ARB Locker Wiring & Plumbing

[RoundOut]

Another possible solution???

I am going to be installing lockers next week, and presently have a 110/145 pressure switch/relay for my VIAIR system, with a 4 gallon tank. I was preparing to order some regulators, but with tubing already run front to rear, I had another idea I wanted to run by this group after reading the title of this thread.

I skimmed most of this thread from the beginning, and it appears to have evolved from a question of whether to order the ARB compressor and how much stuff comes with the lockers, to a comparison of compressors, to finding and solving leaks. Here's my twist on the original question...

I am considering purchasing a second pressure/relay switch, which would be connected in series in the air system, but the two pressure switches would be driven by a DPST switch [I think that is the right kind, one that has a common power feed and two separate but mutually exlusive circuits it activates, (#1 ON) - (OFF) - (#2 ON) ]. When driving, I would use the lower pressure, up to 105 psi switch, and when using the system to air tires, I would use the 145 psi switch.

Any comments/thoughts would be appreciated!


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[Nuclear Redneck]

The biggest thing to remember is that the ARB lockers do not do well with pressures higher than 105 psi (I think). There is a chance with your proposed setup that you could leave the lockers engaged, switch to the 145 to air up and then you might pop the seals on the lockers.

 

[RoundOut]

The biggest thing to remember is that the ARB lockers do not do well with pressures higher than 105 psi (I think). There is a chance with your proposed setup that you could leave the lockers engaged, switch to the 145 to air up and then you might pop the seals on the lockers.

I think I could live with that since I will be the only one using it. I could even wire it up so that when the higher pressure switch is in use, it "disables" the lockers. That would be easy to do with the right switch or relay.


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[grillmasterp]

I am going to be installing lockers next week, a

I highly recommend using a 90 degree fitting instead of a straight fitting coming out of the Front Diff (RD90 application)

3/16 compression fitting elbow to connect the blue airline to the front diff

 

[michaelgroves]

I was preparing to order some regulators

To me, this seems a better way of doing it. Simpler, less prone to mistakes. And not inordinately expensive either.

 

[ntsqd]

To me, this seems a better way of doing it. Simpler, less prone to mistakes. And not inordinately expensive either.

My thinking exactly. Put the thinking & effort in up front so that when you're brain-dead tired you haven't left a trap for yourself.

 

[madizell]

The biggest thing to remember is that the ARB lockers do not do well with pressures higher than 105 psi (I think). There is a chance with your proposed setup that you could leave the lockers engaged, switch to the 145 to air up and then you might pop the seals on the lockers.

Most of the ad blurbs for ARB reference pressures from 95 to 115psi. I have been using 115 for years now with no issues from front or rear locker. If ARB thinks you should not go above 115, I would definitely not use 145psi. Throttle it down with a good regulator or cut-off switch. Using a regulator and gauge lets you run the overall system at 145 or whatever, with only the ARB lines regulated to 95 or so, so you don't have to worry about switching back and forth or forgetting to change pressure back to low for the lockers. I just leave my entire system at 115 and have no problems airing tires, and likely would have no problems if I left it at 95psi for that matter.

 

[RoundOut]

Most of the ad blurbs for ARB reference pressures from 95 to 115psi. I have been using 115 for years now with no issues from front or rear locker. If ARB thinks you should not go above 115, I would definitely not use 145psi. Throttle it down with a good regulator or cut-off switch. Using a regulator and gauge lets you run the overall system at 145 or whatever, with only the ARB lines regulated to 95 or so, so you don't have to worry about switching back and forth or forgetting to change pressure back to low for the lockers. I just leave my entire system at 115 and have no problems airing tires, and likely would have no problems if I left it at 95psi for that matter.

The problem with regulators, at least as my experience has shown, is that when left idle, the pressure on the LP side of the regulator will adjust to the pressure on the HP side. I have scuba tanks and a hook-a-rig with a tire inflator that I used all the time for airing up bike tires, etc. One time, my son left the main valve open, and it blew the seals on the hook-a-rig. I figure, the same could happen with my lockers, and it's way more expensive to fix. With the approach I am planning, my "ambient" system pressure will be for the lockers, with the higher pressure used only when airing up tires.

So, could this NOT happen with my locker seals? If left engaged for a long time, the LP side of the regulator could creep up to 145, couldn't it?

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[michaelgroves]

The problem with regulators, at least as my experience has shown, is that when left idle, the pressure on the LP side of the regulator will adjust to the pressure on the HP side. I have scuba tanks and a hook-a-rig with a tire inflator that I used all the time for airing up bike tires, etc. One time, my son left the main valve open, and it blew the seals on the hook-a-rig. I figure, the same could happen with my lockers, and it's way more expensive to fix. With the approach I am planning, my "ambient" system pressure will be for the lockers, with the higher pressure used only when airing up tires.

