into the carrying capacity. My question would be, would a weigh station or police officer feel the same way? If I am forced to weigh it, and I added (tongue weight) lbs to the trailer worth of stuff so that it weighs 3800 lbs, will I have to detach it before weighing it or will they weigh it attached to the truck so that the scale will show 3500 or less?

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

I did forget about this. Essentially the theory is that you're supporting some of the trailer weight on the tongue, so you can add that back into the carrying capacity. My question would be, would a weigh station or police officer feel the same way? If I am forced to weigh it, and I added (tongue weight) lbs to the trailer worth of stuff so that it weighs 3800 lbs, will I have to detach it before weighing it or will they weigh it attached to the truck so that the scale will show 3500 or less?

Best case senirio is ask anti shanty to print 3,800 gwr on tounge sticker. I would assume the weight that is in the trailer and on the suspension (and brakes ) of said trailer while attached to tow vehicle is what should be compared to gwr of trailer. You could always roll with a tongue scale. What's your tow vehicle? I have the same situation on mine. Thinking of going with 5,000 pound Timbrens elostomers in a few years. Won't change the rating but make me feel better creeping to 4k

https://www.etrailer.com/Tongue-Weight-Scale/Big-Truck-Big-RV/BTBRV44FR.html?feed=npn&gad_source=1&gclid=CjwKCAiAm-67BhBlEiwAEVftNu5hy5ZqSoDG13xag00-0jIaA0GQcjNaQ5ET7zU_9e1OFU8BKPfKdhoCZNIQAvD_BwE

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

Sorry Chuck senior moment as we have chatted. Still have the Colorado?

Really like the Antishanty. Wish it were wider to have wet bath options.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

Don't forget gwr is actual weight so 3,500 plus deverted tounge weight so 3,500 is more like 3,800 if the trailer has a 300 pound tongue weight

That's not correct. You're thinking of Gross Axle Weight Rating.

GVWR is the maximum weight that vehicle (trailer) is allowed to be. Period. How you distribute that weight (between weight on the axles and weight on the tow vehicle's tongue) is not relevant to the GVWR. The cumulative amount cannot exceed the GVWR.

You do have the axle ratings to think about, and THAT is where weight distribution can play a role (theoretical example: 3000lb axle rating, 500lb tongue weight, 3500lb GVWR trailer).

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

I stand corrected. If a trailer is 2,500 pounds dry then has 1,000 pounds of cargo it weighs 3,500 pounds sitting on a level ground unhitched. I just assumed that tounge weight that transfers to tow vehicle would take that 350 pounds off the suspension, chassis and braking that are considered in determining gvwr. That's what I get for assuming.

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

I guess what confused me is all the trailers I know most about and or the one I own have Timbrens. So I assumed the 3500 HD Timbrens that go on several different types of trailers have the same 3,500 pounds gvwr and axel rating. Taxa Mantis has Timbren 5200 HD and the gvwr is 5,200 as well. This does not seem to be the case with cruismaster and other trailing arm suspension.

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

Now I am really confused. I checked Boreas and Kingdom Camping and they both list the published axel weight rating of the cruismaster suspension as the gvwr of the trailer. I wonder if most builders don't really do much engineering to determine gvwr they just list the axel weight rating.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

Yes, most trailers list GVWR as the sum of their axle ratings. The axles tend to be the weakest spot as far as weight carrying capacity goes, so manufacturers just default to that rating.

If the axles/suspension were to be significantly overbuilt, then manufacturers would have to get into frame capabilities, braking capabilities, and all kinds of other technical details that they don't want to bother with. They would also - potentially - assume legal liability for the rating, vs. simply being able to shove it on the axle manufacturer.

The only instance I can think of where the GVWR is different than what the suspension is rated for, is Roam Resillient. They rate their suspension at 13,000lbs, but the GVWR is set at 9,000lbs. This suggests that the suspension is not the weakest link, and that they've done the engineering work across all their components to actually understand what can handle what. That's very rare in the trailer business.

As for the run of the mill trailers, they are often a crapshoot. Here's an example from my 2022 2108FBS Winnebago:

In the years leading up to about the 2021 model year (or even into early 2022), this trailer came with dual 3500lb axles and had a GVWR of 7000lbs. Weighing in at about 4400lbs dry, it had a relatively massive cargo capacity.

At some point in 2019-2021~ish, a series of the axles used on this trailer started failing. Rather than fixing the issues and using different axles, Winnebago went in a different route: they lowered the GVWR of the trailer, and the trailer manufacturer started putting different rating stickers on the same axles. The 3500lb axles now started coming with a sticker that says 3000lb. As far as I know, it's the same exact axle, but now rated lower. The 7000lb GVWR also went down, all the way to 5500lb. Nothing else changed.

We know (from the prior years) that the frame, brakes, and everything else can handle 7000lb GVWR, because there were no issues with these components. The axles were questionable, and got their rating dropped. Why is the trailer suddenly rated 500lbs under the total axle capacity? The only reason I can come up with is that Winnebago is simply covering their ******, so they don't have to pay out on potential warranty repairs or lawsuits. IMO this is a sleazy move to pull, but not a surprising one.

My trailer was manufactured in August of 2022. I have paperwork (including the dealer's ad) that shows it as having 7000lb GVWR, and stickers on the trailer itself that show 5500lb. A circus all around.

 

[chuckburt28]

This is all very intriguing, and I appreciate all the info and responses. I do still have the Colorado, and I would recommend another look at the Antishanty RR1, as they now offer a makeshift indoor bathroom, that does require a little setup. Still not bad though. My concerns seem to be legitimate, though, unfortunately. They have added a lot to their base models to make the limited model, which is the only one I would consider with all the extra storage and features. Unfortunately, with their 3500 lb rating, that now gives very little room to carry anything, which was a selling point to begin with. What a bummer, I think these are really neat.

I really appreciate the story on the Winnebago, this is very helpful, and I am also not surprised. I don't think a lot of people really pay attention to all of these numbers when buying any kind of camping trailer. Our current camper is a Jayco 154BH. While still searching for trailers last year, we actually signed for another 154BH Baja edition that ended up weighing more than anticipated, and we had to back out. That's where some of this learning took place. The sticker on the side said dry weight of 3100 lbs, GVWR said 3500. That left 400 lbs. The salesperson told me the 3100 lbs was after it was loaded with a lot of stuff, I did some quick research, that was what it weighed leaving the factory. I had to back out as I needed more than 400 lbs of carrying capacity. We then found another one a few states away that weighed 2700 with 3500 GVWR. A lot of new camping trailers only give you 400, 300, sometimes even less CCC, which is concerning to me.

 

[eatSleepWoof]

A lot of new camping trailers only give you 400, 300, sometimes even less CCC, which is concerning to me.

You're right to be concerned. 400lbs of cargo capacity makes the trailer completely useless.

An average 30 gallon water tank will take up 250lbs of that capacity right off the bat.

 

[Obsessed2findARuggedHybid]

Have you asked AntiShanty if they could go with 5200 pound Timbrens and maybe rate there trailer to 5k gvwr? I love my Trail Marker so not looking to go with anything new for a while. The AntiShanty is just to narrow. I believe the fendars are 7' 6" so the interior width must be 5.25 feet. I couldn't do my morning yoga in one 😉 Baffled why they build it so narrow. I guess for narrow off road use but we live in the West not New Hampshire.