So, could this NOT happen with my locker seals? If left engaged for a long time, the LP side of the regulator could creep up to 145, could'nt it?

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I don't think it's likely! Pneumatics are used for all kinds of critical applications, and any half-decent regulator should hold pressure (within spec.) indefinitely.I suspect the problem you experienced might stem from the fact that scuba tanks run at extreme pressures. Most regulators are only designed to cut pressures accurately by a maximum factor of 10 or so. If you want to reduce pressure from 100 bar down to 1 bar, you'd generally use two regulators, one down to 10 bar, and then from there down to 1 bar.

 

[teotwaki]

Most of the ad blurbs for ARB reference pressures from 95 to 115psi. I have been using 115 for years now with no issues from front or rear locker. If ARB thinks you should not go above 115, I would definitely not use 145psi. Throttle it down with a good regulator or cut-off switch. Using a regulator and gauge lets you run the overall system at 145 or whatever, with only the ARB lines regulated to 95 or so, so you don't have to worry about switching back and forth or forgetting to change pressure back to low for the lockers. I just leave my entire system at 115 and have no problems airing tires, and likely would have no problems if I left it at 95psi for that matter.

I am also building up a system for my upcoming rear locker as well as tire inflation. I called ARB about their pressure switch and was told that it turns on around 80 PSI and off around 100 PSI

 

[madizell]

80/100 works fine. Line pressure is not what inflates tires anyway, but rather reserve volume or, when that runs out, CFM output at the pressure of the tire you are inflating. Since we don't run tires at 80psi or even close, it should not be an issue to regulate your entire system to the lower pressures needed to run the lockers.

I agree that a reasonably good regulator is not going to be an issue as to leakage. All of the systems I have leak down, not up, even on things like welding tanks, and unless you have a really tight on board air system, it will probably lose pressure when parked for extended periods. When in use, since the pump does not run continuously anyway, over pressure shouldn't be a concern.

Sounds to me as if your regulator was leaking. The cheapie I installed in my Jeep nearly 7 years ago has lived in dust and dirt all this time without failure and without need of maintenance, but I don't run the vehicle with the on board system pressurized unless I expect to use the lockers right away. An ARB pump not plumbed to a larger reserve tank is going to pressurize the ARB system so fast you won't even notice it. I wouldn't personally plumb one to a large reserve tank because it is akin to blowing up a 6 man life raft with a mouth tube.

 

[RoundOut]

Great discussion, guys!

Thanks for your input fellas. I really appreciate it. My 4 gallon tank, at 145 psi versus 105 psi, is only about a third more air. (At 105 is is 72% volume versus 145.) I may just go ahead and use the existing wiring and replace my higher pressure relay with the lower pressure one already ordered. That would be a piece of cake and save a bunch of time, not to mention leaving a switch free for another application and eliminating the need for a relay. I could always add it back in if needed later, but this will simplify the issue.

Great discussion. I love this board.


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[RoundOut]

I highly recommend using a 90 degree fitting instead of a straight fitting coming out of the Front Diff (RD90 application)

3/16 compression fitting elbow to connect the blue airline to the front diff

Since I have not seen them installed, what is the improvement in the elbow method? Is the air line plumbed to the side or bottom of the diff, or is it up to the user?

T.I.A.

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[grillmasterp]

Since I have not seen them installed, what is the improvement in the elbow method? Is the air line plumbed to the side or bottom of the diff, or is it up to the user?
T.I.A.
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Its all about clearance-
ultimately- Its up to you on the location of the hole you drill in the the diff for the connection of the air supply-
The bulkhead fitting coming out may not allow ample clearance of the blue airline connector & spring.

With the standard straight fitting - It positions the blue airline fitting very close to the bottom of the oil pan. THe spring may contact the pan.

Instead of a straight fitting coming out of a diff- a 90 degree elbow will provide a better exit for the line.

Straight fitting results in the exiting airline to be perpendicular to the diff
90 fitting coming out of the diff results in the airline to be parallel to the diff

Go through the ARB install instructions, then go underneath the truck to see the best location to tap the diff

 

[madizell]

Using a 90 coming out of the diff places the air line close to the housing instead of out in harm's way. Not a bad idea. A small metal guard in the area also will protect the elbow from contact and is usually easy to do.

If you have the lower pressure switch coming, I would try that and see if you think is is sufficient before doing anything else. It is always a compromise with an air system because airing tires is so different from charging lockers. Depends on which you think is more important. I have an ARB pump plumbed to the locker system, and an on-board air system that works side-by-side with a cross-over hose. I can bridge the air system to the lockers and it works a lot faster and will re-lock far more often without a pump running than using the ARB, but requires that I throttle back on the on-board air system. When the air system is bridged, the ARB pump never runs. Have used it both ways for a long time now and prefer using the on-board air to run the lockers simply because I prefer having the lockers lock up right now in preference to having a slightly faster tire airing system.